Three days /three nights and the Pharisees

[rstrats]

When responding to the Pharisees, why do you suppose the Messiah made the specific point that He would be in the "heart of the earth" for 3 days and 3 nights?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #54]

Maybe for you. Why don't you explain?
Because I happen to know scholars don't agree with you.

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #53]
I think that it doesn't take much brainpower to see that "God-breathed" would mean God "inspired."

Apparently it takes a skosh of intelligence to realize it's still a man writing it, and telling you it's "god-breathed"... And, since we're in your safe space, we have to nod obidiently and say, but he must be telling the truth because the man who runs this site said so.

Sorry, you can't escape the fact that all your knowledge of God, the Bible and Jesus is from what men have told you. Even your own thoughts...

You said that Jesus was just an itinerant preacher who pulled the wool by performing magic tricks. You are just some man, as you say Jesus was, and as you denigrate all men who say that the Bible is true. Maybe your opinion is wrong. You are just a man.

And you didn't explain how Jesus could raise someone from the dead, if he was a fake.

Exactly! I'm glad you are finally agreeing! We all get it from men. The story that Jesus as a con is another story. There are many stories about Jesus told (see the Apocrypha, for example. The Gospel of Judas, etc.) There are millions of stories about gods. They are all true in their way.

As to your last point. Jesus could raise a man from the dead because that's how the story goes. God couldn't defeat the iron chariots because that's how the story goes. Why would you think the story would be different? The Bible is completely accurate and true - as all religious texts are.

If you want to know which stories actually conform to reality, that's a problem. For example, was Jonah really swallowed by a whale? Did God really command the murder of babies and livestock? Did Jesus actually walk on water? Or are they metaphors, or allegories, or hyperbole, etc?

If the Bible is "inspired," what does that actually mean? That there is no allegory at all? Some? All?

For example, did Matthew actually write the Gospel of Matthew, or Paul write 2 Peter? Or was it 'inspired' and therefore not important that they didn't?

I know what you believe - but what is the truth? Even you can't say, nor can you rely on the men telling you one way or another.

I CAN say what the truth is. If someone doesn't want to believe it, that's their prerogative. You say "all religious texts are true." That can't be, because there is one truth. The problem is---which is the true one?

No, they are all true. Ask any believer. They will tell you.

Jonah wasn't swallowed by a whale. It was a big fish. There are reports of men actually swallowed by a very big shark. It can happen.

And lived in it for 3 days? C'mon. But, of course, reality doesn't matter once you believe is the supernatural.

Did Jesus walk on water? If he could form the planets and stars in heaven before coming here, he could certainly walk on water.

Why? Explain the physics behind that. Also, did Jesus do those things - I thought it was Yahweh? Jesus was born in about 4 CE - long after the planets were formed. It appears you don't even know your own chronology...
(Of course, I know you are going to say Yahweh and Jesus are the same... sure, and he's the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, too, right?)
You can believe what you want but perish the notion that you are convincing anyone that you speak the truth.

The Bible does contain metaphors, allegories and hyperbole. It also contains actual events and prophecies. Now, it is true that the Pharisees were a hypocritical and unsavory, cold and selfish bunch. This is true, and Jesus chastised them for it. But then he used allegory to describe the position of the Pharisees with God. Luke 16: 19-31 is a tale of a man that really was in trouble with God, and that pictured the Pharisees. The death of them and Lazarus portrayed a change of position in their lives. Lazarus (portraying the common people) was accepted by God, the Greater Abraham, whereas the Pharisees were not. The fire that is portrayed is not literal fire but the scorching preaching of Jesus and his disciples that revealed the Pharisees as hypocrites. It's all allegory but a story that pertains to something literal---the hypocritical Pharisees vs. the common people.

So I should listen to you when you are a man as well? I can choose, after scrutinizing what is being said and drawing conclusions after gathering all the information, whichever man might be telling me something that I can figure out in my own mind as to what is true. To search for Truth is mandatory if we want to actually live forever.

You accused Jesus of faking a resurrection of dead people. Then tell me how he did such a thing if he was doing "tricks." You don't seem to want to answer that. You made the accusation, now answer the question.

Haven't you seen the videos of holy men in Africa raising the dead? Do you believe they are real or fake? If fake, how did they do it!? If real, then why do we have hospitals?

I asked you to answer my question. (And I do not believe that "holy" men in Africa raise the dead.) Now you tell me, since you made the accusation about Jesus being a fake. (It's the "holy" men that are fakes. Jesus actually raised the dead.) Tell me, how did he do it if he was performing tricks as you say?

