One or two?

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Gracchus
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One or two?

Post #1

Post by Gracchus »

In Galatians 2:7 a person named Πέτ�ος (Peter, Latin: rock [Rocky ?]) is mentioned, then in Galatians 2:9 a person named Κηφᾶς (Kephas, Greek: cumin, the aromatic seeds of a plant of the parsley family, used as a spice ) is mentioned. Is there any reason, Biblical or otherwise, to believe these names (likely nick-names) are referring to the same person?

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onewithhim
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Post #21

Post by onewithhim »

Checkpoint wrote: [Replying to post 19 by onewithhim]
So Jesus had no name before coming to Earth and receiving the name "Jesus"? I have no qualms about believing his name was Michael. Why not? He had to have SOME name.
According to both JWs and other believers, before coming to earth his name was "The Word/Logos".
I don't think that is a name. It was a title. Someone is called the President. Is that the person's name?


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Checkpoint
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Post #22

Post by Checkpoint »

onewithhim wrote:
Checkpoint wrote: [Replying to post 19 by onewithhim]
So Jesus had no name before coming to Earth and receiving the name "Jesus"? I have no qualms about believing his name was Michael. Why not? He had to have SOME name.
According to both JWs and other believers, before coming to earth his name was "The Word/Logos".
I don't think that is a name. It was a title. Someone is called the President. Is that the person's name?
Yes, the Word of God is a name, one of the many Jesus now has, Revelation 19:13.

His name is not and was not Michael.

Michael is an arch-angel, has never been and is not the Word or Jesus.

Jesus is superior to all angels, who are commanded to worship him.

It's all right there in Hebrews 1:3-6 and more.

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Post #23

Post by onewithhim »

[Replying to post 22 by Checkpoint]

The "Word" is a title, just like "President" is a title. And Jesus was the archangel. He was most likely the angel that led the Israelites in the pillars of cloud and fire in the wilderness. I have heard born-again Baptists say that. If it was Jesus in the cloud, like some evangelicals have admitted, then, logically, he is an angel.

"Then the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to their rear..." (Exodus 14:19)


Concerning Hebrews chapter 1.....I think there is a distinction there between the Son (the archangel) and "angels," which would be all the angels besides the archangel. The archangel was/is unique and special. What other angelic person deserves the special prominence of being an archangel than Jesus himself? You haven't shown me where "Michael" figures into the Great Tribulation narrative. You say that he is not Jesus, therefore he, as Michael, must be involved in the outcome of the Great Tribulation in the last days. That is what Daniel chapter 12 informs us. Michael stands up for the people, in association with the Great Tribulation. Where is he in Matthew 24 and Luke 21 if not Jesus himself? Can you answer that?



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Post #24

Post by Checkpoint »

onewithhim wrote: [Replying to post 22 by Checkpoint]

The "Word" is a title, just like "President" is a title. And Jesus was the archangel. He was most likely the angel that led the Israelites in the pillars of cloud and fire in the wilderness. I have heard born-again Baptists say that. If it was Jesus in the cloud, like some evangelicals have admitted, then, logically, he is an angel.

"Then the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to their rear..." (Exodus 14:19)


Concerning Hebrews chapter 1.....I think there is a distinction there between the Son (the archangel) and "angels," which would be all the angels besides the archangel. The archangel was/is unique and special. What other angelic person deserves the special prominence of being an archangel than Jesus himself? You haven't shown me where "Michael" figures into the Great Tribulation narrative. You say that he is not Jesus, therefore he, as Michael, must be involved in the outcome of the Great Tribulation in the last days. That is what Daniel chapter 12 informs us. Michael stands up for the people, in association with the Great Tribulation. Where is he in Matthew 24 and Luke 21 if not Jesus himself? Can you answer that?


On this issue, onewithhim, you're like a dog with a bone!

Neither of us is getting anywhere, so I suggest we leave it there, agreeing to disagree.

Are you ok with that?

r1xlx
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Re: One or two?

Post #25

Post by r1xlx »

[Replying to post 1 by Gracchus]

who cares about trivialities of words!
Galatians 2:7 is of no concern to any Christian today.
Stick to the big picture and remember Paul's words.

