Can you please provide evidence for the following Biblical events?
1. Creation Miracles (Genesis 1–3)
Creation of the universe: God creates light, sky, land, seas, plants, stars, animals, and humans in six days.
Creation of angels: Implied in passages like Job 38:4–7; often considered an early act before physical creation.
Creation of Adam and Eve: God forms Adam from dust and breathes life into him; Eve is made from Adam’s rib.
Creation of other organisms: All species of plants and animals are said to have been created by divine command.
The Garden of Eden: A paradise created for Adam and Eve.
The Fall: The serpent speaks; Adam and Eve eat forbidden fruit and are evicted from Eden; curses are pronounced.
2. Early Genesis Miracles
The mark and protection of Cain (Genesis 4:15).
The longevity of pre-Flood humans (many living 900+ years).
Noah’s Flood (Genesis 6–9): God floods the entire world, saving only Noah, his family, and the animals in the ark.
The rainbow covenant: God sets a rainbow as a sign of the promise never again to flood the earth.
Confusion of languages at Babel (Genesis 11): Humanity’s speech is divided, and people scatter across the world.
3. Miracles in the Patriarchal Era (Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph)
Call of Abram: God speaks directly to Abram (Genesis 12).
Destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah: Fire and brimstone from heaven (Genesis 19).
Lot’s wife turned to salt (Genesis 19:26).
Birth of Isaac to elderly Sarah (Genesis 21).
God’s testing of Abraham: A ram provided in place of Isaac (Genesis 22).
Jacob’s ladder dream and wrestling with God (Genesis 28; Genesis 32).
Joseph’s prophetic dreams and interpretations (Genesis 37–41).
4. Miracles of Moses and the Exodus
The burning bush (Exodus 3).
Staff turned into a serpent (Exodus 4).
The Ten Plagues on Egypt (Exodus 7–12):
1. Water to blood
2. Frogs
3. Gnats or lice
4. Flies
5. Livestock disease
6. Boils
7. Hail
8. Locusts
9. Darkness
10. Death of the firstborn
The Passover protection (Israelites spared).
Parting of the Red Sea (Exodus 14).
Pillar of cloud by day and fire by night, guiding Israel.
Manna and quail were provided in the wilderness.
Water from the rock (Exodus 17).
Mount Sinai theophany: God’s voice, thunder, lightning, and tablets of stone.
Bronze serpent healing (Numbers 21).
Aaron’s rod budding (Numbers 17).
Moses’ radiant face after speaking with God (Exodus 34).
5. Miracles in the Time of Joshua, Judges, and Kings
Jordan River stops flowing so Israel can cross (Joshua 3).
Walls of Jericho fall (Joshua 6).
The sun stands still (Joshua 10).
Gideon’s fleece tests (Judges 6).
Samson’s strength feats (Judges 14–16).
Fire consumes Elijah’s offering on Mount Carmel (1 Kings 18).
Elijah raises the widow’s son (1 Kings 17).
Elijah was taken up to heaven in a whirlwind (2 Kings 2).
Elisha parts the Jordan, purifies water, multiplies oil, raises the Shunammite’s son, feeds 100 men with loaves, heals Naaman’s leprosy, and makes an iron axe-head float (2 Kings 2–6).
The shadow on the sundial goes backwards for King Hezekiah (2 Kings 20).
Angelic destruction of the Assyrian army (2 Kings 19).
Daniel’s survival in the lions’ den (Daniel 6).
Three men survive the fiery furnace (Daniel 3).
Handwriting on the wall (Daniel 5).
6. Miracles in the Intertestamental and New Testament Era
Zechariah was struck mute until John the Baptist’s birth (Luke 1).
Virgin (immaculate) conception of Jesus by the Holy Spirit (Matthew 1; Luke 1).
Star of Bethlehem guiding the Magi (Matthew 2).
Angelic announcements to Mary, Joseph, and the shepherds.
John the Baptist’s prophetic calling before birth.
7. Miracles Performed by Jesus
Turning water into wine (John 2).
Healing the sick, blind, deaf, and lame (many Gospels).
Cleansing lepers (Matthew 8).
Casting out demons (Mark 5, etc.).
Feeding 5,000 (Matthew 14) and feeding 4,000 (Matthew 15).
Walking on water (Matthew 14).
Calming the storm (Mark 4).
Raising Jairus’s daughter (Mark 5).
Healing the centurion’s servant (Matthew 8).
Healing the bleeding woman (Mark 5).
Restoring sight to Bartimaeus (Mark 10).
Raising Lazarus from the dead (John 11).
The Transfiguration (Matthew 17).
Paying temple tax with a coin in a fish’s mouth (Matthew 17).
Cursing the barren fig tree (Mark 11).
The resurrection of Jesus (Matthew 28; Mark 16; Luke 24; John 20).
Post-resurrection appearances (Luke 24; John 21).
Ascension into heaven (Acts 1).
8. Miracles in the Acts of the Apostles
Tongues of fire and the gift of languages at Pentecost (Acts 2).
Peter and John heal a lame man (Acts 3).
Peter raises Tabitha (Dorcas) from the dead (Acts 9).
