Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared??
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #51IS JESUS THE KINGDOM ?
No. Jesus us not the kingdom. The Kingdom is a government. Jesus is the HEAD (the leader) the chief member.. of the government. He's the "Joe Biden" (or if you prefer the..."Donald Trump" ) of the govenment but to say Jesus is the government is incorrect.
If Jesus was the government, this verse would be saying the Jesus will be on Jesus shoulders.
No. Jesus us not the kingdom. The Kingdom is a government. Jesus is the HEAD (the leader) the chief member.. of the government. He's the "Joe Biden" (or if you prefer the..."Donald Trump" ) of the govenment but to say Jesus is the government is incorrect.
No, not according to the bible.
ISAIAH 9:6
For a child will be born for us, a son will be given to us, and the government will be on his shoulders...
If Jesus was the government, this verse would be saying the Jesus will be on Jesus shoulders.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681
"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" - Romans 14:8
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #52It actually is exactly correct, particularly if you're going to use Isaiah 9:6 as your proof text. Neither Donald Trump (despite his best efforts) nor Joe Biden is sovereign. In a monarchy, the sovereign ruler is the government, in the sense of being the one that governs.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 12:12 pmIS JESUS THE KINGDOM ?
No. Jesus us not the kingdom. The Kingdom is a government. Jesus is the HEAD (the leader) the chief member.. of the government. He's the "Joe Biden" (or if you prefer the..."Donald Trump" ) of the govenment but to say Jesus is the government is incorrect.
The word there translated as "government" has a different meaning than you're giving it. Instead of being an individual or group of people responsible for governing, it means the act of governance itself, so the above would be like saying that government is on the government's shoulders. It's confusing, but not incorrect. The word literally means contention and the Septuagint translates the word as dominion. To put the phrases together using words that are distinct and no longer ambiguous (but still correct), we can say that Jesus as king is the government of the Kingdom and the dominion of the Kingdom will be on his shoulders.JehovahsWitness wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 12:12 pmNo, not according to the bible.
If Jesus was the government, this verse would be saying the Jesus will be on Jesus shoulders.ISAIAH 9:6
For a child will be born for us, a son will be given to us, and the government will be on his shoulders...
My pronouns are he, him, and his.
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #53What does the four Gospel Books in the NT is telling us about?konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
Is it not the life, death and resurrection of Jesus?
Is it not the faith to Jesus gives us salvation? Is this not a good news?
I believe that is the gospel or good news. "salvation" to the hopeless world before John 3:16.
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #54No, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #55Can love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #56According to Jesus, if you love Jehovah with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor, you will be saved, (Matthew 22:37-39) because if you truly love Jehovah you will obey Him and do His will. Jesus said that he who does the will of his Father will be on the road to everlasting life, to be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) Joel 2:32 says: "It must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe."Capbook wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 3:16 amCan love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
So love does save people, as long as they love the true God and do His will. (Part of that will is to accept Jesus' sacrifice for sins.)
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #57We are saved by grace through faith, not of works (do we do works because of love? Yes or no?)onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Oct 04, 2024 12:56 pmAccording to Jesus, if you love Jehovah with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor, you will be saved, (Matthew 22:37-39) because if you truly love Jehovah you will obey Him and do His will. Jesus said that he who does the will of his Father will be on the road to everlasting life, to be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) Joel 2:32 says: "It must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe."Capbook wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 3:16 amCan love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
So love does save people, as long as they love the true God and do His will. (Part of that will is to accept Jesus' sacrifice for sins.)
That is to say, we do good works because we are already saved. (Eph 2:10)
I believe those whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, have faith on the Lord. (Joel 2:32)
As faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17)
Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Matt 22:37-39
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Matt 7:21-22
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Joel 2:32
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.
KJV
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #58You picked some good verses, some that I have referred people to. Now, you quoted Joel 2:32 from a version that leaves out Jehovah's name. Do you remember that wherever you see "LORD" in all capital letters, that is where men have substituted "LORD" for "Jehovah." The name is there in the original Hebrew text. Did you know that?Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:40 amWe are saved by grace through faith, not of works (do we do works because of love? Yes or no?)onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Oct 04, 2024 12:56 pmAccording to Jesus, if you love Jehovah with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor, you will be saved, (Matthew 22:37-39) because if you truly love Jehovah you will obey Him and do His will. Jesus said that he who does the will of his Father will be on the road to everlasting life, to be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) Joel 2:32 says: "It must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe."Capbook wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 3:16 amCan love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
So love does save people, as long as they love the true God and do His will. (Part of that will is to accept Jesus' sacrifice for sins.)
That is to say, we do good works because we are already saved. (Eph 2:10)
I believe those whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, have faith on the Lord. (Joel 2:32)
As faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17)
Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Matt 22:37-39
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Matt 7:21-22
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Joel 2:32
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.
