"Slavery" in the Bible

[POI]

Allow us readers to be very careful. We must make sure we identify the proper context here, to assure against hasty and/or self-serving conclusions.

Exodus 21:2-3:

"2 "If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years. But in the seventh year, he shall go free, without paying anything. 3 If he comes alone, he is to go free alone; but if he has a wife when he comes, she is to go with him." <-- Okay, this seems clear enough, if you are a purchased Hebrew, with a wife, you are both to go free in year 7.

Exodus 21:4:

"4 If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the woman and her children shall belong to her master, and only the man shall go free." <-- Here is where things start to look sketchy for the modern-day believer. If the slave is provided with a wife, and they have kids, the wife and kids are to stay with the slave master. They are not to go free.

Exodus 21:5-6:

"5 "But if the servant declares, I love my master and my wife and children and do not want to go free, 6 then his master must take him before the judges.[a] He shall take him to the door or the doorpost and pierce his ear with an awl. Then he will be his servant for life." <-- More uncomfortability for the Christian here. Without getting into the weeds, common sense suggests a special rule is made to trick the male Hebrew into remaining a slave for life.

Leviticus 25:44-46:

"44 "Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. 45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. 46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly." <-- More awkwardness for the believer, as the Bible reader clammers to find a rationale to make this passage not read the way it does.

Here is a basic definition of chattel slavery --> "Chattel slavery is full slavery in its traditional form whereby slaves are the complete property of their master, can be bought and sold by him and treated in any way that he wishes, which may include torture and other brutality, excessively bad working conditions, and sexual exploitation"

Looks like all the ingredients fit the given Bible description here, minus the torture. Wait a minute, this is covered in the rest of Exodus 21. (i.e.):

"20 "Anyone who beats their male or female slave with a rod must be punished if the slave dies as a direct result, 21 but they are not to be punished if the slave recovers after a day or two, since the slave is their property." <-- So basically, since the slave is your property, beatings with impunity are acceptable. Just don't kill them.

For debate:

By applying common sense, does/did the Bible ever, and/or currently still sanction chattel slavery?

Again, by using common sense, can a believer effectively use the Bible in support of breeding chattel slaves?

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Before you answer, consider this.... Since the NT does not mention the abolition of 'slavery', and yet the Bible makes further proclamation(s) and/or addendums (in favor of retaining 'slavery',) this means the Bible is not against chattel slavery either. Further, the Christian may want to introduce the importance of the 'golden rule'. However, the specifics outweigh the generals. The specifics of the rules for engagement of slavery are outside the 'golden rule'. Otherwise, the Bible would be a one-pager. 'Slavery' is an expressed exception to the general rule. Thus, anytime a specific scenario is not invoked, yes, 'golden rule.'

[POI]

Repost from 493.

Just for fun... Let's see if we can find all the ways in which this content creator is:

a) being deliberately misleading...
b) completely ignorant to the book he studies

The video is less than 5 minutes.



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7 "FACTS" given by this sleazy content creator:

1) God did not create slavery, but regulated it.
2) The purpose of slavery in the Bible was to help the poor
3) In the Hebrew culture, slavery was volitional
4) Kidnapping was not permitted
5) Slavery was limited to 6 years, (in a safe and loving environment)
6) Masters were to treat their slaves with respect
7) Israelites are servants

[1213]

How is it possible to 'love as told in the Bible' when the Bible condones/endorses a) lifetime chattel slavery and b) slave breeding?

If you don't know, it is better, if you don't have slaves.

I've already spoke to this in post 334, point 7). Please try again. Further, you know darn well what William means when he states 'slave' (i.e.): "a person who is forced to work for and obey another and is considered to be their property; an enslaved person."

Yes, I fully know that people are hypocrites when they try to explain that the modern slavery is somehow better than the old one.

[William]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

1) The Bible can be used to endorse chattel slavery.
2) The Bible can be used to endorse slave breeding.

I do not think either of those statements can be considered true anymore. But certainly once upon a time...

[POI]

How is it possible to 'love as told in the Bible' when the Bible condones/endorses a) lifetime chattel slavery and b) slave breeding?

If you don't know, it is better, if you don't have slaves.

No really, is there some 'good' form of lifetime chattel slavery and slave breeding that you know about, in which I do not? I'd like to learn what it is.