Paul blinds and heals various people (Acts 13–28).
Earthquake freeing Paul and Silas from prison (Acts 16).
Paul survives a viper bite (Acts 28).
Philip’s teleportation (Acts 8).
Ananias and Sapphira were struck dead for lying (Acts 5).
9. Apocalyptic and Prophetic Miracles
Visions of Heaven and angels (Revelation 4–5).
Trumpet and bowl judgments: cosmic catastrophes, locusts, plagues, blood rivers, darkness.
Two witnesses calling down fire (Revelation 11).
The New Jerusalem descending from heaven (Revelation 21).
Creation of a new heaven and new earth (Revelation 21–22).
God dwelling with humanity eternally - the final miracle of restoration.
Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #11[Replying to 1213 in post #10]
Thank you for your continued engagement. The key difference between our approaches is this: I treat possible explanations as hypotheses that must make testable, consistent predictions. You treat them as open guesses that need only be conceivable. I’ll respond point by point.
1. On “dead soldiers can’t writeâ€
True, but surviving soldiers, enemies, and neighbours do. Ancient archives mention losing armies, famines, and disasters precisely because other scribes, traders, and rival nations recorded them. A cataclysm drowning of Egypt’s entire army and changing sea levels would have left economic, political, and archaeological traces. None exist.
2. On “genetic bottleneck 6000 years agoâ€
There was a local reduction in Y-chromosome diversity about 5 to 7,000 years ago - linked to social hierarchies, not a global wipe-out. Mitochondrial DNA, nuclear variation, and archaeological continuity all show unbroken population lines across Africa, East Asia, and the Americas going back tens of thousands of years. If only eight people had lived 6000 years ago, we would all share identical segments across the genome; we do not. If only Noah’s family survived a global flood about 6,000 years ago, then every man alive today would have inherited Noah’s Y-chromosome lineage. That’s how genetic transmission works: one surviving male line causes one Y-DNA haplogroup. But we don’t see that. Modern genetics identifies thousands of distinct Y-chromosome lineages branching back over at least 200,000 years. They cluster geographically and correlate with archaeological population continuity across Africa, Asia, and the Americas long before the supposed flood. This isn’t interpretation; it’s direct, measurable data. The existence of multiple, ancient Y-chromosome haplogroups: A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, O, P, Q, R, S, T, and others completely rules out the idea that all men descend from a single male just a few thousand years ago. That’s 100% proof that the Noah’s-Ark story is fiction.
3. On “Egyptians buying food after the plagueâ€
Inventing unrecorded trades to patch textual contradictions isn’t evidence. The text itself says “all the livestock of Egypt died.†If every animal died, there were none left to trade with until after the plagues - long after the Exodus timeline. Historical reasoning prefers explanations that fit the text and the data without additional stories.
4. On flood deposits
“Depending on how the flood happened … it would have left the result we can see.†That reverses cause and effect: the description is adjusted after seeing the rocks. Science starts with the rocks and tests whether a single-year flood reproduces them. It doesn’t. Layers differ in mineral content, isotope ratios, volcanic ash horizons, and pollen sequences—independent clocks that cannot form in one event.
5. On “no picture of neatly stacked fossilsâ€
Stratigraphy is not museum shelving; fossils are embedded within sediments that change laterally. You can view continuous sequences at the Grand Canyon, Dorset’s Jurassic Coast, or China’s Yixian Formation—marine in the lower layers, terrestrial higher, mammals only near the top. Geologic column diagrams are published in every introductory geology text; they are the “images†you seek.
6. On Foucault’s pendulum and tides
Gravitational pull from the Sun and Moon produces twice-daily tides; the pendulum’s rotation rate varies with latitude exactly as predicted by Earth’s rotation and not by tidal cycles. If gravity alone caused it, the swing direction would change with lunar position; it doesn’t. That’s why the pendulum remains one of the simplest independent proofs of Earth’s spin.
7. On satellites and orbital mechanics
GPS timing requires relativistic corrections of about 38 microseconds per day. Those corrections work only if Earth rotates and orbits the Sun. If the Earth were stationary, those signals would drift miles per day. Every phone and plane navigation system would fail. They don’t.
8. On stellar parallax
Parallax was predicted centuries before it was measured. It shifts proportionally to 1/distance and reverses every six months—the exact geometry of Earth’s orbit. To claim “something else†causes it, one must describe that mechanism, quantify it, and show that it produces the same numerical pattern. No such alternative exists.
9. On skepticism and standards
Questioning is good. But healthy skepticism demands better explanations, not infinite “maybes.†When every contradictory idea is called “possible,†knowledge stops. When hypotheses are tested, corrected, and cross-checked, knowledge grows.
10. Summary
1. Extraordinary global events such as Noah's flood require global traces; they’re absent.
2. Modern genetics, geology, and astronomy all converge independently based on evidence; none depend on faith in “current ideas.â€
3. Real skepticism updates with evidence - it doesn’t retreat into endless “maybes.â€
Suspending belief until data appear is reasonable; rejecting all data because belief in Christianity comes first is not.
Thank you for your continued engagement. The key difference between our approaches is this: I treat possible explanations as hypotheses that must make testable, consistent predictions. You treat them as open guesses that need only be conceivable. I’ll respond point by point.
