BYU's Honor Code?

[Kuan]

Im not sure how many here follow college basketball but if you do, you'll probably know about this deal. BYU has had its best season ever in the history of the school, but then when they find out that their best rebounder broke the honor code, they suspend him for the rest of the season.

What do you guys make of this whole deal?

[Goat]

Im not sure how many here follow college basketball but if you do, you'll probably know about this deal. BYU has had its best season ever in the history of the school, but then when they find out that their best rebounder broke the honor code, they suspend him for the rest of the season.

What do you guys make of this whole deal?

Well, two things. I think that the college basketball guy should have realized that BYU was serious about their honor code. The sports teams have to follow the same rules as everyone else.

That being said, I think that honor code is not realistic.. and i bet it gets broken a heck of a lot more than BYU is willing to admit. In some respects, that basketball player is a scape goat, since he is being judged more harshly than others, because of his prominence.

Sometimes, it's not what you do, but who are you, and who you know. I know more than a few cases where hypocrisy rules the day.

[sarabellum]

Personally I applaud BYU's actions....

Here's a group that values morality over rebounding, or profit.

Live by the code, die by the code....

Mr Davies was aware of what he signed off on.

[Kuan]

Well, two things. I think that the college basketball guy should have realized that BYU was serious about their honor code. The sports teams have to follow the same rules as everyone else.

Well, thats what you would think. Yet many coaches and schools are willing to bend the rules for their athletes.

That being said, I think that honor code is not realistic.. and i bet it gets broken a heck of a lot more than BYU is willing to admit. In some respects, that basketball player is a scape goat, since he is being judged more harshly than others, because of his prominence.

Actually, it is quite realistic. I live by it. It does get broken but many live by it. The only time that BYU actually takes an action is when it is criminal, or pre-marital sex. Many people have been kicked out of BYU for breaking the honor code, you just dont hear about them on the news. He is having a rougher time though, but that is because of the media coverage on the issue.

I think it can be a good sign, college sports is all about the money and winning. I find it nice to know that at least one school stands by what they say.

[Slopeshoulder]

Good for them!

[Furrowed Brow]

Don't believe anyfolk who get to run an educational institution should be allowed to set their own rules about other folks sex lives.

I see on Wiki "no homosexuality" is part of the honour code. Is that even legal? If it is a legal prohibition it should not be.

Could say Microsoft or the FBI, or any other major public company or institution get way with that. O shuck the US military did for years. I guess I answered my own question. Whilst I disagree wit the gay ban or "don't ask don't tell" at least the explicit reasons were that gay soldiers undermined moral and the effectiveness of the military (actually that sounds no better).

Anyhow: has the BYU honour code been tested in court?

[Kuan]

Don't believe anyfolk who get to run an educational institution should be allowed to set their own rules about other folks sex lives.

I see on Wiki "no homosexuality" is part of the honour code. Is that even legal? If it is a legal prohibition it should not be.

Could say Microsoft or the FBI, or any other major public company or institution get way with that. O shuck the US military did for years. I guess I answered my own question. Whilst I disagree wit the gay ban or "don't ask don't tell" at least the explicit reasons were that gay soldiers undermined moral and the effectiveness of the military (actually that sounds no better).

Anyhow: has the BYU honour code been tested in court?

Well, BYU is a private school run by the CoJCoLDS. So, when you attend the school you are expected to live by the standards they have in place. So if you think about it, the no homosexuality isnt that big of a deal because pre-marital sex is not allowed in the first place. No, the honor code hasnt been tested in court, but it cant really be cause its a private institution.

[Goat]

Don't believe anyfolk who get to run an educational institution should be allowed to set their own rules about other folks sex lives.

I see on Wiki "no homosexuality" is part of the honour code. Is that even legal? If it is a legal prohibition it should not be.

Could say Microsoft or the FBI, or any other major public company or institution get way with that. O shuck the US military did for years. I guess I answered my own question. Whilst I disagree wit the gay ban or "don't ask don't tell" at least the explicit reasons were that gay soldiers undermined moral and the effectiveness of the military (actually that sounds no better).

Anyhow: has the BYU honour code been tested in court?

They are a private institution, and as far as I know, do not take public money for anything. They are allowed to do what they want in that matter.

On the other hand, I wouldn't go there. If someone doesn't feel they can keep to that kind of regimen, they shouldn't go there either.

I am sure the 'honor code' is broken more than is admitted. And, if people get expelled for breaking that one, why hasn't the guy who got kicked off the team gotten expelled? I guess sports figures do get special treatment.

[Kuan]

They are a private institution, and as far as I know, do not take public money for anything. They are allowed to do what they want in that matter.

On the other hand, I wouldn't go there. If someone doesn't feel they can keep to that kind of regimen, they shouldn't go there either.

It is a personal choice. It also explains why its basically only mormons that go there to.

I am sure the 'honor code' is broken more than is admitted. And, if people get expelled for breaking that one, why hasn't the guy who got kicked off the team gotten expelled? I guess sports figures do get special treatment.

It gets broken a lot on the minor levels, they only really enforce the big ones like pre-marital sex, and criminal offenses. Those are also the only ones they expel people for. The guy who got suspended for a season (Davies) isn't getting special treatment. There is a process to this and the school has a meeting with the student. Then they decide whether he is expelled or not. Basically, if he says he's sorry they wont expel him. Same for any other person.

[Furrowed Brow]

Well, BYU is a private school run by the CoJCoLDS. So, when you attend the school you are expected to live by the standards they have in place.

I don't think this argument would wash under UK law. Provate business and charities and individuals have to obey the gender laws. there is no opt out. The classic case is Christian hotel owners who turn away homosexual couples or insists they have separate rooms. This behaviour is not lawful. So too any kind of prohibition on homosexuality other than the prohibitions that are already in place against heterosexuals like sex in public.

So if you think about it, the no homosexuality isnt that big of a deal because pre-marital sex is not allowed in the first place.

It is if there is an explicit rule against it. Let say a hetro couple and a gay couple marry in Conneticut and the four go off to BYU. What then?

The question is not "these are the rules and you have to live with then" but whether these rules should be allowed? The BYU is not someone's private living room. It is still a public space. Are they really allowed to compete in public sporting events with a gay ban on their team?