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Replying to post 15 by PinSeeker]
I'm just saying, Riko, that most people out there -- and that includes a whole lot of Christians, as evidenced right here on this forum -- automatically equate the term "prophecy" with "prediction of the future." So they then automatically equate the prophets of the Bible with mere predictors of the future. And that is just simply not the case. Biblical prophecy is not that. Biblical prophecy is relating and/or relaying the God's words to people here on earth. You see it over and over again throughout the Bible:
So what makes them wrong, and you right? Or you wrong, and them right?
The prophets of the Old Testament were the conduits by which God spoke to His people. In that sense, no Old Testament prophet ever "predicted the future."
Which is why in the Micah thread, I was careful enough to say at one point "thanks to God".
Regarding what was said by God through the prophets -- and again, as I said before:
1. Sometimes they were things had already happened, e.g., "I am the Lord your God, Who brought you out of the house of slavery in Egypt...", in which case the were reminders to the Israelites of what God had done for them in the past.
Which trumps which? The supposed words of God, telling us about the past; or the archaeological record, which has precisely nothing to indicate the Hebrews were ever enslaved in Egypt, or wandered around the desert in large numbers for some years?
2. Sometimes they were things that were currently happening, in which case they were reminders to the Israelites that either a) the blessings they were experiencing were from the hand of the Lord, or b) the hardships they were experiencing were because of things they had done to deserve discipline or punishment and a warning and/or exhortation to turn from their evil ways.
What makes these doomsayers, these guys speakers for God, and not other people saying the same thing?
"Repent, for the end is nigh" (or variations thereof) is something that has been said throughout all of history, I'd suspect.
3. Sometimes they were things that God said He was going to do -- in which case even they were not a "prediction," but a warning or a promise (depending on what it was in any particular instance) of things that would come to pass in the short run or the long run (again, depending on what it was).
Pinseeker,
takes off non-existent glasses and lays them on a table...somehow
Why is it you are tap-dancing around this predicting the future business? You're going back and forth from they are word of what is going to happen in the future (in the short run or the long run, as you say just above)...but you also say "even they were not a prediction".
I have a guess for why you're doing this, but I'd like to hear your response. Can you give me a definitive answer, as to what a prophet and/or prophecy is, one way or the other? Can you come down hard as to whether or not "predicting the future" is included?
And just to be clear - no, Jesus's second coming is NOT mentioned in Micah. If one reads the text of Micah and only the text of Micah, there is no mention of this. Any time you have spoken of Micah 5 and the second coming, what you are doing is reading the second coming
into the text, instead of letting the text speak for itself. For example, in Post 7 on my Micah thread, you read the second coming by linking the mention of the woman in labor with something Paul said.
I'd also like it if you could explain what I have to describe is your tortured logic, in saying that verse 5 and 6's military commanders, who are sent by the Israelites to rule Assyria...are the Babylonians. How does it make sense to describe THESE people as having been sent by Israel, or on their behalf, when they took the Israelite people captive in Babylon?
If you can point me to some sort of documentation or something, anything at all that says the Babylonians were in some sort of alliance or league with Israel, only to then betray them...that would be something. However, I have never heard of such a thing (granted, I'm not an archaeologist or historian) and if such a thing did and you were aware of it...you would have brought it up before now, to strengthen your case.
I'd also greatly appreciate it if you could not suggest I read the Bible. I have. Cover to cover. I'm even a member of the "Has read the entire Bible" usergroup.
But you don't have to take my word for it. Read the Bible. You know, instead of just making assessments about it without knowledge.