1. On “dead soldiers can’t writeâ€
True, but surviving soldiers, enemies, and neighbours do. Ancient archives mention losing armies, famines, and disasters precisely because other scribes, traders, and rival nations recorded them. A cataclysm drowning of Egypt’s entire army and changing sea levels would have left economic, political, and archaeological traces. None exist.
2. On “genetic bottleneck 6000 years agoâ€
There was a local reduction in Y-chromosome diversity about 5 to 7,000 years ago - linked to social hierarchies, not a global wipe-out. Mitochondrial DNA, nuclear variation, and archaeological continuity all show unbroken population lines across Africa, East Asia, and the Americas going back tens of thousands of years. If only eight people had lived 6000 years ago, we would all share identical segments across the genome; we do not. If only Noah’s family survived a global flood about 6,000 years ago, then every man alive today would have inherited Noah’s Y-chromosome lineage. That’s how genetic transmission works: one surviving male line causes one Y-DNA haplogroup. But we don’t see that. Modern genetics identifies thousands of distinct Y-chromosome lineages branching back over at least 200,000 years. They cluster geographically and correlate with archaeological population continuity across Africa, Asia, and the Americas long before the supposed flood. This isn’t interpretation; it’s direct, measurable data. The existence of multiple, ancient Y-chromosome haplogroups: A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, O, P, Q, R, S, T, and others completely rules out the idea that all men descend from a single male just a few thousand years ago. That’s 100% proof that the Noah’s-Ark story is fiction.
3. On “Egyptians buying food after the plagueâ€
Inventing unrecorded trades to patch textual contradictions isn’t evidence. The text itself says “all the livestock of Egypt died.†If every animal died, there were none left to trade with until after the plagues - long after the Exodus timeline. Historical reasoning prefers explanations that fit the text and the data without additional stories.
4. On flood deposits
“Depending on how the flood happened … it would have left the result we can see.†That reverses cause and effect: the description is adjusted after seeing the rocks. Science starts with the rocks and tests whether a single-year flood reproduces them. It doesn’t. Layers differ in mineral content, isotope ratios, volcanic ash horizons, and pollen sequences—independent clocks that cannot form in one event.
5. On “no picture of neatly stacked fossilsâ€
Stratigraphy is not museum shelving; fossils are embedded within sediments that change laterally. You can view continuous sequences at the Grand Canyon, Dorset’s Jurassic Coast, or China’s Yixian Formation—marine in the lower layers, terrestrial higher, mammals only near the top. Geologic column diagrams are published in every introductory geology text; they are the “images†you seek.
6. On Foucault’s pendulum and tides
Gravitational pull from the Sun and Moon produces twice-daily tides; the pendulum’s rotation rate varies with latitude exactly as predicted by Earth’s rotation and not by tidal cycles. If gravity alone caused it, the swing direction would change with lunar position; it doesn’t. That’s why the pendulum remains one of the simplest independent proofs of Earth’s spin.
7. On satellites and orbital mechanics
GPS timing requires relativistic corrections of about 38 microseconds per day. Those corrections work only if Earth rotates and orbits the Sun. If the Earth were stationary, those signals would drift miles per day. Every phone and plane navigation system would fail. They don’t.
8. On stellar parallax
Parallax was predicted centuries before it was measured. It shifts proportionally to 1/distance and reverses every six months—the exact geometry of Earth’s orbit. To claim “something else†causes it, one must describe that mechanism, quantify it, and show that it produces the same numerical pattern. No such alternative exists.
9. On skepticism and standards
Questioning is good. But healthy skepticism demands better explanations, not infinite “maybes.†When every contradictory idea is called “possible,†knowledge stops. When hypotheses are tested, corrected, and cross-checked, knowledge grows.
10. Summary
1. Extraordinary global events such as Noah's flood require global traces; they’re absent.
2. Modern genetics, geology, and astronomy all converge independently based on evidence; none depend on faith in “current ideas.â€
3. Real skepticism updates with evidence - it doesn’t retreat into endless “maybes.â€
Suspending belief until data appear is reasonable; rejecting all data because belief in Christianity comes first is not.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #12The neighbors were at home and the whole army drowned. The neighbors at home would not have known what happened to the army.Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 am ...True, but surviving soldiers, enemies, and neighbours do. Ancient archives mention losing armies, famines, and disasters precisely because other scribes, traders, and rival nations recorded them. A cataclysm drowning of Egypt’s entire army and changing sea levels would have left economic, political, and archaeological traces. None exist...
I think the archaeological traces exist. All you have to do is to go to look in the place where the crossing place is marked with two large ancient red granite pillars (close Nuweiba, Gulf of Aqaba), on opposing sides of the water. There is interesting seabed formation that looks like cleared for troops to move. Traces of Egyptian wheels can be found there, which fit to the Exodus story. Coral formations that have grown over wheels and chariots. There is also bronze found inside coral formations, which is not natural. Also bones can be found in the area that fits to the Biblical story. If you want to see the evidence, I recommend to read the book The Exodus Case.
