Countless Claims to "Answered" Prayer(s)

[POI]

We have countless claims, from Christians, to God/Jesus answering prayers for healing to human affliction(s). And by 'answered' prayer, I mean God/Jesus states -- (yes, I will grant you this prayer request to remove the human affliction).

For Debate:

1. Does God "answer" any of these prayer requests? If not, why?
2. If so, why does God/Jesus perpetually skip the following afflictions (amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, cerebral palsy, dementia, diabetes mellites 1, amputation, muscular dystrophy, hunington's disease, epilepsy, parkinson's disease, paget's disease, motor neuron disease, and so on)?

[1213]

Do you honestly think that if you were to pray to cure such afflictions, God will ever answer yes?

I believe God can answer yes also in those.

...Because these conditions are not curable....

I don't believe they are not curable for God. I can believe it is not possible for you.

...Deep down, you know the most logical answer to this problem is that there exists no God to answer such requests. Right? If not, why not?

How would I know that? Even if I would not see something, it would not mean it can't be so.

[1213]

Your answer, to be frank, is what we used to tell children in our church to make them stop asking questions.

I have nothing against asking questions. I just don't think your answer is automatically correct, if no other answer presented.

[POI]

Do you honestly think that if you were to pray to cure such afflictions, God will ever answer yes?

I believe God can answer yes also in those.

...Because these conditions are not curable....

I don't believe they are not curable for God. I can believe it is not possible for you.

...Deep down, you know the most logical answer to this problem is that there exists no God to answer such requests. Right? If not, why not?

How would I know that? Even if I would not see something, it would not mean it can't be so.

You, my friend, have set yourself up for an unfalsifiable proposition; for which you could just as easily and successfully apply to any competing imaginary agency.

[TRANSPONDER]

Your answer, to be frank, is what we used to tell children in our church to make them stop asking questions.

I have nothing against asking questions. I just don't think your answer is automatically correct, if no other answer presented.

No.That sounds like the 'believe - or not' error again. It isn't about 'the only answer presented', or rather 'the only answer you are willing to accept' (which you then project onto the Other Side). This is the habitual wrongheadedness of the religious, theist and cultist -thinking apologetic.

The correct way is to consider ALL the presented answers (hypotheses) and see which (on evidence and logic) presents the best model of the reality we have reason to think exists, mainly because it is always surprising us.

Back to the drawing board with you.

[brunumb]

...When an outcome aligns with a prayer, the prayer was answered....

And on the other hand, if everything would go exactly as requested in prayer, you could still claim it was not because of God. So, this is pointless debate.

And the way it is now it is exactly the same as if there were no God answering prayers, just deluded believers attributing favorable outcomes to their deity of choice.

[TRANSPONDER]

...When an outcome aligns with a prayer, the prayer was answered....

And on the other hand, if everything would go exactly as requested in prayer, you could still claim it was not because of God. So, this is pointless debate.

And the way it is now it is exactly the same as if there were no God answering prayers, just deluded believers attributing favorable outcomes to their deity of choice.

And our pal will say (I recall, has said) "No, it isn't". Which goes around the denialist circle. "In what way isn't it?"

"God answers prayers."

"How come prayers don't get answered sometimes?"

"Because sometimes God says No."

"Than that is how it would look if nobody was answering prayers at all."

"No it isn't."
Clearly we are getting a faithbased response where there is no evidence for thinking prayers really are answered, but they come out right sometimes and sometimes not, but the believers claim that God is still doing it all. Ok friends, save making skull - shaped dents in the wall. We are never going to convince faithbased denial. We c\an only say to those who are capable of reasoning: "This is how it looks'.

[1213]

...Deep down, you know the most logical answer to this problem is that there exists no God to answer such requests. Right? If not, why not?

How would I know that? Even if I would not see something, it would not mean it can't be so.

You, my friend, have set yourself up for an unfalsifiable proposition; for which you could just as easily and successfully apply to any competing imaginary agency.

I think truth is unfalsifiable always.

But, please explain, how could I know there is no God answering prayers? I don't think ignorance is good enough reason to accept your claim that there is no God answering.

[TRANSPONDER]

...Deep down, you know the most logical answer to this problem is that there exists no God to answer such requests. Right? If not, why not?

