"I am NOT an animal"

[Zzyzx]

.
"I am NOT an animal"

Many who do not appear to have much knowledge of biology seem indignant when learning that H. sapiens are classified as animals (alternatives being plant and virus). I do not recall ever hearing a Non-Theist object. 1) Is there something about religion that causes this?

You see I am NOT an animal, never was and never in a billion years will I evolve to be one, my family tree all the way back to Adam don't have one ape in it.

2) Why be upset, indignant or in denial about a biological / taxonomic classification?

3) Since humans differ from other animals only in degree (some mental and physical characteristics), what is the objection to recognizing that they are animals?

4) Is anything other than religion (and possibly narcissism) involved?


In the quoted statement someone (whose theological position apparently defies description) claims knowledge of his family tree back to Adam – as though that proves the claimant is not an animal. However, if the hypothetical Adam was human (H. sapiens), he (Adam) classifies as an animal.

[Blastcat]

No, I didn't throw you in with the creationists. If you talk LIKE a creationist.. sorry... It's only reasonable to call you one. Because if your beliefs match THEIR beliefs.. then you are a match....

Hay thanks Blastcat for that long response, I will try to sum it up ok?

Googled it:
Like evolution, creationism can have more than one meaning. At its most basic, creationism is the belief that the universe was created by a deity of some sort - but after that, there is quite a lot of variety among creationists as to just what they believe and why. People may lump all creationists together in one group, but it is important to understand where they differ and why. Not every critique of creationism and creationist ideology will apply equally well to all creationists.
here are the 6 basic ones:

1. Scientific Creationism
2. Flat earth Creationism
3. Young Earth Creationism
4. Old Earth Creationism
5. Theistic Evolution & Evolutionary Creationism
6. Intelligent Design Creationism

- At its most basic, creationism is the belief that the universe was created by a deity of some sort

Well no, you see not even at its most basic definition of creationism does my understanding of creationism being defined here, since man can only understand God through some religious doctrine. My God, the God of the Bible, the One who Created everything and that's why He is called the 'Creator' is Not, .. I repeat is not a deity.. I explain, but how could you understand when you tag me with definitions that were created by thousands of years of heavy religious indoctrinations.

Again, look at your next answer:

I have explained that my understanding of God is based on scientific observation rather than 'religion', remember? Religion requires that you believe in their interpretation of God on faith alone, they even admit that their god/gods are not comparable/comparable to any 'scientific explanation', nor could their god/gods be explained through science.

Science doesn't go around proving god, so I have no idea what kind of science you would HAVE that proves a god. Creationists believe in a creator god and DENY evolution, just the way you do. You do the same as creationists

you see the bolded part? I rest my case. Maybe in 20, or 30 years from now as more scientific study goes into defining the mind/consciousness, someone will come across my debates and say: "Oh my God, this guy had it all right 30 years ago, but no one could understand him!?"

And they also claim to use science.. that's the same as you.

(I thought you just said: "Science doesn't go around proving god, so I have no idea what kind of science you would HAVE that proves a god?") but never mind, ..

I claim to know and explain God, the same God and Creator as in the Bible through science.
Georges Lemaitre explained a 'creator' through science, and he believed in God, the same God in the Bible, or so he claimed.
My God is as I did my best in defining Him more accurately, is the Infinite, Eternal Creative Mind/Spirit "I Am Who I Am", .. while Lemaitre understood god as a deity, or the result of some multi-god-plural-deities ideology like the one mentioned in the Bible, "Legion". But oh well, it's all the same to you, right?

So, arian says God, Lemaitre says God, .. so god, god, god, .. it's all the same, right?

arian reads the Bible, Lemaitre reads the Bible, which makes them religious, .. unless you play tennis every day before work for exactly one hour religiously, then you are also religious, only not that kind of religious, you know, the god-type! .. who cares about the details, as long as you leave God out of it.

arian claims to be Christian, .. Lemaitre claims to be Christian, only because Lemaitre leaves God out of his Big-bang evolution scientific observation, he is a real scientist, .. but arian doesn't leave God or the Bible out of his observation, nor does he have a degree in science, so he has no right to claim his observation as scientific. Besides, what does arian's mind separate from the brain has to do anything with science or the existence of the universe? Especially the definition of the word 'infinity'? What does infinite have anything to do with God, the mind, or the universe?

arian claims he understands how the universe appeared through scientific observation, .. Lemaitre claims and explains how he believes the universe appeared through science (he doesn't claim by 'scientific observation', only by science) but hey science is science, who cares about the minute details like observed science or billion year old stories claimed as science, right? Because:

Mentioning the word 'God' is automatically religion, because the only way you can talk about God, or Creator, or Creation is from religion, and that's that. Now arian, if you wish to leave out any reference to the Bible, or God, or Creator, or even the word 'creation', then we will consider your scientific study, you know, like Lemaitre did.

