He didnt do it.

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:26 pm

God didn't restore the lost tribes of the northern kingdom to their homeland as he expressly comments in this chapter of Ezekiel.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=NIV
Why not?

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:25 pm

Though all Israel will be saved, but not all will be kings and priests with Christ. They were the first to be offered this, but most rejected Him and that offer.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

How could they have rejected Christ if he himself ushered in the new covenant?

God himself indicates in the OT that He will personally intervene on their behalf to ensure obedience.

He did in the past.

2 Chronicles 30:12

Also in Judah the hand of God was on the people to give them unity of mind to carry out what the king and his officials had ordered, following the word of the Lord

He indicates he will do so in future

Jeremiah 31:33

This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

Christ even prayed that God the Father accomplish this from the disciples forward as a verification of Christ's authenticity.

John 17:23

I in them and you in me"so that they may be brought to complete unity. Then the world will know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me

Would God actually bring to the moment of birth and not give delivery?

Isaiah 66:9

Do I bring to the moment of birth and not give delivery? says the Lord. Do I close up the womb when I bring to delivery? says your God.

If that is the case what assurance should anybody have who would put their hope in him?

tam · Post by **tam** » Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:45 pm

[Replying to post 50 by postroad]

Gentiles?

Note the words of the passage:

Foreigners will join them
and unite with the descendants of Jacob.

This is, again, in keeping with gentiles being grafted in. As well as in Revelation, where is is written that while some of Israel (fleshly) is reserved, a set amount, in order to fulfill the promise to Abraham (the 144 000) - there are also all those from EVERY tribe, nation, people, tongue, who are included in the Great Crowd. Both of these belong to Christ, rule with Christ during the millennial reign.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Sun Apr 10, 2016 6:23 pm

[Replying to post 52 by tam]

And the male and female servants?

Would you agree that the texts originally were understood as having a near fulfillment?

tam · Post by **tam** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 1:09 am

[Replying to post 51 by postroad]

How could they have rejected Christ if he himself ushered in the new covenant?

I'm not sure I am following your line of thought.

Just because someone ushers in a new covenant (mediating a contract between at least two parties), does not mean that no one can refuse to be part of that covenant.

Paul also stated that Israel has experienced a hardening until the full number of the Gentiles comes in. That then all Israel will be saved. So the rejection is not forever.

And the male and female servants?

Christ, Himself, came and served. Those who are in Christ are servants of Christ, and also of God.

Would you agree that the texts originally were understood as having a near fulfillment?

I could not say.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:47 am

[Replying to post 54 by tam]

How could they be guilty for disobedience if God himself hardened their hearts and fulfilled his preordained plan through them? And if God himself preordained the disobedience through a irresistible hardening why could he not do the same for a calling?

Acts 3:12-21New International Version (NIV)

12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: Fellow Israelites, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk? 13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go. 14 You disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you. 15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this. 16 By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus name and the faith that comes through him that has completely healed him, as you can all see.

17 Now, fellow Israelites, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders. 18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer. 19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, 20 and that he may send the Messiah, who has been appointed for you"even Jesus. 21 Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

tam · Post by **tam** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 11:02 am

postroad wrote: [Replying to post 54 by tam]

How could they be guilty for disobedience if God himself hardened their hearts and fulfilled his preordained plan through them? And if God himself preordained the disobedience through a irresistible hardening why could he not do the same for a calling?

Acts 3:12-21New International Version (NIV)

12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: Fellow Israelites, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk? 13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go. 14 You disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you. 15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this. 16 By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus name and the faith that comes through him that has completely healed him, as you can all see.

17 Now, fellow Israelites, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders. 18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer. 19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, 20 and that he may send the Messiah, who has been appointed for you"even Jesus. 21 Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

People harden their own hearts. Including the religious leaders of that time... because Christ testified and revealed their wrongdoing. His truth revealed their lies.

If one hardens one's heart enough times, one is no longer even able to hear the truth. At least for a spell.

