? A Question For All Former Christians Who Fell Away ?

[YahDough]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.

Why did you become a Christian?
[/b]

[YahDough]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.
Why did you become a Christian?
[/b]

I was brought up Catholic, I never choose to be one. I'd wager that's true for a vast majority of people.

I think I agree. Without a personal commitment and some kind of a "born-again" experience how could a person honestly declare themselves a "Christian Believer"? That would just be lip service.

That isn’t accurate. I know many who were born into the faith and are absolutely true believers. One studied to be in the seminary, and while he never did become a priest, he is without a doubt fully Christian.

So you, a non-Christian are an expert on what a Christian is, huh? I don't buy it. Christ Jesus said "You must be born again". That implies some sort of catharsis into the faith to receive the Holy Ghost Teacher of all truth.

A desire to learn about science and the origins of life, coupled with common sense quickly erased any hold religion had on me.

"Common sense" is too limiting.

How so?

Metaphysics deals with uncommon sense, a more interesting study to me.

Why would religion suddenly be exempt from the use of common sense?

Did I say that? NO! I said "Common sense is too limiting". I know with God all things are possible and that is a "science" (knowledge) worthy to explore.

But science and Christianity can be a good mix. I consider Jesus Christ the Science of everlasting life. He is the King of metaphysics, my favorite science. I am inspired by His declaration.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

[Divine Insight]

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

But science does understand the knowledge you posted. We understand that it's nothing more than false claims made by superstitious people.

The evidence is in, thanks to history.

Have we ever seen any reports of anyone doing greater works than Jesus?

The Christians would be the first to scream that no one has ever done greater works than Jesus!

So there you go. Then, either Jesus was a liar. OR no one has ever truly believed on Jesus for over 2000 years, since no one has ever done greater works than Jesus. OR, science is right and the whole thing is just superstitious fables that have no merit.

History and a little common sense suggests that science is right.

[KenRU]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.
Why did you become a Christian?
[/b]

I was brought up Catholic, I never choose to be one. I'd wager that's true for a vast majority of people.

I think I agree. Without a personal commitment and some kind of a "born-again" experience how could a person honestly declare themselves a "Christian Believer"? That would just be lip service.

That isn’t accurate. I know many who were born into the faith and are absolutely true believers. One studied to be in the seminary, and while he never did become a priest, he is without a doubt fully Christian.

So you, a non-Christian are an expert on what a Christian is, huh? I don't buy it. Christ Jesus said "You must be born again". That implies some sort of catharsis into the faith to receive the Holy Ghost Teacher of all truth.

I was Catholic up until my early to mid 20’s. So yes, I think it’s safe to say that I know which of my family and friends are true believers and which ones are not.

This is not an argument over which version of Christian is the real one. If so, your post never made that clear. Catholics by definition are Christians.

Why would religion suddenly be exempt from the use of common sense?

Did I say that? NO! I said "Common sense is too limiting". I know with God all things are possible and that is a "science" (knowledge) worthy to explore.

Please cite an example how you know that “all things are possible�. Something observable, testable or reproducible please, as that would show that you are employing science correctly.

But science and Christianity can be a good mix. I consider Jesus Christ the Science of everlasting life. He is the King of metaphysics, my favorite science. I am inspired by His declaration.

If science and Christianity are a good mix, how do you feel about evolution? This is one of the many factors that showed me how unbelievable and anti-common-sense religion was.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

Is your statement testable? Reproducible? Falsifiable? Observable? In what context is that science?

[YahDough]

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

But science does understand the knowledge you posted. We understand that it's nothing more than false claims made by superstitious people.

Contemporary science hardly has a clue to the realities of Christ.

Have we ever seen any reports of anyone doing greater works than Jesus?

There are recorded instances and testimonies of miracles similar to what Christ did. The disciples did miracles after Christ was taken up. In addition, organ transplants, and other advances in medicine and technology also have happened. But I will admit that the Church has not been on top of the power of God through Christ because of disbelief. I hope and expect that to change soon.

So there you go. Then, either Jesus was a liar. OR no one has ever truly believed on Jesus for over 2000 years, since no one has ever done greater works than Jesus.

Or you haven't witnessed any miracles and would most likely deny any ones that you heard about.

History and a little common sense suggests that science is right.

History and a little uncommon sense suggests that the LORD can make, break or alter any scientific rules He has created.

[YahDough]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.
Why did you become a Christian?
[/b]

I was brought up Catholic, I never choose to be one. I'd wager that's true for a vast majority of people.

I think I agree. Without a personal commitment and some kind of a "born-again" experience how could a person honestly declare themselves a "Christian Believer"? That would just be lip service.

That isn’t accurate. I know many who were born into the faith and are absolutely true believers. One studied to be in the seminary, and while he never did become a priest, he is without a doubt fully Christian.