How would I know that? Even if I would not see something, it would not mean it can't be so.

You, my friend, have set yourself up for an unfalsifiable proposition; for which you could just as easily and successfully apply to any competing imaginary agency.

I think truth is unfalsifiable always.

But, please explain, how could I know there is no God answering prayers? I don't think ignorance is good enough reason to accept your claim that there is no God answering.

As is usual with theist thought, you have it wrong. Even when (as I remember) it has been explained. Quite aside from 'truth' being unfalsifiable, whatever that means as validated evidence and data is necessarily falsifiable or it is invalid as evidence, you mistake no reason to believe as no reason not to believe.

The burden of proof is on the claimant. God answering prayers is the claim. No good evidence to show that God answers prayers and some telling evidence this doesn't happen and the default theory is that there is no valid reason to think God answersprayers.

It is not 'How can I totally disprove (the possibility of) God answering prayers - despite compelling evidence that prayers aren't really answered?'. It is the best case hypothesis based on the data and evidence is the go-to hypothesis, not clinging to a remote possibility (that is nevertheless a precious faith-claim) until 100% disproved.

Which even then can be dismissed as 'opinion'. But this is the logical error that theism and theist apologists consistently make, every single time. They cannot do other because their mindset is faithbased. They cannot escape from this mental box. And it logically invalidates their arguments right from the start.

There is a whole study to be done how theist faithbased thing has infected political thinking, and denial of what is really known to be true (prayer doesn't work) not because it is believed to be true (they know the election wasn't stolen) but it is necessary to maintain and battle for the lie because it is a dogma of the Group and their hoped for success in getting power,control and authority. Then they can hgave US society just how they like, and that goes for a Christian nation just as much as a Tea party one.

[POI]

Please explain how could I know there is no God answering prayers?

I already did explain. Regardless of how many petitionary and/or intercessory prayers are made to God, folks with Cerebral Palsy, diabetes 1, and amputations will never have their afflictions removed. And yet, in the same amount of time, you will read/hear testimonials to countless claims to answered prayers of conditions which are curable without <the need> for prayer. This is why I specified many afflictions, which will not be answered, in the OP.

I don't think ignorance is good enough reason to accept your claim that there is no God answering.

I get what you are saying. So go check it out. Become not ignorant. Go find me folks where petitionary and/or intercessory prayer requests were made towards people born with Cerebral Palsy, diabetes 1, and people with missing limbs. Find me a case or cases, where prayer reversed these three afflictions. If you should happen to find one, or more, make sure these findings are evidence based and not just more claims.

Please do not instead resort to me proving a negative. Because, if you are, you might as well ask me to disprove Big Foot. "Big Foot could exist, but ignorance does not prove there is no Big Foot." There exist countless claims to Big Foot. And yet, no real evidence of his existence -- (when both you and I likely already agree Big Foot does not exist).

[TRANSPONDER]

We know what is going on. Those who believe things which do not have good evidence (though there is a load of questionable and anecdotal evidence) and as an opponent on another forum once posted 'Bad evidence is still evidence'. Which is why I often talk about good or valid evidence being needed. We do not need the heap of trash apologetic 'could a ton of dubious evidence accumulate into some good evidence?'

"No. A ton of garbage is still garbage".. But those believers asI say believe them on Faith, cannot demonstrate them and so look for Unknowns to act as gaps for God.

These arguments are invalid from the logical and evidential point of view and also the religions because nearly always, it does not tell you which god it is. That gives the game away - they assume a god is there doing stuff in ways we can't detect in actions that don't look like a god is involved anyway (like Jesus doing surgery) and believe or pretend they do (they may know it's an invalid argument) that it is real and true until skeptics disprove it, and they they find another gap to hide it. But where is falls down even more is,...I used this onbe decades ago

"Ok you argument from cosmic origins has convinced me. I accept there is a creator god."

(delighted Believer) "So why don't you come down to the chapel this weekend..?"

"Oh no, I'll be off to the local mosque to ask for incuction."

"What? But it's Jesus, the Christian god that is the creator, not the god of the muslims."

"Ah well, That's something beyond proving a creator. Which creator?"

We know it's faithbased because it never occurs to them that these arguments also apply to other gods than Jesusgod.