Revelation 1:1

[placebofactor]

The most corrupted verse besides John 1:1, found in the N.W.T. is in Revelation 1:1. The N.W.T. is the only Bible I know of that has corrupted both verses. The book of Revelation was written about 96 or 98 A.D. It is the discovery of hidden things given by the Father to Jesus Christ; that Christ gave to his angel, and that it was shown to John and that John sent it to the churches.

The K.J.B. reads, “The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gave unto him (his Son), to show unto his (Jesus) servants things which must shortly come to pass; (semicolon) and he (Jesus) sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: who (John) bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he (John) saw.”

Now the N.W.T. has, “A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gave him, to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place. (period) And he sent forth his angel and presented (it) in signs through him to his slave John.”

“The Revelation” verses “A revelation.” In their Kingdom Interlinear Translation, it reads, “Revelation of Jesus Christ.” So, in order to fit their teaching instead of “The” they decided “A revelation” would support their teaching far better.

The Witnesses have changed “of Jesus Christ” to “by Jesus Christ,” making him the messenger, and not the object of this revelation.

They also changed upper case “Revelation” to lower case “revelation.” A revelation indicates there will be more revelations to come, and this revelation is not about Jesus but the Father.

“The Revelation” indicates this will be the only revelation coming, and that Jesus is revealed as a glorious King empowered to reward and to punish.”

Over the years, the Witnesses have claimed to receive new light and new insights into the Father’s plans. Maybe that’s why they had to revive their Bible four times since 1961, claiming to have received new light in each copyright. They claim this is not a revelation about Jesus but of the Father.

In their “Aid to Bible Understanding” 1971 edition they have it, “Revelation of Jesus Christ,” and of his glory.” It’s obvious, they wrote, “A revelation” to agree with their teaching.

The following is from a red-letter edition of the K.J.B. Red-letter means Jesus is speaking.
K.J.B. He said, Revelation 1:8 “I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending said the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.”

The N.W.T. claims it’s the Father speaking. Here’s how they have it written in their Bible. Revelation 1:8, “I am Alpha and Omega,” says Jehovah God, “the One who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty.” They have added “Jehovah,” and changed Lord to “the One.” Why did they change Lord to One? Because it’s spelled Lord, not LORD. Lord would mean it was speaking about the Son of God, not the Father.
Your thoughts.

[placebofactor]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #7]

The words "mighty god" refer to Jesus, yes, but that "god" is El Gibbohr. The Father is El Shaddai, which means God Almighty. Jesus is never referred to as El Shaddai. Jesus is a mighty god, as is brought out at John 1:1, but not God Almighty.

A noun always dominates, not the adjective. God is the noun, mighty in the case of Isaiah 9:6, is one of many of Jesus' characteristics or titles.

Jesus never ever refers to himself as God Almighty. In fact, he says to the Father that He, the Father, is the "only true God." (John 17:3) Why don't you take his words seriously?

Jesus sure did in the book of Revelation. It's "The" Revelation of Jesus Christ." Jesus said in Revelation 1:8, (Red letter addition) K.J.B. "I (personal pronoun) am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, said the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." Only Jesus is to come, not the Father. Revelation 22:20, "He which testifieth these things said, surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus."

Song of Solomon, 8:14, "Make haste, my beloved, and be thou like to a roe (gazelle) or to a young hart (stag) upon the mountains of spices."

[onewithhim]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #7]

The words "mighty god" refer to Jesus, yes, but that "god" is El Gibbohr. The Father is El Shaddai, which means God Almighty. Jesus is never referred to as El Shaddai. Jesus is a mighty god, as is brought out at John 1:1, but not God Almighty.

A noun always dominates, not the adjective. God is the noun, mighty in the case of Isaiah 9:6, is one of many of Jesus' characteristics or titles.

Jesus never ever refers to himself as God Almighty. In fact, he says to the Father that He, the Father, is the "only true God." (John 17:3) Why don't you take his words seriously?

Jesus sure did in the book of Revelation. It's "The" Revelation of Jesus Christ." Jesus said in Revelation 1:8, (Red letter addition) K.J.B. "I (personal pronoun) am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, said the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." Only Jesus is to come, not the Father. Revelation 22:20, "He which testifieth these things said, surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus."

Song of Solomon, 8:14, "Make haste, my beloved, and be thou like to a roe (gazelle) or to a young hart (stag) upon the mountains of spices."