Is it not possible they have come after Noah? Why?Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 am...The existence of multiple, ancient Y-chromosome haplogroups: A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M, N, O, P, Q, R, S, T, and others completely rules out the idea that all men descend from a single male just a few thousand years ago....[/b]
All Egyptian livestock, not what the Jews had.Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 am Inventing unrecorded trades to patch textual contradictions isn’t evidence. The text itself says “all the livestock of Egypt died.â€
If you can really see continuous sequences at the Grand Canyon, Dorset’s Jurassic Coast, or China’s Yixian Formation, is that not the evidence for a global flood?Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 amStratigraphy is not museum shelving; fossils are embedded within sediments that change laterally. You can view continuous sequences at the Grand Canyon, Dorset’s Jurassic Coast, or China’s Yixian Formation—marine in the lower layers, terrestrial higher, mammals only near the top. Geologic column diagrams are published in every introductory geology text; they are the “images†you seek.
By what I see, the movement changes by how the sun and moon travels. And it depends on the latitude, on what "track" sun and moon moves in relation to the pendulum. If the sun and moon goes directly above, the effect is not the same as if sun doesn't go directly above. We should expect the rotation to vary, if it is by the gravitational forces.Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 amGravitational pull from the Sun and Moon produces twice-daily tides; the pendulum’s rotation rate varies with latitude exactly as predicted by Earth’s rotation and not by tidal cycles. If gravity alone caused it, the swing direction would change with lunar position; it doesn’t. ...
Or the corrections are required, because the whole thing is based on wrong information.Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 amGPS timing requires relativistic corrections of about 38 microseconds per day. Those corrections work only if Earth rotates and orbits the Sun. ...
As long as other options are possible, it is not reasonable to call own belief a fact.Compassionist wrote: ↑Fri Oct 17, 2025 8:28 amBut healthy skepticism demands better explanations, not infinite “maybes.†When every contradictory idea is called “possible,†knowledge stops.
My new book can be read freely from here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view
Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view
Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #13[Replying to 1213 in post #12]
Thank you for continuing the dialogue. I’ll reply point by point.
1. “The neighbours were at home … they wouldn’t know what happened to the army.â€
Even if the locals didn’t witness the drowning itself, subsequent effects would have been obvious:
A sudden loss of Egypt’s army would have left massive political, military, and economic disruption, recorded by surrounding powers (Hittites, Canaanites, Phoenicians, Babylonians). Egyptian scribes kept detailed yearly military and economic accounts on papyri and stelae. No break appears in the 18th- or 19th-dynasty records. No mass graves, armour caches, or weapon dumps from that era appear anywhere near the Gulf of Aqaba. Absence of every expected trace is positive evidence against the Exodus-scale drowning.
2. “Coral-covered chariot wheels near Nuweiba / read The Exodus Caseâ€
These stories originate with Ron Wyatt, an untrained amateur whose alleged finds have never been verified by any geologist, marine archaeologist, or museum. Multiple independent dives by the Israeli Geological Survey, Egyptian Antiquities Authority, and National Geographic found no artifacts or human remains beyond natural coral formations. Coral can mimic wheel-like shapes; it grows around any object. None of the supposed “wheels†were retrieved, dated, or authenticated.
Peer-reviewed archaeology on Sinai and the Gulf of Aqaba shows:
No Late-Bronze-Age Egyptian military debris.
No cultural layer of Hebrew settlement from that period.
No desert campsites for hundreds of thousands of people.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not self-published anecdotes.
3. “Could Y-chromosome haplogroups have come after Noah?â€
No.
Y-DNA mutation rates are directly measured across generations. The deepest splits among haplogroups (A–T) date over 200,000 years by multiple calibration methods (pedigree, ancient DNA, and coalescent modelling).
To derive them all from a single male only a few thousand years ago would require mutation rates thousands of times faster than observed and would erase existing genetic diversity.
Modern genetics falsifies the idea of a single male ancestor in the Bronze Age.
4. “All Egyptian livestock died - maybe it meant only Egyptian, not Hebrew.â€
The text says “all the livestock of Egypt died†(Exodus 9:6), yet later describes Egyptian livestock alive and struck again (Exodus 9:19–25). Inventing unrecorded “exceptions†is an ad-hoc rescue, not exegesis. If the plague narrative requires constant special pleading to stay coherent, the simplest explanation is mythic storytelling, not honest reportage.
5. “Continuous rock layers prove a global flood.â€
Quite the opposite. If a single global flood had laid down all sediments simultaneously, we’d find one homogeneous layer containing a global mix of marine, terrestrial, and aerial species all jumbled together.
Instead, we find:
Ordered ecological succession (marine → amphibian → reptile → mammal).
Distinct micro-fossil assemblages and volcanic ash horizons are used to correlate strata globally.
Radiometric dating confirms hundreds of millions of years of deposition.
The Grand Canyon, Dorset, and Yixian are continuous in local sections but represent different time periods, not one flood.
6. “Pendulum motion comes from the Sun and Moon’s gravity.â€
A Foucault pendulum's precession rate is ω = Ω sin φ, where Ω is Earth’s rotation rate and φ the latitude.
That equation correctly predicts:
360° rotation per sidereal day at the poles.
