dakoski wrote:
[
Replying to JehovahsWitness]
While elohim as a plural noun is fairly common in scripture, I would say it is not common to use Elohim associated with a singular verb, indeed this "pluralization of excellence" is almost exclusively used in the Hebrew bible for Jehovah.
I don't know about theos, but I would think LXX would reflect the above.
You're attempting to answer a different question to the one I was asking, but you're free not to answer it if you don't want. The point I was making was simply why use a word theos which is exclusively used to describe Jehovah (with the obvious exceptions we discussed above i.e. idols or sarcasm) when there is a less confusing Greek word (theios) which communicates what you think it should (that Jesus is divine but not Theos/Elohim).
Anyway, I won't have time for further replies as I'm away at the moment.
Because evidently the writer is trying to communicate something unique about the nature of The Word.
I think you're still misunderstanding the context of what I'm responding to. Its fine its a fairly common thing in these types of forums.
Clearly if John was wanting to communicate that the unique nature of the Word is that he is divine but not God - then clearly theios is the appropriate word and not theos? Do you commonly refer to the Word as God - or do you think people might find that confusing? You have words that can clarify your position in English, New Testament Greek also has such words. But instead John preferred to use theos. If John uses theos to describe Jesus, shouldn't you also use the English equivalent to describe him so?
Have a good day.
Footnote for Lesson B of 'Seven Lessons for John 1:1c' (Link in post 2 above):
Although some trinitarian apologists claim ignorance of the following, it is nevertheless scripturally true and admitted by many respected trinitarian NT Greek experts.
Some of these trinitarian sources which admit that the Scriptures actually describe
men who represent God (judges, Israelite kings, etc.) and God's holy
angels as
gods include:
1. Young's Analytical Concordance of the Bible, "Hints and Helps...," Eerdmans, 1978 reprint;
2. Strong's Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible, #430, Hebrew & Chaldee Dict., Abingdon, 1974;
3. New Bible Dictionary, p. 1133, Tyndale House Publ., 1984;
4. Today's Dictionary of the Bible, p. 208, Bethany House Publ., 1982;
5. Hastings' A Dictionary of the Bible, p. 217, Vol. 2;
6. The New Brown-Driver-Briggs-Gesenius Hebrew-English Lexicon, p. 43, Hendrickson publ.,1979;
7. Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament, #2316 (4.), Thayer, Baker Book House, 1984 printing;
8. The International Standard Bible Encyclopaedia, p. 132, Vol. 1; & p. 1265, Vol. 2, Eerdmans, 1984;
9. The NIV Study Bible, footnotes for Ps. 45:6; Ps. 82:1, 6; & Jn 10:34; Zondervan, 1985;
10. New American Bible, St. Joseph ed., footnote for Ps. 45:7, 1970 ed.;
11. A. T. Robertson, Word Pictures, Vol. 5, pp. 188-189;
12. William G. T. Shedd, Dogmatic Theology, Vol. 1, pp. 317, 324, Nelson Publ., 1980 printing;
13. Murray J. Harris, Jesus As God, p. 202, Baker Book House, 1992;
14. William Barclay, The Gospel of John, V. 2, Daily Study Bible Series, pp. 77, 78, Westminster Press,1975;
15. The New John Gill Exposition of the Entire Bible (John 10:34 & Ps. 82:6);
16. The Fourfold Gospel (Note for John 10:35);
17. Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible - Jamieson, Fausset, Brown (John 10:34-36);
18. Matthew Henry Complete Commentary on the Whole Bible (Ps. 82:6-8 and John 10:35);
19. John Wesley's Explanatory Notes on the Whole Bible (Ps. 82:1).
20. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament ('Little Kittel'), - p. 328, Eerdmans Publishing Co., 1985.
21. The Expositors Greek Testament, pp. 794-795, Vol. 1, Eerdmans Publishing Co.
22. The Amplified Bible, Ps. 82:1, 6 and John 10:34, 35, Zondervan Publ., 1965.
23. Barnes' Notes on the New Testament, John 10:34, 35.
24. B. W. Johnson's People's New Testament, John 10:34-36.
25. The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology, Zondervan, 1986, Vol. 3, p. 187.
26. Fairbairns Imperial Standard Bible Encyclopedia, p. 24, vol. III, Zondervan, 1957 reprint.
27. Theological Dictionary, Rahner and Vorgrimler, p. 20, Herder and Herder, 1965.
28. Pastor Jon Courson, The Gospel According to John.
29. Vincents New Testament Word Studies, John 10:36.
(Also John 10:34, 35 - CEV: TEV; GodsWord; The Message; NLT; NIRV)
And, of course the highly respected and highly popular Hellenic Jewish writer, Philo, had the same understanding for theos about the same time the NT was written. - See my LOGOS study.
And the earliest Christians like the highly respected NT scholar Origen and others - - including Tertullian; Justin Martyr; Hippolytus; Clement of Alexandria; Theophilus; the writer of "The Epistle to Diognetus"; and even super-Trinitarians St. Athanasius and St. Augustine - - also had this understanding that a man (or an angel) can be called "a god" in a righteous sense. And, as we saw above, many respected NT scholars of this century agree.
For example, The reason why judges are called gods in Ps 82 [quoted by Jesus in John 10:34] is that they have the
office of administering Gods judgment as sons of the Most High. . On the other hand, Jesus fulfilled the role of a true judge as
a god and son of the Most High - The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology, Zondervan, 1986, Vol. 3, p. 187.
- See the God and gods study.