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to onewithhim in post #54]

Maybe for you. Why don't you explain?
Because I happen to know scholars don't agree with you.

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #53]
I think that it doesn't take much brainpower to see that "God-breathed" would mean God "inspired."

Apparently it takes a skosh of intelligence to realize it's still a man writing it, and telling you it's "god-breathed"... And, since we're in your safe space, we have to nod obidiently and say, but he must be telling the truth because the man who runs this site said so.

Sorry, you can't escape the fact that all your knowledge of God, the Bible and Jesus is from what men have told you. Even your own thoughts...

You said that Jesus was just an itinerant preacher who pulled the wool by performing magic tricks. You are just some man, as you say Jesus was, and as you denigrate all men who say that the Bible is true. Maybe your opinion is wrong. You are just a man.

And you didn't explain how Jesus could raise someone from the dead, if he was a fake.

Exactly! I'm glad you are finally agreeing! We all get it from men. The story that Jesus as a con is another story. There are many stories about Jesus told (see the Apocrypha, for example. The Gospel of Judas, etc.) There are millions of stories about gods. They are all true in their way.

As to your last point. Jesus could raise a man from the dead because that's how the story goes. God couldn't defeat the iron chariots because that's how the story goes. Why would you think the story would be different? The Bible is completely accurate and true - as all religious texts are.

If you want to know which stories actually conform to reality, that's a problem. For example, was Jonah really swallowed by a whale? Did God really command the murder of babies and livestock? Did Jesus actually walk on water? Or are they metaphors, or allegories, or hyperbole, etc?

If the Bible is "inspired," what does that actually mean? That there is no allegory at all? Some? All?

For example, did Matthew actually write the Gospel of Matthew, or Paul write 2 Peter? Or was it 'inspired' and therefore not important that they didn't?

I know what you believe - but what is the truth? Even you can't say, nor can you rely on the men telling you one way or another.

I CAN say what the truth is. If someone doesn't want to believe it, that's their prerogative. You say "all religious texts are true." That can't be, because there is one truth. The problem is---which is the true one?

No, they are all true. Ask any believer. They will tell you.

Jonah wasn't swallowed by a whale. It was a big fish. There are reports of men actually swallowed by a very big shark. It can happen.

And lived in it for 3 days? C'mon. But, of course, reality doesn't matter once you believe is the supernatural.

Did Jesus walk on water? If he could form the planets and stars in heaven before coming here, he could certainly walk on water.

Why? Explain the physics behind that. Also, did Jesus do those things - I thought it was Yahweh? Jesus was born in about 4 CE - long after the planets were formed. It appears you don't even know your own chronology...
(Of course, I know you are going to say Yahweh and Jesus are the same... sure, and he's the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, too, right?)
You can believe what you want but perish the notion that you are convincing anyone that you speak the truth.

The Bible does contain metaphors, allegories and hyperbole. It also contains actual events and prophecies. Now, it is true that the Pharisees were a hypocritical and unsavory, cold and selfish bunch. This is true, and Jesus chastised them for it. But then he used allegory to describe the position of the Pharisees with God. Luke 16: 19-31 is a tale of a man that really was in trouble with God, and that pictured the Pharisees. The death of them and Lazarus portrayed a change of position in their lives. Lazarus (portraying the common people) was accepted by God, the Greater Abraham, whereas the Pharisees were not. The fire that is portrayed is not literal fire but the scorching preaching of Jesus and his disciples that revealed the Pharisees as hypocrites. It's all allegory but a story that pertains to something literal---the hypocritical Pharisees vs. the common people.

So I should listen to you when you are a man as well? I can choose, after scrutinizing what is being said and drawing conclusions after gathering all the information, whichever man might be telling me something that I can figure out in my own mind as to what is true. To search for Truth is mandatory if we want to actually live forever.

You accused Jesus of faking a resurrection of dead people. Then tell me how he did such a thing if he was doing "tricks." You don't seem to want to answer that. You made the accusation, now answer the question.

Haven't you seen the videos of holy men in Africa raising the dead? Do you believe they are real or fake? If fake, how did they do it!? If real, then why do we have hospitals?

I asked you to answer my question. (And I do not believe that "holy" men in Africa raise the dead.) Now you tell me, since you made the accusation about Jesus being a fake. (It's the "holy" men that are fakes. Jesus actually raised the dead.) Tell me, how did he do it if he was performing tricks as you say?

