Does anyone actually believe the story of Noah's Ark?

[Topaz27]

I know a bunch of Christians, and so many of them believe that Noah's Ark is a myth. Basically just a story to teach morals and lessons. I personally see a lot of things wrong with the story of the flood. So I was wondering, if anyone believes the story of Noah's Ark, and the world flood, to be the truth?

[Topaz27]

Couldn't God just stop them from being evil?

[onewithhim]

Can you show me where anybody said that humans died on the tops of mountains?

Use your head. Were would you go if there is a flood? The lowest place or the highest place? Why don't you think that people and animals would not go to the highest place to escape be drowned??????

Never did responds to the question about do you drowning a baby is good or evil?????
What about an answer? You afraid to give an answer????[/quote]







ONEWITHHIM RESPONDS


Oh, so no one actually said that people went to the tops of the mountains. It's your reasoning. Your opinion.

And yes I did respond to your reference to drowning babies. Perhaps you could go back and see.

So your scornful statement that there have been no skeletons found on the tops of mountains is unfounded, baseless....pulled out of the air. It is not a valid objection.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 145 by Topaz27]
There were bodies "floating everywhere." Piles of skeletons have been found all around the world, as I read in science magazines often. T Rex skeletons have also been found elsewhere than the United States. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to remember some being found in China or Mongolia.

You and the others who despise God and the Bible are grasping at straws, and you throw out against the wall any kind of an argument, no matter how flimsy, and hope something sticks.

I think I've had enough of this. Questions are answered and then someone says that they were not answered. Maybe it's because some people don't want to reason on the matter and maybe find out they were wrong, or they don't bother to really read and ponder over an answer.

Fare well.

[onewithhim]

Jehovah's Witness:
First off Tcg understood me correctly.

Why do you refuse to answer my questions? And while you might not know for sure, no one does. You believe in God, I want to know when you believe the universe started? When do you believe the world was made? Do you believe the earth if flat? How long ago do you believe the flood happened?

Then, why do you believe these things?

And if you've stated them before, I'm sorry, you haven't been very clear enough. I have looked through this subforum several times now. I am giving you the chance to clearly state your views, so I can't mistake your beliefs.

There are four questions I want answered that are stated above, please answer them.

Besides JehovahsWitness, I have answered these questions, and mentioned that JW and I have the same opinions on the issue. Yet you, once again, ignore my answers. Beliefs have been CLEARLY STATED. I'm outta here!

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 149 by onewithhim]

Other civilizations weren't interested in honoring the true God, Jehovah.They had their other gods, to whom they gave names other than any associated with Jehovah or His worshippers. Also, why should they care about the details of the Flood story that were passed down from Noah and his family?

The purpose of the great flood was to wipe almost all of the life on the planet. After the event there were only eight humans and a contingent of animals to repopulate the world. There should only be one flood story as told by Noah and passed down. You would think that there should also only be one known god as a consequence. Somehow, in an incredibly short amount of time, all corners of the earth were repopulated from a starting base of eight humans, civilisations grew and a plethora of new gods made their appearance. None of it gels with reality. There was no biblical flood.

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 150 by onewithhim]

Excuse me, Tcg, but may I inquire as to what version of the Bible you are using?

Oh, dear. The word of God depends on which particular human inspired version you choose to read. What sort of deity has the ability to create an entire universe filled with complex objects and forces, fine-tunes it to the umpteenth decimal place so that it will be stable and allow life to exist, but can't apply the same degree of skill and intelligence to producing the most important text ever written? There is no sign of any god in the Bible, only the hand of imaginative, superstitious and ignorant humans who could only make guesses about the world they inhabited.

[JehovahsWitness]

Actually one more important question. How many animals in total, do you think were on the ark?

HOW MANY ANIMALS WERE IN THE ARK?

