Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[We_Are_VENOM]

Somethjng is literally new when it is "produced, introduced, or discovered recently or now for the first time; not existing before". Revelation speaks of God making "everything new including a new earth and a new heavens. Some take this in the absolute to mean he will replace everything includjng heaven and out planet earth but this is both unscriptural and illogical.

Huh? You just gave the definition of "new", and new in this context is meant to be distinguished from the old, which, in this context, is the old heaven and the old earth.

That is clearly the context here....the old heaven/earth, which will pass away...and the NEW heaven/earth, which is what God is creating as a replacement of the old.

There is nothing symbolic here. Now I certainly understand that Revelations is a symbolic book, but we have to be careful and reason within the scriptures and understand what was meant to be taken literal, and what was meant to be taken symbolically.

To illustrate: When a man introduces his family to his "new bride" does it mean that the woman has just been born or is literally a new person? Or does it rather mean she as newly taken on an exclusive role as his wife.

Well, that depends. If the man was married before, his ex-wife could be considered his "old" wife...and his new bride can now be considered his "new" life.

So it all depends on the situation, and as I pointed out above, it is clear that the old heaven/earth is to be distinguished from the new heaven/earth.

The new earth/heaven is "synbolically" new in that although existing prior to its estaliment as the new norm, it will take a position in its newly exclusive role in the fulfillment of Gods purpose.

Cmon now, JW. That is just flat out reaching. Reaching for something that just isn't there.

The scripture is clear that God will make his "dwelling" with man in this same new h/e. So I guess we should also take that as symbolic as well, and God won't make his dwelling among after all because it should be meant to be understood as a symbolic.

With all due respect, JW, what you have is a gross misunderstand and representation of the Scriptures, my friend.

Makes no sense.

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

It just never fails; Jehovah's Witnesses say one thing, and the Bible says another. You ask "who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth"?

When you ask this question, the first question that comes to my mind is; wait a minute, what do you mean "this" beautiful earth, as if faithful believers will reside on "this" earth.

Scripture is clear, that there will be a NEW heaven and a NEW earth, "for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away" (Rev 21:1).

That being said, faithful believers won't reside on "this" earth, we will reside on new, restored, grander earth that Jesus has prepared for us (John 14:2).

This is just a minor falsehood (in the grand scheme of things), but if the minor details are off, one can only imagine the amount of major stuff that are off.

Second, speaking of paradise on earth, if anyone has noticed in some of the drawing illustrations (in Watchtower Publications), you will often see drawings of people as they dwell on this "paradise" earth...and in the drawing you will often see the people conducting manual labor (with smiles on their faces), mainly gardening.

Such depictions are false. Why? For the simple fact that, they claim that "paradise" will be a restoration of the Garden of Eden, yet before the fall of man, there was no manual labor, as manual labor did not begin until AFTER the fall. In fact, manual labor was actually a punishment that was implemented by God to Adam as a result of his sin (Gen 3:17).

So if this "paradise" that Jehovah's Witnesses speak of is a restoration of the Garden of Eden, (where there was no manual labor needed), why would manual labor be needed in this restored Garden of Eden?

The labor is already done. God provided the labor, all we have to do is simply show up and enjoy what God has given us as a reward!!

Again, the Bible says one thing, Jehovah's Witnesses say another.

WeAreVenom: The Scriptures indicate that THIS earth will always remain. The verses that Peter wrote are symbolic to show that the planet will be cleaned out of all corruption, exposed for what that corruption is, and finally graced with a "new heavens"--or, governmental authority---and a "new earth," or, society of people. What reason could there be for God to destroy the actual planet? It remains beautiful even though polluted by evil men. God shows His love and honor for this planet when He inspired St. John to write about the subject at Revelation 11:18. Jehovah's wrath is coming upon those ruining His planet.

"The nations became wrathful, and your [God's] own wrath came, and the appointed time came for the dead to be judged and to reward your slaves the prophets and the holy ones and those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth." (NWT)


And answer this: If the literal earth was to be destroyed, what about the "heavens"? Are the actual heavens to also be destroyed? All of the stars, the galaxies, the entire universe? Isn't that rather SILLY? There is definitely another way to look at Peter's verses of "burning up" the heavens and the earth. They are definitely symbolic.

[We_Are_VENOM]

WeAreVenom: The Scriptures indicate that THIS earth will always remain. The verses that Peter wrote are symbolic to show that the planet will be cleaned out of all corruption, exposed for what that corruption is, and finally graced with a "new heavens"--or, governmental authority---and a "new earth," or, society of people. What reason could there be for God to destroy the actual planet? It remains beautiful even though polluted by evil men. God shows His love and honor for this planet when He inspired St. John to write about the subject at Revelation 11:18. Jehovah's wrath is coming upon those ruining His planet.

"The nations became wrathful, and your [God's] own wrath came, and the appointed time came for the dead to be judged and to reward your slaves the prophets and the holy ones and those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth." (NWT)

Oh, ok. I get it.

You and JW are saying the same thing, but your break-down is more clearer than JW's (no offense, JW)...but essentially, you both are making the same points.

I get where you all are coming from, but I wholeheartedly disagree with your assessments of what the Scriptures is saying.

You guys reason that paradise will be the same earth, albeit a completely glorious "restored" earth. While I believe that paradise will be a completely new, glorious earth.

Either way, regardless of one's assessment of this, it has no barren on whether a person is among the flock, or not...in my opinion.

