Jesus' Return

[William]

If there is one belief that seems to thread throughout Christian beliefs as commonly shared, it is that of the return of Jesus.

In pondering on this idea, I am left wondering as to the relevance of it as a belief to hold in today's day and age.

I can understand that up to the age of technology and especially this age of information [the information age] such a belief would not have been able to be easily regarded as overly questionable, but with our current knowledge of the universe we can understand that should the promised event happen, people would be more inclined to regard it as explainable in terms of our current knowledge.

What this means is that if an army of beings descended upon the planet, we would naturally understand these as being extraterrestrial.

In regard to that, we would also be less likely to believe any claims that they were our creators in the sense of having to proclaim them as 'gods' and their leader as 'god' or the representative thereof. In this case, Jesus.

If indeed these beings then got about 'cleaning up the world' of the corrupt war-mongering humans in positions of power, and set up a workable system in which parity becomes the normal, and gave peace a chance, there would still be no reason to worship these beings, (or the single leader) as if they were gods.

If we look at it another way - say humans were the ET and did this to another planetary species - would we not simply consider this to be something we decided we ought to do, and discourage the planets people from worshiping us?

Sure, we would not scorn their respect, and their gratefulness for us using our superior technology and power to overcome those who suppressed them and kept them engaged in systems of disparity, but there would be no reason for us to condone, let alone make it a stipulation that they ought worship us as gods.

Yet the belief through Christian doctrine clearly tells us that this is a stipulation, and those who do not agree to it will be separated from those who do.

It seems to me that there would be a problem with today's current population accepting such stipulation on the grounds that the opportunity afforded by the ET allow for the ability to build a system of parity doesn't and shouldn't require any of us worship the ET as gods. If it did, then the only reason they 'saved' us was so that they could become our new masters, and blackmail us with either accepting their terms or going without.

Q: In relation to the above, how would you respond to ET demanding you worship them as gods, and why?

[William]

[Replying to post 70 by tam]

Ignoring the condescending comment about 'my emotions',

I didn't mention your emotions to condescend Tammy. Just to acknowledge that these are a vital aspect of your belief systems as you have stated...and as we all should know about emotions, these can indeed 'get in the way' if allowed to. It is a human trait which has to be kept in check. Or heads roll and witches burn...

I do not believe that someone who disagrees with my personal beliefs is 'hating' on me. That is ridiculous. I have never said that and I do not believe that.

Again Tammy, I am not going to bother to search for the post where you did in fact bring it into the discussion - in relation to your belief that your master Christ warned his flock of slave sheep that they would be hated on account of him. If you are denying doing so, the reader can find out for themselves as they wish.

Nor is it it up to me to go back and prove how you are misrepresenting me.

It certainly is up to you Tammy, make no mistake therein. You make the claim, you provide the evidence. Or withdraw the claim. Or treat it as invalid, as I have done.

Your choice entirely, but make no bones that if you are going to accuse me of this, then you need to provide the evidence to support that.

[tam]

[Replying to post 71 by William]

Your claim William:

You believe that those who disagree with your personal beliefs are therefore 'hating' on you for that, when clearly what is happening is that your beliefs are being challenged as obviously wrong when examined.

In your own words then: You make the claim, you provide the evidence. Or withdraw the claim.



It is not up to me to find evidence for you of something that I never said.



Peace again to you.

[William]

[Replying to post 72 by tam]

See my previous post Tammy, as it answers adequately. I have nothing more which can be added to that.

[jeremiah1five]

If there is one belief that seems to thread throughout Christian beliefs as commonly shared, it is that of the return of Jesus.

In pondering on this idea, I am left wondering as to the relevance of it as a belief to hold in today's day and age.

I can understand that up to the age of technology and especially this age of information [the information age] such a belief would not have been able to be easily regarded as overly questionable, but with our current knowledge of the universe we can understand that should the promised event happen, people would be more inclined to regard it as explainable in terms of our current knowledge.

What this means is that if an army of beings descended upon the planet, we would naturally understand these as being extraterrestrial.

In regard to that, we would also be less likely to believe any claims that they were our creators in the sense of having to proclaim them as 'gods' and their leader as 'god' or the representative thereof. In this case, Jesus.

If indeed these beings then got about 'cleaning up the world' of the corrupt war-mongering humans in positions of power, and set up a workable system in which parity becomes the normal, and gave peace a chance, there would still be no reason to worship these beings, (or the single leader) as if they were gods.

If we look at it another way - say humans were the ET and did this to another planetary species - would we not simply consider this to be something we decided we ought to do, and discourage the planets people from worshiping us?

Sure, we would not scorn their respect, and their gratefulness for us using our superior technology and power to overcome those who suppressed them and kept them engaged in systems of disparity, but there would be no reason for us to condone, let alone make it a stipulation that they ought worship us as gods.

Yet the belief through Christian doctrine clearly tells us that this is a stipulation, and those who do not agree to it will be separated from those who do.

