Bad things in religion

[nobspeople]

Why do you think God allows bad things to happen to people within religion (whichever religion you think is the right one)?

While it's true these things happen to people outside of religion, let's focus on those within religion.

Christians murder people, cheat on and with others (within or outside of said religion) and molest children, for starters, within a 'God fearing and loving religion'. Why do you think God allows that?

Wouldn't he want his flock to be a beacon unto the world for positive things instead of the end of a pointed and accusatory finger?
Or is the reason why God allows this is that he's working his miracle through all these sinful, hateful, terrible things that are done within his organization for his benefit?

Or is this religion a false religion that God doesn't associate with and thus, has no 'dog in the fight'?

[JoeyKnothead]

From the OP:

Why do you think God allows bad things to happen to people within religion (whichever religion you think is the right one)?

They're gay homosexuals?

...
Or is this religion a false religion that God doesn't associate with and thus, has no 'dog in the fight'?

There's no god in the fight.

[nobspeople]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #2]

They're gay homosexuals?

That's like saying there are white caucasians, or female women, or canine dogs ain't it?

How does this relate to 'bad things in religion' in regards to God allowing bad things to happen within his religion?

[JoeyKnothead]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #2]

They're gay homosexuals?

That's like saying there are white caucasians, or female women, or canine dogs ain't it?

It's a South Park reference. Sometimes just using normal ways to say stuff gets it a bit boring.

How does this relate to 'bad things in religion' in regards to God allowing bad things to happen within his religion?

According to the cited preacher, floods are God's way to punish the gay homosexuals.

The preacher got his property flooded. God allowed a gay homosexual to preach, instead of just rendering him mute fore he got a chance.

[nobspeople]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #4]

Sometimes just using normal ways to say stuff gets it a bit boring.

Sometimes we have to balance boring and the ability to understand correctly, as well.

The preacher got his property flooded..

Some may consider this 'bad', but I'm not one of them

Do you think this is 'God's way' of saying 'those in glass houses...'
Or maybe: 'Shut up, stupid guy!'
Or simply a happy coincidence?

[JoeyKnothead]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #4]

Sometimes just using normal ways to say stuff gets it a bit boring.

Sometimes we have to balance boring and the ability to understand correctly, as well.

I got a 8th grade education and like to fun around with the language.
If folks cant figure it out, I propose they do as you and ask me what I'm getting at.

God allowed a gay homosexual to preach, instead of just rendering him mute fore he got a chance.

How does this equate to priests molesting children, for example?

I'm more curious to know why the topic of homosexuality has you wondering about the pedophilia right away.

I don't know what god has to allow on the pedophiling, so really can't tell much there.

Or a preacher's wife cheating on her preacher husband with another member of the church, for example?

Pends on if she's pretty, and adoing her cheating with me.

Or a church leader killing women after he rapes them, for example?

Hypocrisy is a thing.

These things are things one wouldn't expect to happen within the church itself.

I expect all that and worse to occur when humans gather in groups of an unspecified size. History is rampant with examples of the evils religion may rain down in the name of a "loving god". I just attribute such to a hypocritical mindset moreso than any god.

But yeah, the irony of a preacher carrying on about gay floods, and then getting flooded, that'd keep me laughing were it not for so many christians trying to ram their god-bothering through the courts.

[bjs1]

[Replying to nobspeople in post #1]

This seems like an appropriate time to bring up the free will defense.

God may desire His people to be "a beacon unto the world for positive things." However, God cannot force that upon people.

God cannot create people who are both free and not free.

God can create people who are morally free, and therefor capable of actual good works. But that also means that these people may do terrible things, like murder, abuse, etc.

Or God can create people who are not morally free. Such a person would never harm anyone else, never fail to do good in any setting, and always be a beacon of right behavior. However, that would be more a machine than a person. A machine is neither good nor bad; it just does as it is programed to do. For people to be capable of genuine good deeds they must also be capable of evil deeds.

[nobspeople]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #6]

I got a 8th grade education and like to fun around with the language.
If folks cant figure it out, I propose they do as you and ask me what I'm getting at.

Which I have on occasion. Having fun is great! That's what this site is for: fun, entertainment and 'an experience'

I'm more curious to know why the topic of homosexuality has you wondering about the pedophilia right away.

Oh please . Try again.
I mentioned molesting in the OP. You then provided the anti-gay post later. I suggest you should ask yourself that question.

I don't know what god has to allow on the pedophiling, so really can't tell much there.

Fair enough

I expect all that and worse to occur when humans gather in groups of an unspecified size. History is rampant with examples of the evils religion may rain down in the name of a "loving god". I just attribute such to a hypocritical mindset moreso than any god.

I couldn't agree more. However, do you not think (if God exist) he'd not be too keen on these things happening in his church, tarnishing his name?