"So arian, .. can you define a god for us through science that has nothing to do with 'creation', or 'God', .. well er, .. you know, that God, or the Bible, or Christianity, or Jesus, unless you mean that other Jesus, you know, the son of the morning Lucifer one that the Jesuit priests are waiting and watching for to come out of the sun with their LUCIFER telescope lens!?"

You and they use the same arguments.. the same failed logic.

Yes, I agree to the failed logic, the same-o religious thinking.
This really is futile since it seems that no one is able to go beyond religious thinking. Everything has to be within religious context or it doesn't seem to make sense??

Scientific observation proves your god exists? .. HOW? YOU NEED TO TELL US HOW?.. if you have no HOW.. then you have not made a CASE AT ALL..

You SAID that you observe the universe and that makes it CLEAR TO YOU that a creator exists.. no explanation.. just an assertion..

Oh Lordie! ..How, Really? How many times do I explain it?

I read someone say: "Look, things are being pulled to the ground, I seen this apple fall out of the tree and an idea came to me, I call it gravity!"

"Assertion after assertion Newton, show us this, .. this what do you call it, aahh .. gravity? LOL! Hey guys, Newton seen gravity pull an apple to the ground, but we asked him to show us, but all he ever does is make wild assertions! He, he, he."

You have a strange definition of "deity".. most people and most dictionaries and most other CHRISTIANS define "deity" as a god.

You have a different and weird way of defining the word.
Maybe you can tell us about it. What do you mean by deity, and how is it different from god?

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 119 by arian]

you see the bolded part? I rest my case. Maybe in 20, or 30 years from now as more scientific study goes into defining the mind/consciousness, someone will come across my debates and say: "Oh my God, this guy had it all right 30 years ago, but no one could understand him!?"

No one understands your definition of god because you don't offer one.

[dianaiad]

Ok... first off. Just an easy one for you to correct.
I'm sure you mean no disrespect BUT

could you at least quote my NICKNAME correctly?
It's Blastcat.. not blastc.

Just shorter to type....



Moderator Comment

In general, it's better to use someone's full user name, unless it is clear that the user is fine with shortenings or alterations. If he isn't (and blastcat obviously isn't) the best response would be "OK, I'll be more careful from now on," in order to avoid offense and great drama.

Please review the Rules.


______________

Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.

[dianaiad]

Ok... first off. Just an easy one for you to correct.
I'm sure you mean no disrespect BUT

could you at least quote my NICKNAME correctly?
It's Blastcat.. not blastc.

Just shorter to type.

So, forget about my request for RESPECT.. FOR ONE LETTER... YOU'RE too LAZY TO TYPE ONE MORE LETTER OR HUMOR MY SMALL REQUEST TO BE TREATED RESPECTFULLY?

I have no respect for that kind of behavior.

Moderator Warning


Please do not use personal remarks and uncivil tones towards posters. Demanding respect very seldom results in getting it. While it is understandable that you would wish to be addressed by the full screen name you have chosen, your reaction is in itself disrespectful and uncivil.


Please review our Rules.

______________

Moderator warnings count as a strike against users. Additional violations in the future may warrant a final warning. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.

[arian]

.

Maybe in 20, or 30 years from now as more scientific study goes into defining the mind/consciousness, someone will come across my debates and say: "Oh my God, this guy had it all right 30 years ago, but no one could understand him!?"

Those whose brilliance allows them to be "ahead of their time" are far outnumbered by those who think or claim they are brilliant ahead of their time.

Which applies in this case?

I don't know, I never claimed to be brilliant. Heck, up to just a few years ago I was made to believe I was just a dumb dog unworthy to eat at the family table.
Then one day I started to debate, and here also I was reassured that I WAS an animal, only, as I was told, evolution was so subtle that I would start discriminating against other animals and put up signs on doors of supermarkets and other businesses: "No animals allowed".

Then as I was reading this Blue Brain Project, my animalistic brain started thinking and I realized I was more then just an animal with an evolving animal brain that we are forced to believe, and here I started to realize that I am a conscious mind/spirit who lives/resides in a physical body.

But of course, trying to explain this to people who without a shadow of a doubt believe they are nothing but evolving animals proves futile.
They don't believe in a Creator God who created man in his own image, so they are on a quest to create a human/animal brain in their image, so it could produce a mind!? But what they fail to see is that if they digitally replicate a brain, they could just as easily mimic what may seem as consciousness.
Why I say that? Well they keep testing this brain's consciousness like having it play Jeopardy, then they go back and fickle with the 'brain program', .. lol.