Zero at the equator.
The Sun–Moon gravitational torque is orders of magnitude too weak and would vary hourly with lunar phase - yet the pendulum’s rate stays constant regardless of lunar position.
This is direct physical proof of Earth’s rotation, independent of astronomy.
7. “GPS corrections might just be based on wrong information.â€
GPS satellites each carry atomic clocks. Their signals must be corrected for:
Special relativity: clocks moving at 14,000 km/h tick slower by ≈ -7 µs/day.
General relativity: weaker gravity in orbit makes them tick faster by ≈ +45 µs/day.
Net correction ≈ +38 µs/day - exactly the figure used in engineering.
If Earth were stationary or relativity false, GPS positions would drift 10 km per day.
They don’t. The system’s consistent accuracy is empirical confirmation of relativity and planetary motion.
8. “As long as other options are possible, belief can’t be called fact.â€
Possibility is infinite; knowledge is what survives testing. To keep every conceivable idea “possible†even after contradictory evidence appears is unjustified skepticism, not open-mindedness. Science does not claim infallible certainty; it claims the best supported model given all available data. When every competing story fails quantitative tests, calling the surviving model “fact†is not arrogance - it’s accuracy.
No verified archaeological evidence supports an Exodus drowning or global flood.
Genetic, geological, and astronomical data all contradict young-Earth and stationary-Earth models.
“Maybe scientists are wrong†is not evidence; it’s a refusal to engage with evidence.
Reasonable skepticism proportions belief to demonstration.
Until independently reproducible data appear for a stationary Earth or a global deluge, those remain mythological stories, not competing scientific hypotheses.
Thank you for continuing the dialogue. I’ll reply point by point.
1. “The neighbours were at home … they wouldn’t know what happened to the army.â€
Even if the locals didn’t witness the drowning itself, subsequent effects would have been obvious:
A sudden loss of Egypt’s army would have left massive political, military, and economic disruption, recorded by surrounding powers (Hittites, Canaanites, Phoenicians, Babylonians). Egyptian scribes kept detailed yearly military and economic accounts on papyri and stelae. No break appears in the 18th- or 19th-dynasty records. No mass graves, armour caches, or weapon dumps from that era appear anywhere near the Gulf of Aqaba. Absence of every expected trace is positive evidence against the Exodus-scale drowning.
2. “Coral-covered chariot wheels near Nuweiba / read The Exodus Caseâ€
These stories originate with Ron Wyatt, an untrained amateur whose alleged finds have never been verified by any geologist, marine archaeologist, or museum. Multiple independent dives by the Israeli Geological Survey, Egyptian Antiquities Authority, and National Geographic found no artifacts or human remains beyond natural coral formations. Coral can mimic wheel-like shapes; it grows around any object. None of the supposed “wheels†were retrieved, dated, or authenticated.
Peer-reviewed archaeology on Sinai and the Gulf of Aqaba shows:
No Late-Bronze-Age Egyptian military debris.
No cultural layer of Hebrew settlement from that period.
No desert campsites for hundreds of thousands of people.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not self-published anecdotes.
3. “Could Y-chromosome haplogroups have come after Noah?â€
No.
Y-DNA mutation rates are directly measured across generations. The deepest splits among haplogroups (A–T) date over 200,000 years by multiple calibration methods (pedigree, ancient DNA, and coalescent modelling).
To derive them all from a single male only a few thousand years ago would require mutation rates thousands of times faster than observed and would erase existing genetic diversity.
Modern genetics falsifies the idea of a single male ancestor in the Bronze Age.
4. “All Egyptian livestock died - maybe it meant only Egyptian, not Hebrew.â€
The text says “all the livestock of Egypt died†(Exodus 9:6), yet later describes Egyptian livestock alive and struck again (Exodus 9:19–25). Inventing unrecorded “exceptions†is an ad-hoc rescue, not exegesis. If the plague narrative requires constant special pleading to stay coherent, the simplest explanation is mythic storytelling, not honest reportage.
5. “Continuous rock layers prove a global flood.â€
Quite the opposite. If a single global flood had laid down all sediments simultaneously, we’d find one homogeneous layer containing a global mix of marine, terrestrial, and aerial species all jumbled together.
Instead, we find:
Ordered ecological succession (marine → amphibian → reptile → mammal).
Distinct micro-fossil assemblages and volcanic ash horizons are used to correlate strata globally.
Radiometric dating confirms hundreds of millions of years of deposition.
The Grand Canyon, Dorset, and Yixian are continuous in local sections but represent different time periods, not one flood.
6. “Pendulum motion comes from the Sun and Moon’s gravity.â€
A Foucault pendulum's precession rate is ω = Ω sin φ, where Ω is Earth’s rotation rate and φ the latitude.
That equation correctly predicts:
360° rotation per sidereal day at the poles.
Zero at the equator.
The Sun–Moon gravitational torque is orders of magnitude too weak and would vary hourly with lunar phase - yet the pendulum’s rate stays constant regardless of lunar position.
This is direct physical proof of Earth’s rotation, independent of astronomy.