So you, a non-Christian are an expert on what a Christian is, huh? I don't buy it. Christ Jesus said "You must be born again". That implies some sort of catharsis into the faith to receive the Holy Ghost Teacher of all truth.

I was Catholic up until my early to mid 20’s. So yes, I think it’s safe to say that I know which of my family and friends are true believers and which ones are not.

This is not an argument over which version of Christian is the real one. If so, your post never made that clear. Catholics by definition are Christians.

That's not exactly true. I've asked people if they were Christians. They have hesitated for a moment and said..."no, I'm a Catholic". A true Christian is a disciple of Christ. Catholic just means "universal".

Why would religion suddenly be exempt from the use of common sense?

Did I say that? NO! I said "Common sense is too limiting". I know with God all things are possible and that is a "science" (knowledge) worthy to explore.

Please cite an example how you know that “all things are possible�. Something observable, testable or reproducible please, as that would show that you are employing science correctly.

I know by faith. It is the confidence we have in what we believe. I know it is true because Jesus said it.

But science and Christianity can be a good mix. I consider Jesus Christ the Science of everlasting life. He is the King of metaphysics, my favorite science. I am inspired by His declaration.

If science and Christianity are a good mix, how do you feel about evolution? This is one of the many factors that showed me how unbelievable and anti-common-sense religion was.

Creation is more logical. Evolution would have taken longer than the finite (Do you understand that word?) solar system could/can exist. That is "common" sense.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

Is your statement testable? Reproducible? Falsifiable? Observable? In what context is that science?

Certainly. It is the "science" of the power of God.

[KenRU]

This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.
Why did you become a Christian?
[/b]

I was brought up Catholic, I never choose to be one. I'd wager that's true for a vast majority of people.

I think I agree. Without a personal commitment and some kind of a "born-again" experience how could a person honestly declare themselves a "Christian Believer"? That would just be lip service.

That isn’t accurate. I know many who were born into the faith and are absolutely true believers. One studied to be in the seminary, and while he never did become a priest, he is without a doubt fully Christian.

So you, a non-Christian are an expert on what a Christian is, huh? I don't buy it. Christ Jesus said "You must be born again". That implies some sort of catharsis into the faith to receive the Holy Ghost Teacher of all truth.

I was Catholic up until my early to mid 20’s. So yes, I think it’s safe to say that I know which of my family and friends are true believers and which ones are not.

This is not an argument over which version of Christian is the real one. If so, your post never made that clear. Catholics by definition are Christians.

That's not exactly true. I've asked people if they were Christians. They have hesitated for a moment and said..."no, I'm a Catholic". A true Christian is a disciple of Christ. Catholic just means "universal".

Christian is often the umbrella term for all of the denominations of Christianity.

As I’m sure you’ll agree, many people are very unaware of their own religion, its meaning and its teachings. Having someone not know the difference between the two is actually commonplace.

The primary definition from dictionary.com for Christian is: of, pertaining to, or derived from Jesus Christ or His teachings: a Christian faith.

So, any follower of his teachings would and should be a considered a Christian.

Catholicism (with a capital C) is a denomination of Christianity.

Why would religion suddenly be exempt from the use of common sense?

Did I say that? NO! I said "Common sense is too limiting". I know with God all things are possible and that is a "science" (knowledge) worthy to explore.

Please cite an example how you know that “all things are possible�. Something observable, testable or reproducible please, as that would show that you are employing science correctly.

I know by faith. It is the confidence we have in what we believe. I know it is true because Jesus said it.

Faith flies in the face of common sense, then I guess? If not, then what did you mean by common sense being too limiting?

But science and Christianity can be a good mix. I consider Jesus Christ the Science of everlasting life. He is the King of metaphysics, my favorite science. I am inspired by His declaration.

If science and Christianity are a good mix, how do you feel about evolution? This is one of the many factors that showed me how unbelievable and anti-common-sense religion was.

Creation is more logical. Evolution would have taken longer than the finite (Do you understand that word?) solar system could/can exist. That is "common" sense.

I’m not sure if you’re being sarcastic here or not. Yes, I understand what the word finite means. (you do understand what he word sarcastic means, correct?)

You say evolution would take longer than the finite solar system could or can exist. What evidence do you have to support this claim? A whopping 95+% of scientists for that matter disagree with you here. Do all of those scientist not have common sense?

And if it is just a matter of common sense, it should be easy for you to show where their science is wrong. If not, perhaps you have drawn the wrong conclusion from common sense?

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

Is your statement testable? Reproducible? Falsifiable? Observable? In what context is that science?

Certainly. It is the "science" of the power of God.

Please present evidence of this power.

[YahDough]

KenRU quote:

YahDough wrote:
This is a question addressed only to former Christians who have left the faith.
Why did you become a Christian?