Imagine if evolution had to work like that? First mother Nature would see the result of the mind, then go back a few million years and make adjustments to the evolution of the brain, .. lol

A chess computer doesn't have consciousness, but if you've ever played against these chess-computers, you would swear it has it's own mind, but we know better, it's just a program to play chess.

This is like denying, and even laughing at the concept of a Creator who created man in his own image, and at the same time creating a digital man/brain in their own image, after their likeness!?!? Body, internal organs, face, eyes and all. Oh yea, .. only better, smarter, stronger than this one God created, .. you know, the Creator-God they don't believe exists.

Love you Z.

[Zzyzx]

.
Moderator Clarification

Many of us use a shortened / abbreviated form of screen names (without malicious intent). There is usually no objection. For instance, I have no objection to being referred to as "Z". However, if someone objects to the abbreviation of their screen name all of us should be willing to honor their preference regarding their name. A brief PM is sufficient to announce the preference to any "offending party."


Rules
C&A Guidelines


______________

Moderator clarifications do not count as a strike against any posters. They serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received and/or are given at the discretion of a moderator when he or she feels a clarification of the rules is required.

[arian]

You have a strange definition of "deity".. most people and most dictionaries and most other CHRISTIANS define "deity" as a god.

You have a different and weird way of defining the word.
Maybe you can tell us about it. What do you mean by deity, and how is it different from god?

de·i·ty
/ˈdēədē,ˈd�ədē/
noun
noun: deity; plural noun: deities
a god or goddess (in a polytheistic religion).
"a deity of ancient Greece"
synonyms: god, goddess, divine being, supreme being, divinity, immortal; creator, demiurge; godhead
"the deities of ancient Greece"
•divine status, quality, or nature.
"a ruler driven by delusions of deity"
•the creator and supreme being (in a monotheistic religion such as Christianity).
noun: Deity; noun: the Deity

di·vine
adjective: divine; comparative adjective: diviner; superlative adjective: divinest
1. of, from, or like God or a god.
"heroes with divine powers"
synonyms: godly, angelic, seraphic, saintly, beatific; More
heavenly, celestial, supernal, holy
"a divine being"

antonyms: mortal
•devoted to God; sacred.
"divine liturgy"
synonyms: religious, holy, sacred, sanctified, consecrated, blessed, devotional
"divine worship"
2. noun: divine; plural noun: divines; noun: Divine; noun: the Divine

1.dated
a cleric or theologian.
synonyms: theologian, clergyman, clergywoman, member of the clergy, churchman, churchwoman, cleric, minister, man/woman of the cloth, preacher, priest; informalreverend
"puritan divines"

div·i·na·tion
noun: divination; plural noun: divinations
the practice of seeking knowledge of the future or the unknown by supernatural means.

synonyms: fortune telling, divining, prophecy, prediction, soothsaying, augury; clairvoyance, second sight
"he looked to divination for guidance"

I know what you will say; "I don't get it?"
Or
"You define one god, you defined them all."

Now look in the Bible, the only place Devine is in place of Holy or Spirit is in the Catholic deification of their god Lucifer. Constantine could have never accepted a God he did not recognize or understand, so he deified and placed our Creator, the one in the Bible along with the rest of his gods, his deities, and made the Priests diviners.

Deification
is when a person is treated like a god. If you love your basketball coach so much that you build her an altar and bow whenever she walks by, that's deification. And a little weird. This word is a variation of deify which means to treat someone like a deity (a god).

You see it now why our Creator is not a Deity?

[Blastcat]

You have a strange definition of "deity".. most people and most dictionaries and most other CHRISTIANS define "deity" as a god.

You have a different and weird way of defining the word.
Maybe you can tell us about it. What do you mean by deity, and how is it different from god?

de·i·ty
/ˈdēədē,ˈd�ədē/
noun
noun: deity; plural noun: deities
a god or goddess (in a polytheistic religion).
"a deity of ancient Greece"
synonyms: god, goddess, divine being, supreme being, divinity, immortal; creator, demiurge; godhead
"the deities of ancient Greece"
•divine status, quality, or nature.
"a ruler driven by delusions of deity"
•the creator and supreme being (in a monotheistic religion such as Christianity).
noun: Deity; noun: the Deity

di·vine
adjective: divine; comparative adjective: diviner; superlative adjective: divinest
1. of, from, or like God or a god.
"heroes with divine powers"
synonyms: godly, angelic, seraphic, saintly, beatific; More
heavenly, celestial, supernal, holy
"a divine being"

antonyms: mortal
•devoted to God; sacred.
"divine liturgy"
synonyms: religious, holy, sacred, sanctified, consecrated, blessed, devotional
"divine worship"
2. noun: divine; plural noun: divines; noun: Divine; noun: the Divine