Minor disagreement and I respect you and JW's opinion (at least as it pertains to this subject)

And answer this: If the literal earth was to be destroyed, what about the "heavens"? Are the actual heavens to also be destroyed? All of the stars, the galaxies, the entire universe? Isn't that rather SILLY? There is definitely another way to look at Peter's verses of "burning up" the heavens and the earth. They are definitely symbolic.

See, that is exactly my point. You ask such questions in shock, as if it is completely unfathomable to even think that God would consider destroying the heavens (stars, galaxies, etc)..

Yet, we see in the Bible that God destroyed almost all traces of mankind with a Global Flood, and we know that God loves his human creations more than any inanimate physical matter.

If he can destroy almost all mankind and start "new" with Noah and his family, then why is it so difficult to believe that he can destroy the earth and the heavens and start "new" with a new heaven, and earth...and with an "new" flock?

Unless you are gonna tell me that the Global Flood was symbolic, too?

[JehovahsWitness]

Yet, we see in the Bible that God destroyed almost all traces of mankind with a Global Flood...

I taken the expression "a traces" to mean a small amount, so wouldnt detoying "al, traces of mankjnd" mean none of mankjnd survives? Perhaps you attribute a different meaning to the expression "all traces" because the bible quite clearly states that there were 8 survivors of the global flood.



JW

For more information go to other posts related to

ARMAGEDDON, KILLING and ... THE FLOOD OF NOAH'S DAY

[We_Are_VENOM]

I taken the expression "a traces" to mean a small amount, so wouldnt detoying "al, traces of mankjnd" mean none of mankjnd survives? Perhaps you attribute a different meaning to the expression "all traces" because the bible quite clearly states that there were 8 survivors of the global flood.

JW

JW, I clearly stated..

1. Almost all mankind

and

2. If he can destroy almost all mankind and start "new" with Noah and his family..

So both of your concerns were indeed covered by me.

[JehovahsWitness]

Unless you are gonna tell me that the Global Flood was symbolic, too?

No the flood was we believe a historical event. Peter compares the the coming destruction to that event.

2 PETER 3:6 NWT

...the world of that time suffered destruction

JW





RELATED POSTS

Why did God cause a global flood?
viewtopic.php?p=890011#p890011

[We_Are_VENOM]

No the flood was we believe a historical event Peter compares the the coming destruction to that event.

Right, and I agree...which goes back to my original point; if God took the liberty of wiping out all of mankind, people of whom he truly loved (with the exception of a few), then the idea of him wiping out the entire universe and creating a new one (to represent a "new" beginning), strikes me as an non-issue.

[JehovahsWitness]

The Scriptures indicate that THIS earth will always remain. The verses that Peter wrote are symbolic to show that the planet will be cleaned out of all corruption, exposed for what that corruption is, and finally graced with a "new heavens"--or, governmental authority---and a "new earth," or, society of people. What reason could there be for God to destroy the actual planet? It remains beautiful even though polluted by evil men. God shows His love and honor for this planet when He inspired St. John to write about the subject at Revelation 11:18. Jehovah's wrath is coming upon those ruining His planet.

"The nations became wrathful, and your [God's] own wrath came, and the appointed time came for the dead to be judged and to reward your slaves the prophets and the holy ones and those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth." (NWT)


And answer this: If the literal earth was to be destroyed, what about the "heavens"? Are the actual heavens to also be destroyed? All of the stars, the galaxies, the entire universe? Isn't that rather SILLY? There is definitely another way to look at Peter's verses of "burning up" the heavens and the earth. They are definitely symbolic.

Well put onewithim, very clear and scriptural. Once we reason on scripture the future of our planet earthbecomes clearly understandable. Thank you for your contribution,

ECCLESIASTES 1:4 ESV

A generation goes, and a generation comes, but the earth remains forever.

JW

To learn more please go to other posts related to

GOD'S KINGDOM , THE DESTRUCTION OF THIS PLANET and ... THE EARTHLY PARSDISE

[Tcg]

A generation goes, and a generation comes, but the earth remains forever.[/color]

The reality is that when the sun flames out it will take the earth with it.



The earth will not remain forever. Of course it is very likely that humans will have gone extinct long before this event so it won't really matter to any of us.



Tcg

[onewithhim]

[Replying to We_Are_VENOM in post #1743]

No, of course the Flood was not symbolic. And I find it absurd to even consider the thought that God would destroy his whole creation for any reason. If you have bad tenants, do you destroy the house they are renting? No. You get rid of the bad tenants and clean up the mess they left. Do you really go and destroy all the perfectly fine land that the house is built on as well? What kind of Person do you really think God is?

He did indeed wipe all of humanity off the face of the earth except Noah and his family.....to get rid of bad tenants, so to speak. You will notice that He did NOT destroy the earth itself. Jesus said that it would be the same in the last day, and so did Peter. It would be the evil PEOPLE that will be destroyed, and not the planet.

"For just as the days of Noah were, so the presence of the Son of man will be." (Matthew 24:37)

"...There were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and by those means the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the day of judgment and of the destruction of the ungodly men." (2Peter 3:5-7)

If the coming destruction was to be "like the days of Noah," then the physical earth and the rest of the universe would NOT be destroyed, but only "the ungodly" people. Again---the physical earth was not destroyed in Noah's day. The physical earth and the heavens will not be destroyed in the future. Merely the world of evil people and their corrupt "heavens"---their governments.


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