I think he used CPR. But why do you say the African holy men are fakers? What evidence do you have they did anything different than Jesus did?

Please tell me exactly what they did differently from Jesus?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #62]

The "holy men" of Africa didn't actually raise the dead. Jesus did. That's the difference.

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #62]

The "holy men" of Africa didn't actually raise the dead. Jesus did. That's the difference.

How do you know? Have you checked all the instances? Be honest, you are simply completely skeptical of their claims, aren't you? Why? Can't Christians do all things with God? Or, maybe they used magic, or power from Satan? Why are you so skeptical?

Please, tell me why this is so unbelievable to you?

[onewithhim]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #62]

The "holy men" of Africa didn't actually raise the dead. Jesus did. That's the difference.

How do you know? Have you checked all the instances? Be honest, you are simply completely skeptical of their claims, aren't you? Why? Can't Christians do all things with God? Or, maybe they used magic, or power from Satan? Why are you so skeptical?

Please, tell me why this is so unbelievable to you?

The "holy" men of Africa are not Christians. They are involved up to the eyeballs in voodoo, communicating with demons, etc. They would use power from Satan, but even Satan can't bring back people from the dead. If those African charlatans could actually raise people back to life, wouldn't every one in the world be lined up at their doors?

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #62]

The "holy men" of Africa didn't actually raise the dead. Jesus did. That's the difference.

How do you know? Have you checked all the instances? Be honest, you are simply completely skeptical of their claims, aren't you? Why? Can't Christians do all things with God? Or, maybe they used magic, or power from Satan? Why are you so skeptical?

Please, tell me why this is so unbelievable to you?

The "holy" men of Africa are not Christians. They are involved up to the eyeballs in voodoo, communicating with demons, etc. They would use power from Satan, but even Satan can't bring back people from the dead. If those African charlatans could actually raise people back to life, wouldn't every one in the world be lined up at their doors?

Sigh, then why not people lining up to Christians? But, they do line up in Africa.

Also, can you confirm they were dead - both the people in Africa and in Jesus's time? No, you can't. And thats just one of the problems, isn't it.

It's just a claim. Whether Jesus or Africa, they are just people saying things that you can't know is true or not. You simply decide to believe your religion. That's not a good enough reason - you must realize this, don't you?

[rstrats]

Maybe someone new looking in may have a different idea with regard to the reason for 3 days and 3 nights instead of a some other time frame.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #66]

I don't "just believe my religion." I did a lot of research before I became one of Jehovah's Witnesses. I saw that they agreed with ME. What they taught were things that I had figured out on my own.

People aren't "lining up to be Christians," but they aren't lining up at the "holy" men's doors in Africa either. If they were the real deal, the world would be at their doors. BTW, Christians don't make the claim that they can raise the dead. (Jesus was showing, at that time, by raising the dead, what he will do in the new system of things after Armageddon.)

[boatsnguitars]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #66]

I don't "just believe my religion." I did a lot of research before I became one of Jehovah's Witnesses. I saw that they agreed with ME. What they taught were things that I had figured out on my own.

People aren't "lining up to be Christians," but they aren't lining up at the "holy" men's doors in Africa either. If they were the real deal, the world would be at their doors. BTW, Christians don't make the claim that they can raise the dead. (Jesus was showing, at that time, by raising the dead, what he will do in the new system of things after Armageddon.)

Yeah, a lot of people did "research" for their religion - and - SHOCKER! - the didn't become JW. I'll let the other Christians here convince you that you are wrong. I'm sure you don''t want an atheist telling you that!!!

[onewithhim]

[Replying to boatsnguitars in post #66]

I don't "just believe my religion." I did a lot of research before I became one of Jehovah's Witnesses. I saw that they agreed with ME. What they taught were things that I had figured out on my own.

People aren't "lining up to be Christians," but they aren't lining up at the "holy" men's doors in Africa either. If they were the real deal, the world would be at their doors. BTW, Christians don't make the claim that they can raise the dead. (Jesus was showing, at that time, by raising the dead, what he will do in the new system of things after Armageddon.)

Yeah, a lot of people did "research" for their religion - and - SHOCKER! - the didn't become JW. I'll let the other Christians here convince you that you are wrong. I'm sure you don''t want an atheist telling you that!!!

I don't believe that I am wrong, and no other self-described Christian can convince me that I am. The ones in other religions that claim to be right must know in their heart that what they believe is a farce, if they have truly done research. The ones who have not done research will believe anything their pastor or priest tells them.