7. “GPS corrections might just be based on wrong information.â€
GPS satellites each carry atomic clocks. Their signals must be corrected for:
Special relativity: clocks moving at 14,000 km/h tick slower by ≈ -7 µs/day.
General relativity: weaker gravity in orbit makes them tick faster by ≈ +45 µs/day.
Net correction ≈ +38 µs/day - exactly the figure used in engineering.
If Earth were stationary or relativity false, GPS positions would drift 10 km per day.
They don’t. The system’s consistent accuracy is empirical confirmation of relativity and planetary motion.
8. “As long as other options are possible, belief can’t be called fact.â€
Possibility is infinite; knowledge is what survives testing. To keep every conceivable idea “possible†even after contradictory evidence appears is unjustified skepticism, not open-mindedness. Science does not claim infallible certainty; it claims the best supported model given all available data. When every competing story fails quantitative tests, calling the surviving model “fact†is not arrogance - it’s accuracy.
No verified archaeological evidence supports an Exodus drowning or global flood.
Genetic, geological, and astronomical data all contradict young-Earth and stationary-Earth models.
“Maybe scientists are wrong†is not evidence; it’s a refusal to engage with evidence.
Reasonable skepticism proportions belief to demonstration.
Until independently reproducible data appear for a stationary Earth or a global deluge, those remain mythological stories, not competing scientific hypotheses.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #14I think the Ipuwer Papyrus is Egyptian version of the Exodus.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 am ...Even if the locals didn’t witness the drowning itself, subsequent effects would have been obvious:
A sudden loss of Egypt’s army would have left massive political, military, and economic disruption, recorded by surrounding powers (Hittites, Canaanites, Phoenicians, Babylonians). Egyptian scribes kept detailed yearly military and economic accounts on papyri and stelae. No break appears in the 18th- or 19th-dynasty records. No mass graves, armour caches, or weapon dumps from that era appear anywhere near the Gulf of Aqaba. Absence of every expected trace is positive evidence against the Exodus-scale drowning.
Actually the book the Exodus case is by Dr Lennart Möller. I don't think it has anything to do with Ron Wyatt. And it shows images of the evidence. So, to me it is more credible than what the deniers have.
People have observed things a very short time. I have no reason to believe they know the rates of mutations accurately.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 am...To derive them all from a single male only a few thousand years ago would require mutation rates thousands of times faster than observed and would erase existing genetic diversity.
Modern genetics falsifies the idea of a single male ancestor in the Bronze Age...
The text tells the livestock of Jews didn't die. It is not reasonable to assume Egyptians would not have done anything to get new livestock, for example from Jews.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 amThe text says “all the livestock of Egypt died†(Exodus 9:6), yet later describes Egyptian livestock alive and struck again (Exodus 9:19–25). Inventing unrecorded “exceptions†is an ad-hoc rescue, not exegesis. If the plague narrative requires constant special pleading to stay coherent, the simplest explanation is mythic storytelling, not honest reportage.
Only if you don't understand how it happened.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 amQuite the opposite. If a single global flood had laid down all sediments simultaneously...
I think that is silly, if you believe it causes the tides. And if it is because of suns pulling, it should be near zero on equator, because there the direction of force can't twist the movement as much as in higher latitudes.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 am360° rotation per sidereal day at the poles.
Zero at the equator.
The Sun–Moon gravitational torque is orders of magnitude too weak and would vary hourly with lunar phase ...
If people would know the matters correctly, why would there be the need for the corrections as you say? I think the need of corrections proves they have some wrong assumptions.Compassionist wrote: ↑Sun Oct 19, 2025 8:23 am If Earth were stationary or relativity false, GPS positions would drift 10 km per day.
They don’t. The system’s consistent accuracy is empirical confirmation of relativity and planetary motion.
No verified information supports your claims against the Bible.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #15[Replying to 1213 in post #14]
Ipuwer Papyrus: It’s a Middle Kingdom lament (c. 1850 BCE) describing general social disorder, not plagues or an exodus. It predates the alleged Exodus by centuries and fits a well-known literary genre of “lamentations,†not eyewitness history.
The Exodus Case: Dr Möller repeats Ron Wyatt’s unverified claims. None of those “finds†have been authenticated or published in any peer-reviewed archaeology journal. The Israel Geological Survey and Egyptian Antiquities Authority found only natural coral formations—no chariots, no bones, no artifacts.
Mutation rates: They’re measured directly from living families and ancient DNA. The deepest Y-DNA splits date ≈ 200,000 years. Compressing that into 4,000 years would require biologically impossible mutation speeds that would destroy heredity itself.
Livestock: Exodus 9:6 says “all the livestock of Egypt died.†The next verses describe more Egyptian livestock dying days later. Inventing imports from Israel isn’t in the text - it’s a post-hoc repair.
Flood layers: A global flood would leave one mixed layer of marine, land, and air species all together. Instead we find an orderly progression through time - marine below, land above, mammals at the top - dated consistently by multiple methods.
Pendulum: The Foucault pendulum’s rotation rate matches ω = Ω sin φ at every latitude. Tidal gravity from the Moon is billions of times too weak and would vary hourly, which it doesn’t.
