What comes first, family or God?

[nobspeople]

The below link is lengthy (about 60 minutes), but speaks, in part, about how one's religious beliefs in a religion can cause families to fracture. We see this happen in families of no religion, Scientologists, Mormons, Catholics, JWs (as in this example) etc.
While this doesn't always happen, at what point does one (or should one) put their belief system before their family?
Does God command such a thing, or is it something the religion dictates only?

[nobspeople]

Should you shun your family if they don't love God?

No, you should throw stones at them until they're dead.

Deuteronomy 13:6-11

If your brother, the son of your mother, or your son, or your daughter, or the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, entices you secretly, saying, "Lets go and serve other gods"which you have not known, you, nor your fathers; of the gods of the peoples who are around you, near to you, or far off from you, from the one end of the earth even to the other end of the earthyou shall not consent to him nor listen to him; neither shall your eye pity him, neither shall you spare, neither shall you conceal him; but you shall surely kill him. Your hand shall be first on him to put him to death, and afterwards the hands of all the people. You shall stone him to death with stones, because he has sought to draw you away from Yahweh your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. All Israel shall hear, and fear, and shall not do any more wickedness like this among you.

So maybe the JWs are more correct in this matter than the rest of us?

Kidding aside, why, or even HOW, such a loving supreme being that God's said to be could be jealous (feeling or showing envy of someone or their achievements and advantages) make zero sense to me. Is he really that insecure?

Exodus 20:5
"...or I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,"

Deuteronomy 6:15
"For the Lord your God in your midst is a jealous God..."

Seems like insecure overkill. But then again, the bible has stories of God killing (I know, entirely justified of course) so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised?
Still

Yes, I'm not a great fan of the Old Testament. Or indeed, some aspects of the New. Seems to me that the way to go is with Jesus' conception of a loving father of all mankind.

As for JW's, they are clearly a cult. But I tend to the view that any Christian faith at all is better than no faith at all.

Best wishes, 2RM.

I agree totally. That said, most, if not all, religions are cults by the definition of the word 'cult': a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.
While I'm no fan of JWs, Mormons or Scientologists specifically....six of one, a dozen of the other in many regards.

[William]

Should you shun your family if they don't love God?

No, you should throw stones at them until they're dead.

Deuteronomy 13:6-11

If your brother, the son of your mother, or your son, or your daughter, or the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, entices you secretly, saying, "Lets go and serve other gods"which you have not known, you, nor your fathers; of the gods of the peoples who are around you, near to you, or far off from you, from the one end of the earth even to the other end of the earthyou shall not consent to him nor listen to him; neither shall your eye pity him, neither shall you spare, neither shall you conceal him; but you shall surely kill him. Your hand shall be first on him to put him to death, and afterwards the hands of all the people. You shall stone him to death with stones, because he has sought to draw you away from Yahweh your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. All Israel shall hear, and fear, and shall not do any more wickedness like this among you.

So maybe the JWs are more correct in this matter than the rest of us?

Kidding aside, why, or even HOW, such a loving supreme being that God's said to be could be jealous (feeling or showing envy of someone or their achievements and advantages) make zero sense to me. Is he really that insecure?

Exodus 20:5
"...or I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,"

Deuteronomy 6:15
"For the Lord your God in your midst is a jealous God..."

Seems like insecure overkill. But then again, the bible has stories of God killing (I know, entirely justified of course) so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised?
Still

Yes, I'm not a great fan of the Old Testament. Or indeed, some aspects of the New. Seems to me that the way to go is with Jesus' conception of a loving father of all mankind.

As for JW's, they are clearly a cult. But I tend to the view that any Christian faith at all is better than no faith at all.

Best wishes, 2RM.

I agree totally. That said, most, if not all, religions are cults by the definition of the word 'cult': a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.

Not True. Check out what is true here [link]

[nobspeople]

Should you shun your family if they don't love God?

No, you should throw stones at them until they're dead.

Deuteronomy 13:6-11

If your brother, the son of your mother, or your son, or your daughter, or the wife of your bosom, or your friend who is as your own soul, entices you secretly, saying, "Lets go and serve other gods"which you have not known, you, nor your fathers; of the gods of the peoples who are around you, near to you, or far off from you, from the one end of the earth even to the other end of the earthyou shall not consent to him nor listen to him; neither shall your eye pity him, neither shall you spare, neither shall you conceal him; but you shall surely kill him. Your hand shall be first on him to put him to death, and afterwards the hands of all the people. You shall stone him to death with stones, because he has sought to draw you away from Yahweh your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. All Israel shall hear, and fear, and shall not do any more wickedness like this among you.

