Is the US the most moral nation on earth?

[Scotracer]

In the debate between himself and Abraxas, WinePusher stated the following with regards to the United States of America:

We are morally superior to every other country

Post 18

Is this the case?

How would we define the most moral nation?

By extension: where do the other countries around the world rank in terms of morality?

PS: BTW, the debate between those two is a very good read but it has to be said, Abraxas is winning by far at the time of writing this.

[McCulloch]

USA ranked sixth highest out of fifty seven countries in terms of assaults per capita.

USA ranked 18th highest of sixty one countries in terms of Frauds (per capita)

USA ranked 24 highest of 62 in terms of murders per capita

USA ranked ninth highest of 65 in terms of rapes per capita

USA ranked eleventh highest of 64 in terms of robberies per capita

USA tied with Mexico for highest number of Child maltreatment deaths

[ChaosBorders]

In the debate between himself and Abraxas, WinePusher stated the following with regards to the United States of America:

We are morally superior to every other country

Is this the case?

Hahahaha wow...only if one has a very twisted sense of morality could we ever claim to be remotely close to the most 'moral' nation.

And yes, I think Abraxas is pretty much slaughtering him in the debate.

[Slopeshoulder]

If we are so moral, why are we condemned every damn day by right wing christians for allegedly being so immoral, while Norway seems to get off scott free?


We've done a relatively good job at human rights, freedom, and a basic assumption of fairness (although all also represent collossal failures) but the kind of glib, arrogant, unwordly, jingoistic triumphalism in the OP quote doesn't pass the straight face test.

[WinePusher]

In the debate between himself and Abraxas, WinePusher stated the following with regards to the United States of America:

We are morally superior to every other country

Post 18

Is this the case?

Yes. The term "moral" having to do with Justice and right vs. wrong. The justice system of the USA is by far more fair than other nations. Given we have a miranda warning in which if a suspect is not given this warning no evidence can be used in a court. We have the writ of habeus corpus, a due process clause, the ability to appeal cases and the right of maintaining innocence until proven guilty. Granted, most of this was taken from the English judiciary. So lets look at freedom of speech, by far the US is the most lenient country when it comes to freedom of speech. We had a circuit court say it was ok for a nut church to protest funerals, and we have a president who says flag burning is ok. IMO, I say we follow the steps of every other nationalist country and incarcerate flag burners, but this country doesn't. Free speech thrives in America and is incomparable.

But hey, lets look at this standard. China deprives it's citizens of food and basic human neccesities, no one's condemning them. America, allegedly, doesn't socialize it's healthcare system and put everyone under a government plan, we're condemned by Sarcozi and the British. The fact that we are condemned for seemingly violating "human rights" shows that this nation is held to a higher standard than other countries.

How would we define the most moral nation?

The amount of freedom and liberty allowed.

PS: BTW, the debate between those two is a very good read but it has to be said, Abraxas is winning by far at the time of writing this.

I'm trying my best! :work:

[WinePusher]

If we are so moral, why are we condemned every damn day by right wing christians for allegedly being so immoral, while Norway seems to get off scott free?

I'm sorry, but I am unaware of right wing christians condemning this country for being immoral. The condemnation seems to come from the left, accusing America of "policing the world" and "depriving citizens of basic healthcare" and accusing the right wing of hating the poor because we don't think government handouts is effective and that we're committing war crimes abroad. But I, as a right wing political conservative and a christian, do not condemn this country for being immoral.

[Slopeshoulder]

If we are so moral, why are we condemned every damn day by right wing christians for allegedly being so immoral, while Norway seems to get off scott free?

I'm sorry, but I am unaware of right wing christians condemning this country for being immoral. The condemnation seems to come from the left, accusing America of "policing the world" and "depriving citizens of basic healthcare" and accusing the right wing of hating the poor because we don't think government handouts is effective and that we're committing war crimes abroad. But I, as a right wing political conservative and a christian, do not condemn this country for being immoral.

You may not, but calling the actual citizens of this country "sinners" and immoral has been a theme of right wing christianity going back to Jonathan Edwards and farther to Salem and Plymouth plantation itself. Repentence is the theme of many many contemporary evangelists (when they're not preaching the proseprity gospel). And the USA has the greatest number of those people, so we must be, in the eyes of the right, pretty despicable. But I agree that blinkered jingoism at the level of the nation is part of the christian rights hypocracy. Perhaps more of them should read Reinhold Niebuhr's Moral man and Immoral Society.
The secular left does the reverse: little shame at the individual level, yet major guilt at the national level.

[ChaosBorders]

The amount of freedom and liberty allowed.

We lock up more people than any other nation on Earth, a double digit percentage of them for smoking a plant that's less harmful than cigarettes or alcohol. If that's your standard of morality, then I think quite a few European countries beat us by far.

[WinePusher]

We lock up more people than any other nation on Earth, a double digit percentage of them for smoking a plant that's less harmful than cigarettes or alcohol. If that's your standard of morality, then I think quite a few European countries beat us by far.

Hey, you could put a bunch of restrictions on your child and they would never get into trouble. Or you could give your child the freedom to do anything, and they'll be more likely to get into trouble. Which would you rather have for this country, more restrictions on freedom and less incarcerations rates?

[Abraxas]

We lock up more people than any other nation on Earth, a double digit percentage of them for smoking a plant that's less harmful than cigarettes or alcohol. If that's your standard of morality, then I think quite a few European countries beat us by far.

Hey, you could put a bunch of restrictions on your child and they would never get into trouble. Or you could give your child the freedom to do anything, and they'll be more likely to get into trouble. Which would you rather have for this country, more restrictions on freedom and less incarcerations rates?

I'm glad you moved that here, I had wanted to respond to it but didn't want to build a new rebuttal after you posted your closing.

Thing of it is though, that restrictions are what get people in trouble. If there is no restriction against marijuana, you will not get in trouble for smoking marijuana. It is precisely that there are so many prohibitions that so many people are in trouble for violating those prohibitions.

Put more simply, you only get in trouble for breaking the rules when you have rules, fewer rules, fewer people breaking them. I consider your premise, that more freedoms result in more people in prison, to be completely opposite reality.