Is the Christian God omnipotent?

[otseng]

There are various definitions for omnipotence, but we'll start with this one:

Omnipotence is the quality of having unlimited power.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omnipotence

For debate:
Is the Christian God omnipotent?
What evidence/arguments supports or rejects omnipotence?

[otseng]

The Greek word pantokratr is translated Almighty (9x), omnipotent (1x) in the KJV.

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/le ... 3841&t=KJV

The definition according to the Outline of Biblical Usage is:
1. he who holds sway over all things
2. the ruler of all
3. almighty: God

I wonder why is pantokratr translated only once as omnipotent in the KJV and Almighty in all the other passages.

[Rev 19:6 KJV] 6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.

One possible reason is it wants to distinguish from the word "mighty" that is used in the same verse.

As for any modern translation, I cannot find the word omnipotent used.

[otseng]

The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy provides two senses of omnipotence:

The first is the power to literally do anything. However, this sense is not logical.

One sense of omnipotence is, literally, that of having the power to bring about any state of affairs whatsoever, including necessary and impossible states of affairs.

If this principle is correct, then the foregoing absolute sense of omnipotence is incoherent.

The second is having no other entity with greater power. It makes no claim that the omnipotent entity can do everything, only that it has maximal power. It goes on to suggest it should be the generally accepted definition of omnipotence.

A second sense of omnipotence is that of maximal power, meaning just that no being could exceed the overall power of an omnipotent being. It does not follow that a maximally powerful being can bring about any state of affairs, since, as observed above, bringing about some such states of affairs is impossible.

That a being is omnipotent just provided that its overall power is not possibly exceeded by any being may be adopted as the most general definition of omnipotence in this sense (Hoffman & Rosenkrantz 2010).

[ttruscott]

William: There is no reason to think that The Father is not all knowing in relation to Humanity. For what is all powerful without all knowledge?

Being all powerful is the ability to do with power anything that power can do. It has nothing to do with knowledge in its definition.

[SallyF]

This thread has deteriorated into the standard "what do you mean by" distraction.

The focus is now off the probably imaginary Jehovah/Jesus/Holy Ghost that is not God with a capital G and therefore not omnipotent.

The OP could have asked if the humans who wrote the propaganda/scripture wrote that their God versions were omnipotent.

The designation "Christian God" acknowledges that their are other versions of God

And they can't ALL be God

So some folks are believing in false gods.

Not a soul ever demonstrates that the "Christian Gods" are anything more than imaginary.

No matter WHAT words were used in Greek.

[Willum]

[Replying to post 13 by ttruscott]

Omnipotence means the power to redefine reality and logic.
It means you cannot believe anything about it, because it can change your beliefs.

You often claim freewill, but what barrier is there to the omnipotent just changing their mind? None.

[William]

[Replying to post 13 ]


William: There is no reason to think that The Father is not all knowing in relation to Humanity. For what is all powerful without all knowledge?

ttruscott: Being all powerful is the ability to do with power anything that power can do. It has nothing to do with knowledge in its definition.

William: So your point here is what? That The Father is not omniscient with his omnipotence?

[Diagoras]

The definition according to the Outline of Biblical Usage is:
1. he who holds sway over all things
2. the ruler of all
3. almighty: God

Later:

having no other entity with greater power

And from the OP:

Omnipotence is the quality of having unlimited power.

There are a few different definitions being discussed already, but the idea of God being No. 1 in power is well evidenced from a purely scriptural perspective (he did create the earth and heavens, after all). But from a naturalistic perspective, there are a few bible references which point to Man being at leaat as powerful as God. For example, in Job, we find:

38:16 Hast thou entered into the springs of the sea? or hast thou walked in the search of the depth?
38:17 Have the gates of death been opened unto thee? or hast thou seen the doors of the shadow of death?
38:18 Hast thou perceived the breadth of the earth? declare if thou knowest it all.

Man has reached the bottom of the sea, as well as perceived the breadth of the earth.

There is no strong evidence for God being able to create lasers, helicopters or antibiotics (for example), but we cannot offer that lack of evidence as proof that God lacks the power to do so.

As for ruler of all, that would presumably imply that everyone followed Gods rule. We have evidence for other faiths (and atheists) existing that do not follow Gods rule, therefore we can conclude that God does not fit that particular definition of omnipotent.

[ttruscott]

ttruscott: Being all powerful is the ability to do with power anything that power can do. It has nothing to do with knowledge in its definition.

William: So your point here is what? That The Father is not omniscient with his omnipotence?

They are different aspects of GOD and not to be confused...

[otseng]

And from the OP:

Omnipotence is the quality of having unlimited power.

There are a few different definitions being discussed already

In order for this thread to not run around in circles, we should try to agree to a definition (or limit the number of definitions).

I propose we reject the following definitions:
- the power to literally do anything
- the power to bring about any state of affairs whatsoever, including logically impossible states of affairs

And accept the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy definition:
- omnipotence is maximal power
- no being could exceed the overall power of an omnipotent being

Other proposed definitions are welcome.

[Diagoras]

[Replying to post 19 by otseng]

Seems fair enough.

Noting that weve diminished Gods power from unlimited at the start of the debate to a mere more than anything else by Page 2, wed better wrap this up quickly, less he continues to lose power faster than an old iPhone.