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Re: One or two?

Post #26

Post by r1xlx »

[Replying to post 7 by onewithhim]

Jesus has never had two names unless you mean Jesus and Christ.
Calling him Michael is Jehovah's Witness cult nonsense.
All Jehovah's Witnesses are doomed for their false doctrines.

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Post #27

Post by onewithhim »

Checkpoint wrote:
onewithhim wrote: [Replying to post 22 by Checkpoint]

The "Word" is a title, just like "President" is a title. And Jesus was the archangel. He was most likely the angel that led the Israelites in the pillars of cloud and fire in the wilderness. I have heard born-again Baptists say that. If it was Jesus in the cloud, like some evangelicals have admitted, then, logically, he is an angel.

"Then the angel of the true God who was going ahead of the camp of Israel departed and went to their rear..." (Exodus 14:19)


Concerning Hebrews chapter 1.....I think there is a distinction there between the Son (the archangel) and "angels," which would be all the angels besides the archangel. The archangel was/is unique and special. What other angelic person deserves the special prominence of being an archangel than Jesus himself? You haven't shown me where "Michael" figures into the Great Tribulation narrative. You say that he is not Jesus, therefore he, as Michael, must be involved in the outcome of the Great Tribulation in the last days. That is what Daniel chapter 12 informs us. Michael stands up for the people, in association with the Great Tribulation. Where is he in Matthew 24 and Luke 21 if not Jesus himself? Can you answer that?


On this issue, onewithhim, you're like a dog with a bone!

Neither of us is getting anywhere, so I suggest we leave it there, agreeing to disagree.

Are you ok with that?

Yes, since you can't show me where the person Michael, who you say is not Jesus, figures in the scenario of the Great Tribulation. We agree to disagree.



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Re: One or two?

Post #28

Post by onewithhim »

r1xlx wrote: [Replying to post 7 by onewithhim]

Jesus has never had two names unless you mean Jesus and Christ.
Calling him Michael is Jehovah's Witness cult nonsense.
All Jehovah's Witnesses are doomed for their false doctrines.
Then tell me how Michael, who is not Jesus, as you say, figures into the scenario of the Great Tribulation as spoken of by Jesus in Matthew 24 and Luke 21. Where is this OTHER PERSON, Michael, mentioned by Jesus, who was describing the Great Tribulation. If Michael was not Jesus, then surely Jesus would speak of him as someone other than himself. You did notice, didn't you, that Michael is involved with the Great Tribulation, as spoken of in Daniel 12:1. So where is he in Jesus' depiction of the Great Tribulation?



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Re: One or two?

Post #29

Post by Checkpoint »

r1xlx wrote: [Replying to post 7 by onewithhim]

Jesus has never had two names unless you mean Jesus and Christ.
Calling him Michael is Jehovah's Witness cult nonsense.
All Jehovah's Witnesses are doomed for their false doctrines.
Doomed?

I know they have some false doctrines, but how does that doom them?

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Post #30

Post by Yahwehismywitness »

Then tell me how Michael, who is not Jesus, as you say, figures into the scenario of the Great Tribulation as spoken of by Jesus in Matthew 24 and Luke 21. Where is this OTHER PERSON, Michael, mentioned by Jesus, who was describing the Great Tribulation. If Michael was not Jesus, then surely Jesus would speak of him as someone other than himself. You did notice, didn't you, that Michael is involved with the Great Tribulation, as spoken of in Daniel 12:1. So where is he in Jesus' depiction of the Great Tribulation?
I will agree his Hebrew name is Yeshua:

But when the archangel Michael, contending with the devil, was disputing about the body of Moses, he did not presume to pronounce a blasphemous judgment, but said, “The Lord rebuke you.� Jude 1:9

Michael leads Yahweh's armies against Satan's forces in the Book of Revelation, where during the war in heaven he defeats Satan.

Jesus is savior not warrior he is worthy to open the book. He is healer and teacher.

Or do you think that I cannot now pray to My Father, and He will provide Me with more than twelve legions of angels? Mathew 26:53

Angels were sent to Jesus after Satan tempted him Mathew 4:11

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