But yeah, the irony of a preacher carrying on about gay floods, and then getting flooded, that'd keep me laughing were it not for so many christians trying to ram their god-bothering through the courts.

That and the innocent people suffering in said flood (though most Christians would probably say they aren't innocent I suspect).
Which brings us full circle to the hypocrisy you rightly indicated earlier. Odd how Christianity works, ain't it?

[tam]

Peace to you,

Why do you think God allows bad things to happen to people within religion (whichever religion you think is the right one)?

No religion is the right religion.

Christians murder people, cheat on and with others (within or outside of said religion) and molest children, for starters, within a 'God fearing and loving religion'. Why do you think God allows that?

First, those religions are not from Him. What people do in those religions are a reflection on them (personally) and/or a reflection upon the religion (and what it teaches/brings out in people).

(As well, if God says not to do something, and a person goes ahead and does it, of course that is on them. God gives people the freedom to chose the right and reject the wrong; even to choose life or death. This day I call the heavens and the earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live Deut 30:19)

Wouldn't he want his flock to be a beacon unto the world for positive things instead of the end of a pointed and accusatory finger?

Yes (to not hiding one's lamp, but putting it out there for anyone to see)... but the pointing fingers are going to happen, regardless, just for faith itself. Though none of us are perfect.

Or is the reason why God allows this is that he's working his miracle through all these sinful, hateful, terrible things that are done within his organization for his benefit?

There is no religious organization in our time that God has sanctioned. The only religious organization that He sanctioned (assuming we are speaking of the God and Father of Christ, who I am speaking of), was the Temple/priesthood/law system given through Moses to Israel. Remember how detailed that was? Once Christ came though, we were to listen to Him, to worship in spirit and in truth (we - because Gentiles were also invited to be part of the new covenant, where as the old covenant was between God and Israel, via Moses.) Christ did not organize a new religion though. Consider the intricate and strict instructions from the temple design to the law in the religion God gave through Moses. Christ did not institute anything like that.

Or is this religion a false religion that God doesn't associate with and thus, has no 'dog in the fight'?

Yep, there you go!

I'm not sure it is entirely accurate to say that He has 'no dog in the fight', because people seeking Him (and His Son) can and do get caught up or misled by religion (even if just for a time). Hence, His Son calls, "Come out of her, my people!" His people - His sheep - will hear His voice and come out of 'her', and come to Him. So the 'dog' He would have in the fight would be for his people, for them to come out of 'her' and to come to Christ.

Some people also come out of religion (a multi-headed beast) because they recognize the hypocrisy or the double standards or the falsehoods or the lack of love and the lack of truth, or all of the previous things combined - and they want know part in that. They recognize also that God (some of them might add, 'God, if He does exist') has no part in that. Some of those people might also come to Christ, but not all of them. Some will be too turned off of God because of religion and its abuses (this is the purpose of religion: to stop people from coming to God: either by misleading them into something false or by turning them away from both religion and God).


(There are also people wherever they are - religion or no religion, theist or non-theist - who do the requirements of the law (love) naturally, and who have love as a covering, since love covers over a multitude of sins. So I hope that the reader can see the above statements as being about religion, and not about all the people 'in' it. More than just Christians are invited into the Kingdom. Christians as king-priests with Christ for at least a thousand years; and others as subjects of that Kingdom.)


Peace again to you!

[JoeyKnothead]

[Replying to JoeyKnothead in post #6]
...

I'm more curious to know why the topic of homosexuality has you wondering about the pedophilia right away.

Oh please . Try again.
I mentioned molesting in the OP. You then provided the anti-gay post later. I suggest you should ask yourself that question.

I'm stupid, so there
I read the entire post, but often snip to what I wanna get at. It failed me in front of my adoring public.

So, on the pedophile priests, it does seem as if God is cool with it, considering how so many of his spokesfolks cover up such activities, up to and including failure to report such to proper authorities.

...

I expect all that and worse to occur when humans gather in groups of an unspecified size. History is rampant with examples of the evils religion may rain down in the name of a "loving god". I just attribute such to a hypocritical mindset moreso than any god.

I couldn't agree more. However, do you not think (if God exist) he'd not be too keen on these things happening in his church, tarnishing his name?

He flooded him an entire planet cause he had him a tantrum. He has no shame. He's the Mitch Mcconnell of gods.

But yeah, the irony of a preacher carrying on about gay floods, and then getting flooded, that'd keep me laughing were it not for so many christians trying to ram their god-bothering through the courts.

That and the innocent people suffering in said flood (though most Christians would probably say they aren't innocent I suspect).
Which brings us full circle to the hypocrisy you rightly indicated earlier. Odd how Christianity works, ain't it?

Not so odd, as predictable.

When I think a god's up there, and he's all special, and he made little ol me, how proud am I to know I'm special too!

So, when God harms, that reflects poorly on me. So it wasn't really harm, it was "correction".