ONE TRUE CHURCH

cdasero · Post by **cdasero** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 9:10 am

There is only ONE TRUE CHURCH and the Head is Our Lord Jesus Christ.

cdasero · Post by **cdasero** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:42 pm

[Replying to post 10 by Danmark]

For all the individuals who believe in the bible as the base of the work of God and its existence and also accept Jesus Christ as the savior are cannot be called Christian base on the bible itself... there are many false prophet and religion in this world that the propecy predicted.

cdasero · Post by **cdasero** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:46 pm

[Replying to post 8 by Danmark]

Sorry for my mistakes. I thought it will be private if i reply to the message directly.

Divine Insight · Post by **Divine Insight** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:47 pm

Danmark wrote: Christians speak of the concept that each person must 'work out his own salvation.'

Actually there are many Christian denominations that would passionately reject this idea that anyone needs to "work out" their salvation. Many Christian churches hold that salvation is only given by the grace of God, and there is nothing anyone can do to "earn" salvation on their own merit.

In fact, if a person could work out their own salvation they would have no need for Jesus. So there are actually quite a few Christian churches and denominations that would passionately object to the idea that any man could 'work out' his own salvation.

This is especially true of any Pauline Christianity. Doesn't Paul or his supporters proclaim that no man can work out, or earn, his own salvation lest he would be able to boast in heaven, or something to that effect?

Yes, here it is:

Ephesians 2:
[8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
[9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

I believe that a lot of Christians take this very seriously and proclaim that no one can "work out" their salvation. It's entirely a gift of grace from God that must be accepted through Jesus the Christ.

There is no other way to obtain it.

But as you say, there are clearly those who protest against Ephesians too, so clearly there is not just ONE CHURCH.

Freddy_Scissorhands · Post by **Freddy_Scissorhands** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:39 pm

Danmark wrote:
Freddy_Scissorhands wrote: Actually, if there was a real god, you would expect there to be only one church.
Or at least only one true church. One, that literally overshadows all the other churches, because it's so much better and has so much more truth to give.
The fact that there are so many churches, and the increase in number by splitting up all the time, until you have a mess of biblical propotions (pun intended) in front of you, is a very strong indicator, that none of them really has a monopoly on truth.

Which either means that there is no god, or that he doesn't care for any of the churches who claim to speak for him.
Tho' I agree there is some logic to this argument, and I have made similar claims myself, I think it is one of the weaker attacks on the existence of God.

Christians quite rightly argue that one definition, or at least one aspect of Christianity, is that it is a relationship with Jesus or God. Relationships are necessarily unique. We may each have a relationship with the same person, but each of those relationships is different. We should credit Christians with being individuals who can think for themselves. Why should every Christian have to fit perfectly into the same mold? If I recall correctly, some of our Jewish brethren here have made the point in Judaism each believer is accorded the right to his own belief and interpretation. Christians speak of the concept that each person must 'work out his own salvation.'

In short, I think the diversity of Christian churches and denominations may be a healthy thing. It is true that it is also evidence of ambiguity in their scriptures. My view is that 'God' does not exist and therefore speaks to no one. Rather, the unconscious mind is so very deep, complex and complicated that it is mistaken for God. This 'God' has a different message for everyone.

Your counter argument works... IF somebody isn't arguing for a god who wants you to fallow his very specific rules!
See, if you believe in a god who doesn't really mind that much, what specific rules you fallow, as long as you have a general relationship with him, then there is no problem with the fact that there are many different denominations.

BUT many of these denominations claim internally contradicting things which sometimes are requirements for the salvation of the believers.
If there is a god, and he has this very specific set of rules, than this would be unique, and clearly distinguishable from all the others.

Yes, a very general, and generous god isn't in contradiction with many different believe systems... but that's not the kind of god a majority of theists believe in.

Divine Insight · Post by **Divine Insight** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 9:12 pm

Freddy_Scissorhands wrote: Your counter argument works... IF somebody isn't arguing for a god who wants you to fallow his very specific rules!
See, if you believe in a god who doesn't really mind that much, what specific rules you fallow, as long as you have a general relationship with him, then there is no problem with the fact that there are many different denominations.

BUT many of these denominations claim internally contradicting things which sometimes are requirements for the salvation of the believers.
If there is a god, and he has this very specific set of rules, than this would be unique, and clearly distinguishable from all the others.

Yes, a very general, and generous god isn't in contradiction with many different believe systems... but that's not the kind of god a majority of theists believe in.

I tend to agree with this line of thinking.

The Bible is filled with "Thou Shalts" and "Thou Shalt Nots". And they seem to be pretty darn specific.

It seems to me for this religion to end up having a large diversity of disagreeing "Thou Shalts" and "Thou Shalt Nots" in divisive denominations is simply not compatible with the original thesis.

And I think this becomes even more important when we consider words attributed to Jesus:

Matt.5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

This doesn't leave a lot of room for these Christan denominations to have disagreeing jots and tittles.

Post by **otseng** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 10:39 pm

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kimberlygretchen · Post by **kimberlygretchen** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 5:34 pm

[Replying to cdasero]

cdasero: "there are many false prophet and religion in this world that the propecy predicted"

How can one be sure that Jesus of Nazareth is not a false prophet, or that Christianity is not a misguided religion?

cdasero · Post by **cdasero** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:20 pm

[Replying to kimberlygretchen]

Because being a true Christian and a member of the ONE TRUE CHURCH are not just a believer They have the Ultimate Faith in GOD the Father and to his Son Jesus Christ as the Mediator and the Head of the Church.

kimberlygretchen · Post by **kimberlygretchen** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:35 pm

[Replying to post 18 by cdasero]

cdasero: "They have the Ultimate Faith in GOD the Father and to his Son Jesus Christ as the Mediator and the Head of the Church"

So it is strictly a matter of faith, without any concrete evidence?

cdasero · Post by **cdasero** » Sat Oct 25, 2014 6:44 pm

[Replying to post 19 by kimberlygretchen]

The Holy Scriptures is the source and all the prophecy written on it.
I hope you have the absolute faith on it?

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