1.dated
a cleric or theologian.
synonyms: theologian, clergyman, clergywoman, member of the clergy, churchman, churchwoman, cleric, minister, man/woman of the cloth, preacher, priest; informalreverend
"puritan divines"

div·i·na·tion
noun: divination; plural noun: divinations
the practice of seeking knowledge of the future or the unknown by supernatural means.

synonyms: fortune telling, divining, prophecy, prediction, soothsaying, augury; clairvoyance, second sight
"he looked to divination for guidance"

I know what you will say; "I don't get it?"
Or
"You define one god, you defined them all."

Now look in the Bible, the only place Devine is in place of Holy or Spirit is in the Catholic deification of their god Lucifer. Constantine could have never accepted a God he did not recognize or understand, so he deified and placed our Creator, the one in the Bible along with the rest of his gods, his deities, and made the Priests diviners.

Deification
is when a person is treated like a god. If you love your basketball coach so much that you build her an altar and bow whenever she walks by, that's deification. And a little weird. This word is a variation of deify which means to treat someone like a deity (a god).

You see it now why our Creator is not a Deity?

Your creator isn't a god ?

ok. You can call it what you like.

[Blastcat]

You have a strange definition of "deity".. most people and most dictionaries and most other CHRISTIANS define "deity" as a god.

You have a different and weird way of defining the word.
Maybe you can tell us about it. What do you mean by deity, and how is it different from god?

de·i·ty
/ˈdēədē,ˈd�ədē/
noun
noun: deity; plural noun: deities
a god or goddess (in a polytheistic religion).
"a deity of ancient Greece"
synonyms: god, goddess, divine being, supreme being, divinity, immortal; creator, demiurge; godhead
"the deities of ancient Greece"
•divine status, quality, or nature.
"a ruler driven by delusions of deity"
•the creator and supreme being (in a monotheistic religion such as Christianity).
noun: Deity; noun: the Deity

di·vine
adjective: divine; comparative adjective: diviner; superlative adjective: divinest
1. of, from, or like God or a god.
"heroes with divine powers"
synonyms: godly, angelic, seraphic, saintly, beatific; More
heavenly, celestial, supernal, holy
"a divine being"

antonyms: mortal
•devoted to God; sacred.
"divine liturgy"
synonyms: religious, holy, sacred, sanctified, consecrated, blessed, devotional
"divine worship"
2. noun: divine; plural noun: divines; noun: Divine; noun: the Divine

1.dated
a cleric or theologian.
synonyms: theologian, clergyman, clergywoman, member of the clergy, churchman, churchwoman, cleric, minister, man/woman of the cloth, preacher, priest; informalreverend
"puritan divines"

div·i·na·tion
noun: divination; plural noun: divinations
the practice of seeking knowledge of the future or the unknown by supernatural means.

synonyms: fortune telling, divining, prophecy, prediction, soothsaying, augury; clairvoyance, second sight
"he looked to divination for guidance"

I know what you will say; "I don't get it?"
Or
"You define one god, you defined them all."

Now look in the Bible, the only place Devine is in place of Holy or Spirit is in the Catholic deification of their god Lucifer. Constantine could have never accepted a God he did not recognize or understand, so he deified and placed our Creator, the one in the Bible along with the rest of his gods, his deities, and made the Priests diviners.

Deification
is when a person is treated like a god. If you love your basketball coach so much that you build her an altar and bow whenever she walks by, that's deification. And a little weird. This word is a variation of deify which means to treat someone like a deity (a god).

You see it now why our Creator is not a Deity?

You have skillfully demonstrated that the word deity means god, from the Latin word "deus".

And most people know that the word divine means "like a god ", because it also comes from the Latin word for god.. which is deus.

Ok, you don't like the word deity... but the word deity means god.

Maybe it's just me, but I think you would define your god AS a god.

[KenRU]

Christianity teaches (some) to say NO to the wickedness IN us and in others, and directs us to The Perfect (undefined unbound) Objective, which is GOD.

Materialism, however intelligent, however "provable" will not over ride the reality of evil IN man, and as such MAN is not to be entirely trusted.

Then this begs the obvious question: how can we trust anything about scripture or god, when all knowledge of god comes from humans?

The bible was penned by humans, and priests and pastors are all humans - should we not trust any source then? One can say that the bible is god inspired but how do we know that? Only via a human being - whom we should not entirely trust? Seems to me that this kind of thinking only undermines your point and the bible's credibility.

-all the best