So maybe the JWs are more correct in this matter than the rest of us?

Kidding aside, why, or even HOW, such a loving supreme being that God's said to be could be jealous (feeling or showing envy of someone or their achievements and advantages) make zero sense to me. Is he really that insecure?

Exodus 20:5
"...or I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me,"

Deuteronomy 6:15
"For the Lord your God in your midst is a jealous God..."

Seems like insecure overkill. But then again, the bible has stories of God killing (I know, entirely justified of course) so I guess I shouldn't be too surprised?
Still

Yes, I'm not a great fan of the Old Testament. Or indeed, some aspects of the New. Seems to me that the way to go is with Jesus' conception of a loving father of all mankind.

As for JW's, they are clearly a cult. But I tend to the view that any Christian faith at all is better than no faith at all.

Best wishes, 2RM.

I agree totally. That said, most, if not all, religions are cults by the definition of the word 'cult': a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.

Not True. Check out what is true here [link]

The above bolded is the main, actual definition of a cult. Thus, most, if not all, religions fall in to this category. Christianity is a cult by this definition as are group beliefs like Scientology and People's Temple.

[William]

You didn't check out the link did you...

[nobspeople]

You didn't check out the link did you...

I did. It opened to another thread here, and I didn't want to read the whole thing TBH.

[William]

You didn't check out the link did you...

I did. It opened to another thread here, and I didn't want to read the whole thing TBH.

Ignorance is no excuse. Your are incorrect about you claim as to what a cult is.

[nobspeople]

You didn't check out the link did you...

I did. It opened to another thread here, and I didn't want to read the whole thing TBH.

Ignorance is no excuse. Your are incorrect about you claim as to what a cult is.

There's always an excuse. Rather or not one thinks it's legitimate is another issue altogether.
I'm not keen on reading through a myriad of opinions from others to get a definition. I go to the source that's not opinion. This site isn't factual and thus, not worth skimming through multiple thoughts from others.
If one wants to say something, say it.
The claim of what a cult is based off the definition, not my own personal opinion and as such, rather or not you accept it or not is your problem, not mine.

[William]

[Replying to nobspeople in post #98]

The definition you used is only part of the story. Do you want the whole truth or just a part of it?

As we can see, a 'cult' in its unadulterated original meaning, described an ordinary [="natural"] manner in which human cultures evolved.
In that sense, one can say that Christianity started out as a "cult" because it involved those things [a set of religious devotional practices that are conventional within their culture, [baptism - bread and wine - serving one another] are related to a particular figure, [Jesus] and are often associated with a particular place. [Jerusalem - Rome - Church(es)]

Where does the pejorative use of the word originate?

The article refers to the more modern use of the word by "anti-cultists" but it is obviously an attitude which has more than one name attached to it.

For example, The Romans regarded early followers of Jesus to being "Christians" and the use of the label then, is the same [has the same motivating attitude behind it] as how the word "Cultists" is used. [today]

As a derogative. As a means of identifying something one distrusts/detests.

If we look at the way the Dominating Religions representatives argued with Jesus, we see clearly enough that they regarded Jesus as a charismatic [popular with common folk] rabble rouser who promoted conflicting religious views to their own well established ones.

If we examine the evolution of the Jewish religions belief systems we clearly see at it origins, a cult, [in the non-derogative sense] and one which appears to have itself derived from within a culture.

We can ascertain by this observation that ALL religions begin as cults and that ALL cults are products of the particular cultures they come out from.

Religion thus, is something which starts out as a cult and eventually becomes the standard generally accepted beliefs the Culture which created it, goes by.

In the case of Jesus and the Jewish religions [in those times, according to the story] he [and most of what he said] was regarded by many of those religious individuals as 'untrue' and ['cultish' using that word in the same vein as it modern use, as a derogatory.]

[nobspeople]

[Replying to William in post #99]

The definition you used is only part of the story.

Good grief.
I'm aware there are multiple definitions to the word. Religion fits within this definition. Why one wants to think it as pejorative is more telling than the definition itself I believe, as it shows a disregard to the definition itself by imparting an emotional state on the word when it's totally unnecessary.
A religion is a cult. Add to it whatever you want. It's irrelevant to the underlying theme.

[William]

A religion is a cult.

Incorrect. A religion is as unto a cult as a child is unto an adult. Calling a religion a cult is simply a way in which to be offensive, since the word is generally regarded today as being derogative.

So it doesn't matter how you claim to be using the word.