Did God Create Sin?

[ViperaRex]

Okay, Christians will usually say, "no, God did not create sin, it was Adam & Eve/ the Serpent, who created sin. They say; "God created the conditions through which sin might be born, but he himself did not create sin". This argument might make sense if God couldn't see the future, but according to the bible, he can, rendering this argument absolutely ridiculous, let me give you an analogy:

I Am a scientist,one day I become bored, I decide to create an experiment for my amusement, however, I know that conducting this particular experiment will release a toxic gas that will spread and kill everything within a 5 mile radius, This isn't the main point of the experiment, but it is a byproduct I know will occur. I strap on a gas mask, shrug, and do it anyway. Sure enough, the gas is released, and thousands of of people die. Surely I would be blamed for it, as I knew it would happen but did it anyway, would you defend me and say; "Hey, he didn't create the gas, he simply created the conditions in which that gas might be created, but he didn't make it". Of course you wouldn't, that makes no sense.

God didn't say, "Let there be sin", but he created it by creating the right conditions and allowing it to happen.

And thus, how can he be angry at us for sinning, when it is not really our fault that we sin, if he had not created the conditions for sin, it would not exist.

So, my question is, did God create sin?, if you believe "no", please justify it in light of all this

[dianaiad]

Yes if your could produce the ad hominem I'd appreciate it. BTW asking a very valid question of the challenged who is lashing out asininely doesn't demonstrate anything about that particular rant, but each to his own fantasies.

Nobody can say I didn't give this an honest try.

Plonk.

[ttruscott]

[Replying to post 47 by kegger]

viper, the main point is that god wanted us to be free willed beings in his image and likeness

Well no. Not according to your holy book. This god character wanted (and still wants) good little obedient robots. He just wasn't smart enough to make them. But allegedly he's gonna have another go after he's killed them all. Bit of a desert spoon really, isn't he.

GOD wanted to create a Church, a congregation of people in full loving, holy communion with HIM in heaven BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO BE THERE WITH HIM IN THAT REALITY! They must have truly wanted love, holiness and heaven as HE defines it.

When He asked who would like that, some accepted HIM and became chosen to become church members and others rejected HIS offer and forever became unable to ever fulfill HIS offer, fit only to be discarded.

Everything is working out perfectly, HIS sinful chosen ones are being redeemed and taught how to become the Church members they chose to be (before choosing sin) and the rebellious are being prepared for their eternal separation by death.

So you almost got it but missed the mark.

Peace, Ted

[ttruscott]

...

Free will is the reason for sin. In heaven you are sinless.

...

Sin was caused by free will but that does not prove that the sinlessness of heaven is therefore caused by no free will.

Sinlessness is / was also be caused by the true free will decision to be and to remain sinless.

Peace, Ted

[ttruscott]

...


So , since God is so perfect, why did he create us so we would sin?

Being able to make decisions doesn't mean we have the potential for sin. That claim is just plain silly.

I am told being able to sin is because of 'Free Will.' WHy did God create free will?>

GOD wanted to create a Church, a congregation of people in full loving, holy communion with HIM in heaven BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO BE THERE WITH HIM IN THAT REALITY! They must have truly wanted love, holiness and heaven as HE defines it.

The true free will decision to accept HIS offer to join HIS church made us elect, chosen to heaven and the true free will decision to reject HIS offer and seek our eternal happiness elsewhere put us outside of HIS offer forever (as not wanting to ever fulfill it).

That is how decision making leads to sin.

That is why GOD allowed free will, ie kept all coercion and constraints away from our decision making.

Peace, Ted

[ttruscott]

...

.......and I don't particularly care whether you agree with me or not. That's my belief. We are here, in this world, for schooling and for testing...to see what we are 'made of.'

It's...boot camp.
Or college.
Or grade school.
Or SAT tests.
Or the GRE.

Whatever metaphor you like, this life was meant for us to LEARN from, and grow from. We can't do that if we can't screw up.

I particularly like the earth as a rehab centre for HIS sinful elect. They come sick and evil and leave well and holy...

Tests are only to teach them how strong their commitment is or is not to holiness.

Peace, Ted

[southern cross]

...

Free will is the reason for sin. In heaven you are sinless.

...

Sin was caused by free will but that does not prove that the sinlessness of heaven is therefore caused by no free will.

Sinlessness is / was also be caused by the true free will decision to be and to remain sinless.

Peace, Ted

So you must be sinless, or haven't you made the choice to remain sinless?

[southern cross]

...


So , since God is so perfect, why did he create us so we would sin?

Being able to make decisions doesn't mean we have the potential for sin. That claim is just plain silly.

I am told being able to sin is because of 'Free Will.' WHy did God create free will?>

GOD wanted to create a Church, a congregation of people in full loving, holy communion with HIM in heaven BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO BE THERE WITH HIM IN THAT REALITY! They must have truly wanted love, holiness and heaven as HE defines it.

So why didn't he do it? Surely an omnipotent entity can create whatever it wants.

[East of Eden]

[Replying to post 3 by ViperaRex]

A sin is not a mistake. You cut 6 feet instead of 8 feet that's a mistake.

You make something perfect and it turns out not to be perfect is not a sin.
It's a mistake.

Did God make a mistake?

The word that is translated from the Greek as sin, comes from a word which literally means to fall short of the mark, particularly in archery. Sin includes every time you do not achieve all that you could have done; every time that the outcome is exceeded by the expectation. God sinned in creating humans if we don't live up to His expectations.

Huh? Adam and Eve had no responsibility?

[southern cross]

[Replying to post 3 by ViperaRex]

A sin is not a mistake. You cut 6 feet instead of 8 feet that's a mistake.

You make something perfect and it turns out not to be perfect is not a sin.
It's a mistake.

Did God make a mistake?

The word that is translated from the Greek as sin, comes from a word which literally means to fall short of the mark, particularly in archery. Sin includes every time you do not achieve all that you could have done; every time that the outcome is exceeded by the expectation. God sinned in creating humans if we don't live up to His expectations.

Huh? Adam and Eve had no responsibility?

Please produce the passages that show god teaching A&E responsibility
Where he taught them about obedience and disobedience
Where he taught them about right and wrong
Where he taught them about good and evil.

[East of Eden]

[Replying to post 3 by ViperaRex]

A sin is not a mistake. You cut 6 feet instead of 8 feet that's a mistake.

You make something perfect and it turns out not to be perfect is not a sin.
It's a mistake.

Did God make a mistake?

The word that is translated from the Greek as sin, comes from a word which literally means to fall short of the mark, particularly in archery. Sin includes every time you do not achieve all that you could have done; every time that the outcome is exceeded by the expectation. God sinned in creating humans if we don't live up to His expectations.

Huh? Adam and Eve had no responsibility?

Please produce the passages that show god teaching A&E responsibility
Where he taught them about obedience and disobedience
Where he taught them about right and wrong
Where he taught them about good and evil.

Gen 2:16 And the Lord God commanded the man, You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.