• Clarke's Commentary (excluding insects, worms and marine animals*) estimates
  • mamals : 43
  • Birds 74 (excluding webfooted)
  • Amphibians 10
  
  Bishop Wilkins lists
  • quadrupeds 72
  • birds. < 200

The Encyclopedia Americana indicatea that there are upwards of 1,300,000 species of animals. (1977, Vol. 1, pp. 859-873) However, over 60 percent of these are insects. Breaking these figures down further, of the 24,000 amphibians, reptiles, birds, and mammals, 10,000 are birds, 9,000 are reptiles and amphibians, many of which could have survived outside the ark, and only 5,000 are mammals, including whales and porpoises, which would have also remained outside the ark. Other researchers estimate that there are only about 290 species of land mammals larger than sheep** and about 1,360 smaller than rats. (The Deluge Story in Stone, by B. C. Nelson, 1949, p. 156; The Flood in the Light of the Bible, Geology, and Archaeology, by A. M. Rehwinkel, 1957, p. 69) - Insight on the Scriptures Vol I p.. 165
Source: https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200000367#h=10

[/list]

CONCLUSION


Based on a naturalist breakdown of species, it seems that Noah may well have had under 2,000* animals on the ark, (many of which were relatively small in size). Even allowing for increased numbers of sheep and other clean animals, this is far below the massive numbers suggested by many.

[*]For some perspective: the average sheep is about 23.47 kilograms, so the biblical boat could have held about 2.15 million sheep. [...] Scientists have characterized about 1.7 million species to date... if the average mass of species represented on the ark was the average mass of sheep, the ark would theoretically have been able to accommodate them all without capsizing.
source : https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science- ... 2C000%20kg.

There are currently about 6000 species of MAMMALS
https://academic.oup.com/jmammal/articl ... 00%20years.


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[marco]

Based on a naturalist breakdown of species, it seems that Noah may well have had under 2,000 animals on the ark, (many of which were relatively small in size). Even allowing for increased numbers of sheep and other clean animals, this is far below the massive numbers suggested by many.

Noah was 600 years old. Noah built a ship that would dwarf our modern vessels. Noah had logistic problems that would defeat our best brains.

Place this beside "naturalist breakdown of species" and we invite loud laughter. There is no nice way of describing Noah and his attendant follies as anything other than rubbish. It does not even have the excuse that we KNOW it is all imaginative like Harry Potter, beautifully written and with rich, imaginative skills.

But it is best to read the actual text and let the stupidity seep out. The giant of technology got drunk. And so:

21When he drank some of its wine, he became drunk and lay uncovered inside his tent. 22Ham, the father of Canaan, saw his father naked and told his two brothers outside. 23But Shem and Japheth took a garment and laid it across their shoulders; then they walked in backward and covered their father's naked body. Their faces were turned the other way so that they would not see their father naked. 24When Noah awoke from his wine and found out what his youngest son had done to him, 25he said, "Cursed be Canaan! The lowest of slaves will he be to his brothers."


Yes, yes, all sorts of "serious" reasons are given for what Ham actual did, and why nice Noah cursed Ham's son, and why the brothers theatrically went in backwards. I wonder what modern science has to say about the above passage. Can it calculate how many units of alcohol ship-builder Noah had taken, perhaps?

[JehovahsWitness]

.... what Ham actual did, and why nice Noah cursed Ham's son, and why the brothers theatrically went in backwards. I wonder what modern science has to say about the above passage. Can it calculate how many units of alcohol ship-builder Noah had taken, perhaps?

I will not be addressing the question of the curse of Caanan in this particular thread (see links if you would like to read my opinion on this question). The OP mentioned the actual flood and the ark several times so I will only be dealing with those specific issues in this thread.

Regards,


JW




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[Tcg]

You and the others who despise God and the Bible are grasping at straws, and you throw out against the wall any kind of an argument, no matter how flimsy, and hope something sticks.

No one here has used despising God as a reason to question the story of Noah's Ark. It is the flimsy argumentation that has been presented to support the story that has been questioned.

Whenever the character of other posters is brought into question, as you have done here, it is clear that a direct address of the issues involved has been abandoned.

One can only wonder why such an approach would be presented if there was valid reasoning to be presented.


Tcg