KJV
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #59Yes I know, you mentioned "the name in the original Hebrew text", is it Jehovah or YHWH?onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:51 pmYou picked some good verses, some that I have referred people to. Now, you quoted Joel 2:32 from a version that leaves out Jehovah's name. Do you remember that wherever you see "LORD" in all capital letters, that is where men have substituted "LORD" for "Jehovah." The name is there in the original Hebrew text. Did you know that?Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:40 amWe are saved by grace through faith, not of works (do we do works because of love? Yes or no?)onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Oct 04, 2024 12:56 pmAccording to Jesus, if you love Jehovah with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor, you will be saved, (Matthew 22:37-39) because if you truly love Jehovah you will obey Him and do His will. Jesus said that he who does the will of his Father will be on the road to everlasting life, to be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) Joel 2:32 says: "It must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe."Capbook wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 3:16 amCan love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
So love does save people, as long as they love the true God and do His will. (Part of that will is to accept Jesus' sacrifice for sins.)
That is to say, we do good works because we are already saved. (Eph 2:10)
I believe those whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, have faith on the Lord. (Joel 2:32)
As faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17)
Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Matt 22:37-39
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Matt 7:21-22
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Joel 2:32
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.
KJV
Then what's the point?
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Re: What was the gospel/good news that Jesus taught the Apostles to share door to door and is the same currently shared?
Post #60The name in the original Hebrew text is the Tetragrammaton (the Hebrew letters for YHWH) commonly translated as "Jehovah" in English language Bibles.Capbook wrote: ↑Thu Oct 31, 2024 7:34 pmYes I know, you mentioned "the name in the original Hebrew text", is it Jehovah or YHWH?onewithhim wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:51 pmYou picked some good verses, some that I have referred people to. Now, you quoted Joel 2:32 from a version that leaves out Jehovah's name. Do you remember that wherever you see "LORD" in all capital letters, that is where men have substituted "LORD" for "Jehovah." The name is there in the original Hebrew text. Did you know that?Capbook wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:40 amWe are saved by grace through faith, not of works (do we do works because of love? Yes or no?)onewithhim wrote: ↑Fri Oct 04, 2024 12:56 pmAccording to Jesus, if you love Jehovah with all your heart, soul and mind, and your neighbor, you will be saved, (Matthew 22:37-39) because if you truly love Jehovah you will obey Him and do His will. Jesus said that he who does the will of his Father will be on the road to everlasting life, to be saved. (Matthew 7:21-23) Joel 2:32 says: "It must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe."Capbook wrote: ↑Wed Oct 02, 2024 3:16 amCan love save us?onewithhim wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 2:14 pmNo, Paul nor anyone else diluted Christ's message of love. If you read the Gospels and the letters of Paul, James, Peter, etc., you can see that they were very keen on preaching the message of love.konagold3 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 12:13 am Aloha
Is it possible that Christians have Jesus' Gospel [good news] message incorrect or very incomplete??
Jesus sent the Apostles out door to door two by two sharing the Gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven.
Reportedly the people, the folks, heard them gladly.
The current Christian version of the gospel message is too premature to be the good news the Apostles of Jesus shared door to door since Jesus was yet to be put to death.
The current gospel runs along the lines [in part and a condensed version for purpose of this question], that God's only begotten Son, Jesus, died for the sins of mankind; it is only through Jesus sacrifice that mankind, humanity, is forgiven; and one must be saved, redeemed by the blood sacrifice of Jesus and then born again taking Jesus into ones heart and soul to enter eternal life in the kingdom of Heaven.
Given that the Apostles could not accept it when Jesus told them he would die and rise, it would not make sense for the Apostles to have said door to door in folks homes, words to the effect that : "Rabbi Jesus, Teacher, our master, is going to die for your sins to mortify "Our Father,[who, Jesus taught IS love,by the way] to appease a angry God who couldn't get over the default of Adam and Eve in the Garden to not live up to God's command to not partake of the fruit of the tree of knowledge"
Wouldn't it then make more sense if the Apostles door to door message were along the more appealing lines about the love of God that Jesus taught, something like the loving core of Jesus teachings perhaps that God is our Father and we are all members of the family of humanity each of us a child of God; that we are all family because we all have a Creator Parent in common; we should love God; we should love our neighbor as we love ourselves and do unto them as we would have done unto us; that the spirit of God resides in all of us we only need to listen and wholoves each one of us; and by belief in this we have life eternal
So is it possible in the aftermath of the resurrection and in reacting to the resurrection, did Peter and the Apostles and later Paul substitute the Big News for the Good News, thus creating a religion about Jesus rather than teaching folks how to live the religion OF Jesus and diluting His message of love??
Aloha
So love does save people, as long as they love the true God and do His will. (Part of that will is to accept Jesus' sacrifice for sins.)
That is to say, we do good works because we are already saved. (Eph 2:10)
I believe those whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord, have faith on the Lord. (Joel 2:32)
As faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. (Rom 10:17)
Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Matt 22:37-39
37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Matt 7:21-22
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Joel 2:32
32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the Lord hath said, and in the remnant whom the Lord shall call.
KJV
Then what's the point?
What was your point in quoting Joel 2:32?