God knew that they would do this. God knew them (Israel). It is not the first time that they hardened their hearts (or their would be no warnings to them against doing it)

**

As for your second question, did I not already share the text where that hardening only last a certain amount of time?

So I am not sure what your objection is here. The prophecies and promises all get fulfilled, and was that not the point of the OP?

From the verses you quoted in Acts:

Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:35 pm

tam wrote:
postroad wrote: [Replying to post 54 by tam]

How could they be guilty for disobedience if God himself hardened their hearts and fulfilled his preordained plan through them? And if God himself preordained the disobedience through a irresistible hardening why could he not do the same for a calling?

Acts 3:12-21New International Version (NIV)

12 When Peter saw this, he said to them: Fellow Israelites, why does this surprise you? Why do you stare at us as if by our own power or godliness we had made this man walk? 13 The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, the God of our fathers, has glorified his servant Jesus. You handed him over to be killed, and you disowned him before Pilate, though he had decided to let him go. 14 You disowned the Holy and Righteous One and asked that a murderer be released to you. 15 You killed the author of life, but God raised him from the dead. We are witnesses of this. 16 By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus name and the faith that comes through him that has completely healed him, as you can all see.

17 Now, fellow Israelites, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders. 18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer. 19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord, 20 and that he may send the Messiah, who has been appointed for you"even Jesus. 21 Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.
People harden their own hearts. Including the religious leaders of that time... because Christ testified and revealed their wrongdoing. His truth revealed their lies.

If one hardens one's heart enough times, one is no longer even able to hear the truth. At least for a spell.

God knew that they would do this. God knew them (Israel). It is not the first time that they hardened their hearts (or their would be no warnings to them against doing it)

**

As for your second question, did I not already share the text where that hardening only last a certain amount of time?

So I am not sure what your objection is here. The prophecies and promises all get fulfilled, and was that not the point of the OP?

From the verses you quoted in Acts:

Heaven must receive him until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

No offence to you personally but it seems you are completely immune to any of the concepts presented clearly in the texts?

Even the text you quoted back infers that nothing could happen until the timing of God allowed it to happen.

tam · Post by **tam** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 12:54 pm

[Replying to post 57 by postroad]

Perhaps if you would discuss what it is you are trying to say? You keep setting out passages, and asking me questions about them, but you have engaged in very little discussion on them with me.

When you say that I am immune from concepts "clearly" presented in the texts... what does that mean? That I am 'immune' for seeing it the same way that you see it? Because I have offered texts that support the things that I have said in response to you as well.

I am not offended by anything that you have said, so no worries on that regard. I would say that I simply disagree with how you see things, but I am not entirely sure what I would be disagreeing with. I am not sure what your position is, exactly.

Yes, certain things occur according to a set time, according to God's time-line. Until that time, the door remains open and all are invited to come. May I ask what it is that you are objecting to on the issue of timing? How does that relate to the question of whether or not certain prophecies have been or are still to be fulfilled?

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:49 pm

[Replying to post 58 by tam]

I think I am a bit frustrated because you readily acknowledge a hardening of Israel but will not acknowledge that God did the hardening according to his purpose. In effect they had no choice in the matter. you also believe that they were offered salvation but rejected it.

I offered the texts prophesying that God himself would and could compel people to correct belief. I mean if he could irrevocably compel multiple cities towards destruction surely he could compel people he had chosen into correct belief.

Joshua 11:19-20New International Version (NIV)

19 Except for the Hivites living in Gibeon, not one city made a treaty of peace with the Israelites, who took them all in battle. 20 For it was the Lord himself who hardened their hearts to wage war against Israel, so that he might destroy them totally, exterminating them without mercy, as the Lord had commanded Moses.

Willum · Post by **Willum** » Mon Apr 11, 2016 4:52 pm

[Replying to post 59 by postroad]

What is also very frustrating is that;
Given there was an all powerful god, with a vision for right and wrong, WHO wouldn't gladly follow such a being, just given the least assurance it was its desire?