GPS: The relativistic corrections were predicted in advance and make the system work. Without Earth’s rotation and orbital motion, GPS positions would drift ~10 km/day; they don’t.
Evidence and burden: Archaeology and physics are verifiable. No independent evidence confirms a global flood, a mass Egyptian drowning, or a stationary Earth. Saying “maybe scientists are wrong†isn’t evidence - it’s just doubt without data. I have already spoken at a previous post about applying the same standard of evidence to all claims. You are not doing this, but I am.
Ipuwer Papyrus: It’s a Middle Kingdom lament (c. 1850 BCE) describing general social disorder, not plagues or an exodus. It predates the alleged Exodus by centuries and fits a well-known literary genre of “lamentations,†not eyewitness history.
The Exodus Case: Dr Möller repeats Ron Wyatt’s unverified claims. None of those “finds†have been authenticated or published in any peer-reviewed archaeology journal. The Israel Geological Survey and Egyptian Antiquities Authority found only natural coral formations—no chariots, no bones, no artifacts.
Mutation rates: They’re measured directly from living families and ancient DNA. The deepest Y-DNA splits date ≈ 200,000 years. Compressing that into 4,000 years would require biologically impossible mutation speeds that would destroy heredity itself.
Livestock: Exodus 9:6 says “all the livestock of Egypt died.†The next verses describe more Egyptian livestock dying days later. Inventing imports from Israel isn’t in the text - it’s a post-hoc repair.
Flood layers: A global flood would leave one mixed layer of marine, land, and air species all together. Instead we find an orderly progression through time - marine below, land above, mammals at the top - dated consistently by multiple methods.
Pendulum: The Foucault pendulum’s rotation rate matches ω = Ω sin φ at every latitude. Tidal gravity from the Moon is billions of times too weak and would vary hourly, which it doesn’t.
GPS: The relativistic corrections were predicted in advance and make the system work. Without Earth’s rotation and orbital motion, GPS positions would drift ~10 km/day; they don’t.
Evidence and burden: Archaeology and physics are verifiable. No independent evidence confirms a global flood, a mass Egyptian drowning, or a stationary Earth. Saying “maybe scientists are wrong†isn’t evidence - it’s just doubt without data. I have already spoken at a previous post about applying the same standard of evidence to all claims. You are not doing this, but I am.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #16I think you have a wrong idea about when the Exodus happened. In any case, Ipuwer papyrus fits to the Biblical story, but I understand you don't accept it as evidence. I don't think anything would be sufficient for a person who doesn't want to believe.Compassionist wrote: ↑Mon Oct 20, 2025 11:43 am Ipuwer Papyrus: It’s a Middle Kingdom lament (c. 1850 BCE) describing general social disorder, not plagues or an exodus. It predates the alleged Exodus by centuries and fits a well-known literary genre of “lamentations,†not eyewitness history.
The book has the images of the findings. It is interesting, if the authorities are blind to see them. However, I can understand that the mainstream doesn't want to publish them, because it doesn't fit to the atheistic world view.Compassionist wrote: ↑Mon Oct 20, 2025 11:43 amThe Exodus Case: Dr Möller repeats Ron Wyatt’s unverified claims. None of those “finds†have been authenticated or published in any peer-reviewed archaeology journal. The Israel Geological Survey and Egyptian Antiquities Authority found only natural coral formations—no chariots, no bones, no artifacts.
So you think the Egyptians would just stop eating and roll over an die? Is that reasonable assumption?Compassionist wrote: ↑Mon Oct 20, 2025 11:43 am...Inventing imports from Israel isn’t in the text - it’s a post-hoc repair.
My new book can be read freely from here:
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #17[Replying to 1213 in post #16]
As for motives: disbelief in a claim follows from lack of confirming evidence, not from desire. If identical evidence supported a Hindu or Norse miracle, you’d reject it, not from bias but from standards of verification. Skepticism and credulity use the same rule; they just apply it consistently.
The Ipuwer Papyrus is centuries earlier and is a poetic lament, not an eyewitness account.
Extraordinary finds require independent authentication, not personal conviction or conspiracy theories.
Textual contradictions aren’t solved by inventing extra events not found in the text itself.
The question isn’t who wants to believe, but what the evidence independently shows.
The Exodus date can be moved anywhere from 1500 - 1200 BCE and the Ipuwer Papyrus still precedes it by several centuries; that’s why no professional Egyptologist treats it as a parallel record. The text is a literary lament, not a chronicle: it lacks dates, names of pharaohs, or geographical markers. Different catastrophes were routinely described in that stock poetic style (“the river is blood,†“the poor have become richâ€). Calling that “fits the Biblical story†confuses shared imagery with shared events.I think you have a wrong idea about when the Exodus happened. In any case, Ipuwer papyrus fits to the Biblical story, but I understand you don't accept it as evidence. I don't think anything would be sufficient for a person who doesn't want to believe.
As for motives: disbelief in a claim follows from lack of confirming evidence, not from desire. If identical evidence supported a Hindu or Norse miracle, you’d reject it, not from bias but from standards of verification. Skepticism and credulity use the same rule; they just apply it consistently.