I've already spoke to this in post 334, point 7). Please try again. Further, you know darn well what William means when he states 'slave' (i.e.): "a person who is forced to work for and obey another and is considered to be their property; an enslaved person."

Yes, I fully know that people are hypocrites when they try to explain that the modern slavery is somehow better than the old one.

I'm speaking about lifetime chattel slavery and slave breeding, as defined in the OP. You are instead trying to water down the term, and/or muddy the waters, to remove accountability. Tsk tsk...

[POI]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

1) The Bible can be used to endorse chattel slavery.
2) The Bible can be used to endorse slave breeding.

I do not think either of those statements can be considered true anymore. But certainly once upon a time...

Okay, so we agree 1) and 2) did apply. Why do you think they no longer apply?

[William]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

1) The Bible can be used to endorse chattel slavery.
2) The Bible can be used to endorse slave breeding.

I do not think either of those statements can be considered true anymore. But certainly once upon a time...

Okay, so we agree 1) and 2) did apply. Why do you think they no longer apply?

Primarily because that is a past aspect of human development which has been streamlined in such a way that the offspring of the ancient slave owners have created a system where the offspring of the slaves now willingly comply and actual pay to be slaves. There is no going back in that regard.

In order for the bible endorsement of such slavery to regain any authority on the matter, society would have to break down considerably and revert to former methods...which I find highly unlikely.

[POI]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

1) The Bible can be used to endorse chattel slavery.
2) The Bible can be used to endorse slave breeding.

I do not think either of those statements can be considered true anymore. But certainly once upon a time...

Okay, so we agree 1) and 2) did apply. Why do you think they no longer apply?

Primarily because that is a past aspect of human development which has been streamlined in such a way that the offspring of the ancient slave owners have created a system where the offspring of the slaves now willingly comply and actual pay to be slaves. There is no going back in that regard.

In order for the bible endorsement of such slavery to regain any authority on the matter, society would have to break down considerably and revert to former methods...which I find highly unlikely.

Sounds like you are saying that later Christians no longer think lifetime chattel slavery and slave breeding is acceptable?

[William]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

1) The Bible can be used to endorse chattel slavery.
2) The Bible can be used to endorse slave breeding.

I do not think either of those statements can be considered true anymore. But certainly once upon a time...

Okay, so we agree 1) and 2) did apply. Why do you think they no longer apply?

Primarily because that is a past aspect of human development which has been streamlined in such a way that the offspring of the ancient slave owners have created a system where the offspring of the slaves now willingly comply and actual pay to be slaves. There is no going back in that regard.

In order for the bible endorsement of such slavery to regain any authority on the matter, society would have to break down considerably and revert to former methods...which I find highly unlikely.

Sounds like you are saying that later Christians no longer think lifetime chattel slavery and slave breeding is acceptable?

More to the point I am saying that whether they do or don't is no longer relevant to what actually is. Slavery has shifted in how it is applied in the world. Christians and non Christians are all slaves re the application.

Do you think that slavery still exists today in a different form?
If so, why focus only on the biblical version while ignoring the modern application?
If not, what do you define as "slavery," and how do you distinguish it from modern economic and systemic coercion?

[POI]

More to the point I am saying that whether they do or don't is no longer relevant to what actually is. Slavery has shifted in how it is applied in the world. Christians and non Christians are all slaves re the application.

The OT condones slavery. The NT reinforces slavery without outright condemning said slavery. If the NT never mentioned slavery again, Christians might be able to argue that such laws no longer apply with NT law and beyond. However, the Bible believer is stuck, in the sense that slavery is an accepted action in the NT too. The Christian is now forces to rationalize this reality. Hence, the reason we see videos, like the aforementioned one in post 561.

[POI]

Do you think that slavery still exists today in a different form?

I think the point is missed here... 'Slavery', as mentioned in the Bible, is "really bad" from a modern Christian's perspective. And yet, it was endorsed/condoned. For example, the Bible condemns "lying", evening though we humans might be able to justify all sorts of lies. I'd reckon if many people were polled and ask what's worse between 'slavery' and 'lying', 'slavery' would either be unanimously worse, or at least tied. And yet, the Bible does not condemn such practices like the Bible does for "lying".

In a nutshell, this entire topic would have been completely avoided if the Bible never condoned owning and breeding humans as property. Further, Christians, as of the late 1800's, could use the Bible to support their actions regarding slavery.