Sorry, but Revelation 1:8 is the Father getting a word in. The red letters are actually spurious and confusing. The Father, who is God, would naturally say something in the book of Revelation, because, after all, it is He who told Jesus what to say, as you can see in verse 1. Why should he not interject a word or two about Himself?

The Father is to come as well. There is a joint coming as foretold in the book of Malachi, chapter 3 and verse 5. (Remember that wherever the LORD appears with all caps, that is where Jehovah's name was originally.)

[placebofactor]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #7]

The words "mighty god" refer to Jesus, yes, but that "god" is El Gibbohr. The Father is El Shaddai, which means God Almighty. Jesus is never referred to as El Shaddai. Jesus is a mighty god, as is brought out at John 1:1, but not God Almighty.

A noun always dominates, not the adjective. God is the noun, mighty in the case of Isaiah 9:6, is one of many of Jesus' characteristics or titles.

Jesus never ever refers to himself as God Almighty. In fact, he says to the Father that He, the Father, is the "only true God." (John 17:3) Why don't you take his words seriously?

Jesus sure did in the book of Revelation. It's "The" Revelation of Jesus Christ." Jesus said in Revelation 1:8, (Red letter addition) K.J.B. "I (personal pronoun) am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, said the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." Only Jesus is to come, not the Father. Revelation 22:20, "He which testifieth these things said, surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus."

Song of Solomon, 8:14, "Make haste, my beloved, and be thou like to a roe (gazelle) or to a young hart (stag) upon the mountains of spices."

Sorry, but Revelation 1:8 is the Father getting a word in. The red letters are actually spurious and confusing. The Father, who is God, would naturally say something in the book of Revelation, because, after all, it is He who told Jesus what to say, as you can see in verse 1. Why should he not interject a word or two about Himself?

The Father is to come as well. There is a joint coming as foretold in the book of Malachi, chapter 3 and verse 5. (Remember that wherever the LORD appears with all caps, that is where Jehovah's name was originally.)

The red letter edition may be confusing to you, but not to millions and millions of Christians who use it.

Let's clarify one thing first, what rendering are you referring to concerning Revelation 1:1. I will emphasize the differences with black.

K.J.B. "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gav unto him, to shew unto his servants ---." Or,

N.W.T. "A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gave him, to show his slaves,---."

Another huge difference between our understanding is that, for the most part, the God of the Old Testament that met, walked, talked, ate, wrestled, and instructed the ancient prophets is Jesus Christ, not the Father. Until this is settled, there can be little agreement between us.

If you wish to continue, we need two points of agreement. Do you agree or disagree with the following;

1. No man has seen the Father at any time,
2. No man has heard the Father voice. Both are Old Testament verses. I will wait for your answer.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to placebofactor in post #7]

The words "mighty god" refer to Jesus, yes, but that "god" is El Gibbohr. The Father is El Shaddai, which means God Almighty. Jesus is never referred to as El Shaddai. Jesus is a mighty god, as is brought out at John 1:1, but not God Almighty.

A noun always dominates, not the adjective. God is the noun, mighty in the case of Isaiah 9:6, is one of many of Jesus' characteristics or titles.

Jesus never ever refers to himself as God Almighty. In fact, he says to the Father that He, the Father, is the "only true God." (John 17:3) Why don't you take his words seriously?

Jesus sure did in the book of Revelation. It's "The" Revelation of Jesus Christ." Jesus said in Revelation 1:8, (Red letter addition) K.J.B. "I (personal pronoun) am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, said the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty." Only Jesus is to come, not the Father. Revelation 22:20, "He which testifieth these things said, surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus."

Song of Solomon, 8:14, "Make haste, my beloved, and be thou like to a roe (gazelle) or to a young hart (stag) upon the mountains of spices."

Sorry, but Revelation 1:8 is the Father getting a word in. The red letters are actually spurious and confusing. The Father, who is God, would naturally say something in the book of Revelation, because, after all, it is He who told Jesus what to say, as you can see in verse 1. Why should he not interject a word or two about Himself?

The Father is to come as well. There is a joint coming as foretold in the book of Malachi, chapter 3 and verse 5. (Remember that wherever the LORD appears with all caps, that is where Jehovah's name was originally.)

The red letter edition may be confusing to you, but not to millions and millions of Christians who use it.