Science journals publish verified results from Christians, Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, Sikhs, followers of other religions, and secular people - what matters is methodology, not the beliefs of the researcher. If those photos showed authentic Late-Bronze-Age Egyptian chariots on the seabed, they would be the discovery of the century and would appear in Nature or Antiquity, not in self-published books. Multiple teams from Israel, Egypt, and the U.S. Navy have surveyed the Gulf of Aqaba with side-scan sonar and ROVs. None found man-made artifacts; the supposed “wheels†are coral growths on eroded limestone. Accusing an entire global discipline of blindness is easier than providing one verifiable sample, but it’s not persuasive.The book has the images of the findings. It is interesting, if the authorities are blind to see them. However, I can understand that the mainstream doesn't want to publish them, because it doesn't fit to the atheistic world view.
No one said they stopped eating; the point is textual consistency. Exodus 9:6 explicitly states, “All the livestock of Egypt died.†Only a few verses later, the same Egyptians still have livestock struck by hail (9:19-25). That’s an internal contradiction. Imagining emergency imports from the Israelites is never mentioned in the text; it’s an ad-hoc repair added thousands of years later. When a narrative needs new details to fix its own wording, that’s a sign we’re dealing with mythic storytelling, not historical reportage.So you think the Egyptians would just stop eating and roll over and die? Is that reasonable assumption?
The Ipuwer Papyrus is centuries earlier and is a poetic lament, not an eyewitness account.
Extraordinary finds require independent authentication, not personal conviction or conspiracy theories.
Textual contradictions aren’t solved by inventing extra events not found in the text itself.
The question isn’t who wants to believe, but what the evidence independently shows.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #18Actually I believe many legends can be true. And I believe it is possible many ancient "gods" existed. Bible itself tells about many "gods". The difference is, I wouldn't keep those as my God, even if real.Compassionist wrote: ↑Tue Oct 21, 2025 9:41 am ...If identical evidence supported a Hindu or Norse miracle, you’d reject it, not from bias but from standards of verification. Skepticism and credulity use the same rule; they just apply it consistently...
I don't accuse them for blindness, I think it is more likely wilful ignorance. The findings that are real, don't fit to the secular anti-christian world view, that is why they must be ignored.Compassionist wrote: ↑Tue Oct 21, 2025 9:41 amAccusing an entire global discipline of blindness is easier than providing one verifiable sample, but it’s not persuasive.
My new book can be read freely from here:
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #19[Replying to 1213 in post #18]
Many believing archaeologists - Christian, Jewish, Muslim, and others - work within the same system and publish freely. If even they find no support for global floods or Exodus chariots, that suggests the problem lies not in “anti-Christian bias†but in the quality of the evidence itself.
From an evidential standpoint, the question isn’t which deity one prefers, but which claim is independently verifiable. If multiple religions report miracles (e.g. the sun and the moon stood still so God's followers could murder more people, Muhammad split the moon in two and then rejoined the two halves), yet none meet historical standards of corroboration - contemporary records, consistent physical traces, and independent attestation - then treating one set as “true†and others as “legends†is a matter of faith selection, not historical method. I don't believe in any of the many gods humans believe in or used to believe in, e.g. Allah, Jesus, Thor, Zeus, Brahma, Kali, etc. The arbiter of truth is evidence. No evidence proves the existence of any god. I have asked you to provide evidence for various Biblical events, but you have failed to provide me with evidence.Actually I believe many legends can be true. And I believe it is possible many ancient "gods" existed. Bible itself tells about many "gods". The difference is, I wouldn't keep those as my God, even if real.
That explanation reverses the burden of proof. The way to show that mainstream archaeology suppresses evidence is simple: publish verifiable data - stratigraphy, carbon-dating results, artifact catalogues - so that other experts can replicate the findings. If the evidence is solid, it will appear in peer-reviewed literature, regardless of worldview. Science only asks that claims be testable and reproducible.I don't accuse them for blindness, I think it is more likely wilful ignorance. The findings that are real, don't fit to the secular anti-christian world view, that is why they must be ignored.
Many believing archaeologists - Christian, Jewish, Muslim, and others - work within the same system and publish freely. If even they find no support for global floods or Exodus chariots, that suggests the problem lies not in “anti-Christian bias†but in the quality of the evidence itself.
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Re: Can you please provide evidence for these Biblical events?
Post #20It is still also about what you prefer, even if verified.Compassionist wrote: ↑Wed Oct 22, 2025 2:18 pm From an evidential standpoint, the question isn’t which deity one prefers, but which claim is independently verifiable.
In the post #9 I show two examples of evidence.Compassionist wrote: ↑Wed Oct 22, 2025 2:18 pm...No evidence proves the existence of any god. I have asked you to provide evidence for various Biblical events, but you have failed to provide me with evidence.
And it has been done.Compassionist wrote: ↑Wed Oct 22, 2025 2:18 pmThe way to show that mainstream archaeology suppresses evidence is simple: publish verifiable data
Compassionist wrote: ↑Wed Oct 22, 2025 2:18 pmScience only asks that claims be testable and reproducible.
My new book can be read freely from here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view
Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rIkqxC ... xtqFY/view
Old version can be read from here:
http://web.archive.org/web/202212010403 ... x_eng.html