I was brought up Catholic, I never choose to be one. I'd wager that's true for a vast majority of people.

I think I agree. Without a personal commitment and some kind of a "born-again" experience how could a person honestly declare themselves a "Christian Believer"? That would just be lip service.

That isn’t accurate. I know many who were born into the faith and are absolutely true believers. One studied to be in the seminary, and while he never did become a priest, he is without a doubt fully Christian.

So you, a non-Christian are an expert on what a Christian is, huh? I don't buy it. Christ Jesus said "You must be born again". That implies some sort of catharsis into the faith to receive the Holy Ghost Teacher of all truth.

I was Catholic up until my early to mid 20’s. So yes, I think it’s safe to say that I know which of my family and friends are true believers and which ones are not.

This is not an argument over which version of Christian is the real one. If so, your post never made that clear. Catholics by definition are Christians.

That's not exactly true. I've asked people if they were Christians. They have hesitated for a moment and said..."no, I'm a Catholic". A true Christian is a disciple of Christ. Catholic just means "universal".

Why would religion suddenly be exempt from the use of common sense?

Did I say that? NO! I said "Common sense is too limiting". I know with God all things are possible and that is a "science" (knowledge) worthy to explore.[/quote]

Please cite an example how you know that “all things are possible�. Something observable, testable or reproducible please, as that would show that you are employing science correctly.

I know by faith. It is the confidence we have in what we believe. I know it is true because Jesus said it.[/quote]

Faith flies in the face of common sense, then I guess? If not, then what did you mean by common sense being too limiting?

Why do you "guess" when you can know the truth? I already told you why common sense is too limiting. With God we can explore all possibilities, both physical and metaphysical. His Holy Spirit is the teacher of all truth.

If science and Christianity are a good mix, how do you feel about evolution? This is one of the many factors that showed me how unbelievable and anti-common-sense religion was.

Creation is more logical. Evolution would have taken longer than the finite (Do you understand that word?) solar system could/can exist. That is "common" sense.

You say evolution would take longer than the finite solar system could or can exist. What evidence do you have to support this claim? A whopping 95+% of scientists for that matter disagree with you here. Do all of those scientist not have common sense

Apparently not. In any case I side with the 5% who have uncommon sense regarding this issue.

Jesus said:

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father."

This isn’t science, by any stretch of the imagination.

That's your conclusion which is false. Science needs to be able to understand all knowledge to be complete.

Is your statement testable? Reproducible? Falsifiable? Observable? In what context is that science?

Certainly. It is the "science" of the power of God.[/quote]

Please present evidence of this power.

Are you kiddig??? Your very existence is evidence of the power of God.

[KenRU]

Are you kiddig??? Your very existence is evidence of the power of God.

And your evidence to support such a claim? Evolution has a mountain of evidence to support its accuracy.

[YahDough]

Are you kiddig??? Your very existence is evidence of the power of God.

And your evidence to support such a claim?

I told you, Ken. You are the evidence.

Evolution has a mountain of evidence to support its accuracy.

Ever hear of "making mountains out of mole hills?"

Creation has the (rhema) word of God to support its accuracy.

With Creation there is a starting point. Evolution can't even address the beginning point. Evolution theory just assumes the process.

And the thing about creation is that God can do it quickly. He doesn't need six billion years to go from an ameba to an elephant.

Six billion years is too long. Our sun would have burned out long before that.

[KenRU]

Are you kiddig??? Your very existence is evidence of the power of God.

And your evidence to support such a claim?

I told you, Ken. You are the evidence.

How do you know that I’m not the product of space aliens? Or Allah? Or any of the Roman gods?

Again, what evidence do you have to support your claim that I am the product of Creation?

Evolution has a mountain of evidence to support its accuracy.

Ever hear of "making mountains out of mole hills?"

Yes, I could easily argue religion is twice as guilty, btw.

Creation has the (rhema) word of God to support its accuracy.

Which you only know of because of the bible.

With Creation there is a starting point. Evolution can't even address the beginning point. Evolution theory just assumes the process.

Saying I don’t know is far better than just flat out making stuff up or then sticking one's head in the sand.

Still, not knowing how life started does not disprove the fact that evolution occurs.

And the thing about creation is that God can do it quickly. He doesn't need six billion years to go from an ameba to an elephant.

You know this how? Please cite your evidence.

Six billion years is too long. Our sun would have burned out long before that.

Just a quick google search showed how wrong your science is. The sun has existed for about 4.6 billion years, life has been on our planet for about 3.8 billion years, and our sun should last another 7 billion years.

You were only off by a little though.

Life of the sun: http://www.universetoday.com/18847/life-of-the-sun/
Life on earth: http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/history_of_the_earth

Hopefully, you’ll understand one of the reasons why I no longer have any use for religion.