Let's clarify one thing first, what rendering are you referring to concerning Revelation 1:1. I will emphasize the differences with black.

K.J.B. "The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gav unto him, to shew unto his servants ---." Or,

N.W.T. "A revelation by Jesus Christ, which God (the Father) gave him, to show his slaves,---."

Another huge difference between our understanding is that, for the most part, the God of the Old Testament that met, walked, talked, ate, wrestled, and instructed the ancient prophets is Jesus Christ, not the Father. Until this is settled, there can be little agreement between us.

If you wish to continue, we need two points of agreement. Do you agree or disagree with the following;

1. No man has seen the Father at any time,
2. No man has heard the Father voice. Both are Old Testament verses. I will wait for your answer.

1. Agree

2. What is the OT verse for this?

[Capbook]

The N.W.T. claims it’s the Father speaking. Here’s how they have it written in their Bible. Revelation 1:8, “I am Alpha and Omega,” says Jehovah God, “the One who is and who was and who is coming, the Almighty.” They have added “Jehovah,” and changed Lord to “the One.” Why did they change Lord to One? Because it’s spelled Lord, not LORD. Lord would mean it was speaking about the Son of God, not the Father.
Your thoughts.

I wonder if JW would say that Jesus was wrong when He said John 5:37.
That they have not heard the voice of the Father "at any time" (ever).
Through context was Jesus talking to the Pharisees only?
Bible lexicon defined word "at any time" in Greek "popote" means ever.
Then, who utter Rev 1:8, the Almighty?


Jhn 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

πώποτε pōpote
Thayer Definition:
1) ever, at any time

Why would we possibly say that Jesus was wrong? It's interesting that Jesus said that the Father bore witness of HIM. That's what Revelation is all about, though the Father, who is inspiring the book of Revelation, would include references to Himself. Isn't that a fair statement? It's from God, about Jesus, and all the things to come to pass. The Father refers to himself as the Almighty at Rev.1:8.

Do you believe what Jesus said in John 5:37, that no one ever heard the Father voice at anytime except when He borne witness of Jesus baptism?

I believe that is true.

As you agree that the only exception was when the Father's voice was heard from heaven during Jesus baptism, do that means that it was Jesus who said the Rev 1:8 then.

[onewithhim]

I wonder if JW would say that Jesus was wrong when He said John 5:37.
That they have not heard the voice of the Father "at any time" (ever).
Through context was Jesus talking to the Pharisees only?
Bible lexicon defined word "at any time" in Greek "popote" means ever.
Then, who utter Rev 1:8, the Almighty?


Jhn 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

πώποτε pōpote
Thayer Definition:
1) ever, at any time

Why would we possibly say that Jesus was wrong? It's interesting that Jesus said that the Father bore witness of HIM. That's what Revelation is all about, though the Father, who is inspiring the book of Revelation, would include references to Himself. Isn't that a fair statement? It's from God, about Jesus, and all the things to come to pass. The Father refers to himself as the Almighty at Rev.1:8.

Do you believe what Jesus said in John 5:37, that no one ever heard the Father voice at anytime except when He borne witness of Jesus baptism?

I believe that is true.

As you agree that the only exception was when the Father's voice was heard from heaven during Jesus baptism, do that means that it was Jesus who said the Rev 1:8 then.

No, it was Jehovah. He gave the Revelation to Jesus, after all, and Jehovah obviously instructed Jesus and his angel what to say. Why wouldn't He get a few words in about Himself on occasion?

[placebofactor]

Why would we possibly say that Jesus was wrong? It's interesting that Jesus said that the Father bore witness of HIM. That's what Revelation is all about, though the Father, who is inspiring the book of Revelation, would include references to Himself. Isn't that a fair statement? It's from God, about Jesus, and all the things to come to pass. The Father refers to himself as the Almighty at Rev.1:8.

Do you believe what Jesus said in John 5:37, that no one ever heard the Father voice at anytime except when He borne witness of Jesus baptism?

I believe that is true.

As you agree that the only exception was when the Father's voice was heard from heaven during Jesus baptism, do that means that it was Jesus who said the Rev 1:8 then.

No, it was Jehovah. He gave the Revelation to Jesus, after all, and Jehovah obviously instructed Jesus and his angel what to say. Why wouldn't He get a few words in about Himself on occasion?

He doesn't need to be heard or seen. When you see and hear Jesus, you have seen and heard the Father. The Son alone declares the Father.