It seems to me that there would be a problem with today's current population accepting such stipulation on the grounds that the opportunity afforded by the ET allow for the ability to build a system of parity doesn't and shouldn't require any of us worship the ET as gods. If it did, then the only reason they 'saved' us was so that they could become our new masters, and blackmail us with either accepting their terms or going without.

Q: In relation to the above, how would you respond to ET demanding you worship them as gods, and why?

I do not hold that there are ET's out there in space and/or they fulfill the imagery of the book of Revelations and other places in the Scripture that the ascension of Jesus was aided by some technological apparatus or space-ship.

When God saves a person

1 Corinthians 12:10 (KJV) To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

Consider: The gift of discerning of spirits is the ability to recognize and identify the source of spiritual activity or phenomenon in your presence, and there are only three spirits to discern.

Well, four if you divide the one group into two groups:

1. the spirit of elect angels
2. the spirit of fallen angels
3. the spirit of man
4. the Spirit of God.

There four, and no more.

God gave us instruction and guidance in His Word concerning the beings He's created along with man and these are it. No ET's

And when Jesus returns He will return the same manner in which He went up.

Acts 1:11 (KJV)
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

No pre-trib., no mid-trib., no hanging out just outside our atmosphere for 3 and 1/2 years - or 7 years. He went UP.
He comes DOWN.
Just like that.

[StuartJ]

He went UP.
He comes DOWN.
Just like that.

So, where, precisely did he go "UP" to ...?

[jeremiah1five]

He went UP.
He comes DOWN.
Just like that.

So, where, precisely did he go "UP" to ...?

Australia.

No, wait. That's down under.

I kinda like the idea that they are all in Eden, the Garden of God.

Same place where Elijah and Moses and Enoch are.

But then again, NO ONE KNOWS.

And he wasn't beamed up, either.

Or beamed down.

Or you put your right foot in....

You put your right foot out....

Yup. He's at Australia.

All of it.

Some things are not supposed to be known else it would be in Scripture.

Next to Australia.

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 76 by jeremiah1five]

Yup. He's at Australia.

You just may have something there.

https://www.vice.com/en_au/article/kz77 ... s-and-mary

[Clownboat]

If there is one belief that seems to thread throughout Christian beliefs as commonly shared, it is that of the return of Jesus.

In pondering on this idea, I am left wondering as to the relevance of it as a belief to hold in today's day and age.

I can understand that up to the age of technology and especially this age of information [the information age] such a belief would not have been able to be easily regarded as overly questionable, but with our current knowledge of the universe we can understand that should the promised event happen, people would be more inclined to regard it as explainable in terms of our current knowledge.

What this means is that if an army of beings descended upon the planet, we would naturally understand these as being extraterrestrial.

In regard to that, we would also be less likely to believe any claims that they were our creators in the sense of having to proclaim them as 'gods' and their leader as 'god' or the representative thereof. In this case, Jesus.

If indeed these beings then got about 'cleaning up the world' of the corrupt war-mongering humans in positions of power, and set up a workable system in which parity becomes the normal, and gave peace a chance, there would still be no reason to worship these beings, (or the single leader) as if they were gods.

If we look at it another way - say humans were the ET and did this to another planetary species - would we not simply consider this to be something we decided we ought to do, and discourage the planets people from worshiping us?

Sure, we would not scorn their respect, and their gratefulness for us using our superior technology and power to overcome those who suppressed them and kept them engaged in systems of disparity, but there would be no reason for us to condone, let alone make it a stipulation that they ought worship us as gods.

Yet the belief through Christian doctrine clearly tells us that this is a stipulation, and those who do not agree to it will be separated from those who do.

It seems to me that there would be a problem with today's current population accepting such stipulation on the grounds that the opportunity afforded by the ET allow for the ability to build a system of parity doesn't and shouldn't require any of us worship the ET as gods. If it did, then the only reason they 'saved' us was so that they could become our new masters, and blackmail us with either accepting their terms or going without.

Q: In relation to the above, how would you respond to ET demanding you worship them as gods, and why?

I do not hold that there are ET's out there in space and/or they fulfill the imagery of the book of Revelations and other places in the Scripture that the ascension of Jesus was aided by some technological apparatus or space-ship.

When God saves a person

1 Corinthians 12:10 (KJV) To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:

Consider: The gift of discerning of spirits is the ability to recognize and identify the source of spiritual activity or phenomenon in your presence, and there are only three spirits to discern.

Well, four if you divide the one group into two groups:

1. the spirit of elect angels
2. the spirit of fallen angels
3. the spirit of man
4. the Spirit of God.

There four, and no more.

God gave us instruction and guidance in His Word concerning the beings He's created along with man and these are it. No ET's

And when Jesus returns He will return the same manner in which He went up.

Acts 1:11 (KJV)
11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

No pre-trib., no mid-trib., no hanging out just outside our atmosphere for 3 and 1/2 years - or 7 years. He went UP.
He comes DOWN.
Just like that.

I see that you are quoting from your religious promotional book. Obviously, you find it relevant, but in reality and here in this forum specifically, it is not an authority.

Thanks for your personal take on the Trib story though. I'll add it to the dozens I have heard.