Does God cause evil?

DanieltheDragon · Post by **DanieltheDragon** » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:20 pm

Does God cause evil?

Some assert that God causes no evil. Is there cause to believe this is true. Can this position be supported. Is the character described in the bible incapable of evil?

I would assert that a position that claims God created everything would make him the original cause of evil. That God cannot escape being the cause of evil since he created any and all situations in which evil would arise.

Tired of the Nonsense · Fri Mar 17, 2017 12:42 pm

[Replying to post 140 by theophile]

theophile wrote: I wouldn't put it in terms of celestial warfare as you make it sound, but sure, of course, God could lose.

And yet the Book of Revelation assures us of God's victory over the forces of Satan. But it would seem that the Bible is not trustworthy, since God is not all powerful.

Joe1950 · Post by **Joe1950** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:35 pm

Back to the original question: Does god cause evil?

We know , for a fact, that god at least ALLOWS evil to exist. That is undeniable. Evil exists. The only way to deny that god causes evil to exist is to claim that god is not all powerful. He could not stop evil from existing.

Some have said that god does not KNOW the future, but only can anticipate future possibilities. I also have that power. In that sense am I godlike?

So, god is not all powerful because he cannot stop evil.
God is not all knowing because he cannot know the future.

God becomes more and more humanlike with every new posting.

theophile · Post by **theophile** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 6:44 pm

[Replying to Tired of the Nonsense]

And yet the Book of Revelation assures us of God's victory over the forces of Satan. But it would seem that the Bible is not trustworthy, since God is not all powerful.

Yeah, because people stayed true to the Word through hell itself. Good call out.

William · Post by **William** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:28 pm

Joe1950 wrote: Back to the original question: Does god cause evil?

We know , for a fact, that god at least ALLOWS evil to exist. That is undeniable. Evil exists. The only way to deny that god causes evil to exist is to claim that god is not all powerful. He could not stop evil from existing.

Some have said that god does not KNOW the future, but only can anticipate future possibilities. I also have that power. In that sense am I godlike?

So, god is not all powerful because he cannot stop evil.
God is not all knowing because he cannot know the future.

God becomes more and more humanlike with every new posting.

You must have missed my post

in your hurry to reach your conclusions.

My post covers these observations you present.

ttruscott · Post by **ttruscott** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:48 pm

Joe1950 wrote: Back to the original question: Does god cause evil?

We know , for a fact, that god at least ALLOWS evil to exist. That is undeniable. Evil exists. The only way to deny that god causes evil to exist is to claim that god is not all powerful. He could not stop evil from existing.

Wrong. It is not the only way by along shot.

Giving us free will to be able to fulfill true love and marriage which, by necessity of what free will is, must allow the possibility of evil also, which is the reason why GOD, who is all powerful, allowed evil to exist. It was not a question of power in the least.

Even the newest Christians can see the stumbling secularists make with such pronouncements and will never give credence to such bias ever...imCo

ttruscott · Post by **ttruscott** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 7:55 pm

Joe1950 wrote: Back to the original question: Does god cause evil?The only way to deny that god causes evil to exist is to claim that god is not all powerful. He could not stop evil from existing.

This is an unproven personal statement and not allowed on a debate forum without a caveat of being your opinion.. Please provide proof it is true with your resources or withdraw it.

Zzyzx · Post by **Zzyzx** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:06 pm

.
God, "I create evil"

Apologists, "Oh no you don't". The Bible is WRONG about that (but it is right about everything else -- except if I say it is wrong about other things too).

theophile · Post by **theophile** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 8:14 pm

[Replying to Zzyzx]

God, "I create evil"

Apologists, "Oh no you don't". The Bible is WRONG about that (but it is right about everything else -- except if I say it is wrong about other things too).

I was quite happy to say that God causes evil.

Also pretty sure I've never said the bible is wrong about anything. The problem is everybody else's ability to understand.

Tired of the Nonsense · Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:12 pm

theophile wrote: [Replying to Zzyzx]

God, "I create evil"

Apologists, "Oh no you don't". The Bible is WRONG about that (but it is right about everything else -- except if I say it is wrong about other things too).
I was quite happy to say that God causes evil.

Also pretty sure I've never said the bible is wrong about anything. The problem is everybody else's ability to understand.

The Bible indicates that God's changes His mind when He fails to get the result He expected. The Bible also indicates that God is omnipotent. Since these two concepts about the nature of God are contradictory, how are we supposed to come to any other conclusion but that the Bible is WRONG? Not merely wrong, but little more than just another example of human originated mythology? You know, the same sort of origin mythology that virtually ALL ancient civilizations were famously producing to explain what they had no means to understand?

William · Post by **William** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:56 pm

[Replying to post 149 by Tired of the Nonsense]

You must have missed my post.

My post covers these observations you present. There is only perceived contradiction, rather than real contradiction.

Creation is not the Creator. It is created to experience and even that the Creator would know (being all knowing) what it would be like to create a universe which say, allows it to experience pure evil and lose itself in that experience for a 'time', this would not mean it wouldn't do it. That it does do it means it knows everything will turn out fine in the end.

In relation to that, FSC within this universe (which is not good or evil of itself) becomes the GOD of this universe (the life force) but since it is experiencing a beginning, it has to learn of its powers and capabilities and limitations as it is no longer all knowing (but will become all knowing eventually, in relation to this universe) and the GOD of the bible is one aspect of this GOD - which is experiencing its creativity within a planet and from there creating planetary critters of which you and I are.

As planetary critters, you and I are aspects of this planetary GOD and our lives are short and we individually don't know much at all. The planetary GOD knows far more and is connected to all critters through the 'breath' of life-force (spirit) which empowers the forms with 'life' and in that sense the planetary entity GOD is 'all knowing' in relation to the data of experience it has this natural access to, so is still unable to predict with 100% certainty but with enough accuracy to know how things will most likely pan out.

In all cases where good and evil are being manifested into the experience, GOD is both directly and indirectly responsible, not just as the overall consciousness, but as the aspects of the overall consciousness - the consciousnesses, in form.