Why be "good?"

[wgreen]

I would like to hear from some atheists and agnostics who believe in leading moral lives (helping others, being compassionate, not murdering, stealing, etc.). Why do you lead a moral life?

I don't understand why you would.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Bill

[McCulloch]

I would like to hear from some atheists and agnostics who believe in leading moral lives (helping others, being compassionate, not murdering, stealing, etc.). Why do you lead a moral life?

I don't understand why you would.

Did you want the proximate or the ultimate reason?

[wgreen]

Did you want the proximate or the ultimate reason?

Both, please.

Thanks,

Bill Green

[Aristarkos]

I would like to hear from some atheists and agnostics who believe in leading moral lives (helping others, being compassionate, not murdering, stealing, etc.). Why do you lead a moral life?

From an agnostic point of view, and from one that rejects the notion that anyone really knows anything about God or an afterlife from ancient texts that are really just written by people:

I choose to be moral because of a love of life, how its connected, and a vision for the future. For life to continue on this planet, people need to be somewhat moral and kind. If you see all life as one, its only natural to help each other. Based on this knowledge, I would be depressed if I wasn't kind.

[McCulloch]

I'll start with the proximate. I behave in a moral way because it makes me feel happy. If I am not doing the right thing, I feel bad. It is called conscience. If you ask why I have a conscience, then you have crossed over into the ultimate cause.

There are other, I feel, less important proximate causes. Peer pressure, reputation, hoping that if someone notices that I have been good they might be good to me in return. I am sure that anyone with a bit of imagination can come up with a few other reasons to be good. But when it comes down to it, the reason why I do the right thing is that it feels good to me to do the right thing.

[wgreen]

Thanls for your input, Aristarkos.

I choose to be moral because of a love of life, how its connected, and a vision for the future. For life to continue on this planet, people need to be somewhat moral and kind. If you see all life as one, its only natural to help each other. Based on this knowledge, I would be depressed if I wasn't kind.

Let me see if I understand you:

1.You love life in general (microscopic, human/animal and plant life), so you want to see it continue.

2.You see that all of life is connected ecologically and evolutionarily, so you see yourself as having a role to play in the continuance of life.

3.It seems to you that, in order for life to continue on the planet as it is (specifically higher forms of life), people must have certain basic standards of morality (don't murder, steal, bulldoze rainforests, etc.).

4.You feel a connection to all life ("as one"), and so you feel a responsiblity to cherish it as you do your own body.

5. Based on the above, you would be depressed if you were not kind.

I feel the same way, though these are not my only reasons for wanting to be good (I actually am not very good).

But let me try to understand your position more fully. This seems to be motivation based on inner "feelings" such as "love of life" and feeling "as one" and "being depressed." Am I wrong? It doesn't seem like a logical argument for being moral (not that one is necessarily needed for oneself).

It is easy to see how points 1 and 3 together could lead to the conclusion that I should be moral, but they are premised on my "love of life."

Points 2/4 and 3 could also lead there, but these are premised on my feeling as "one" with all of life.

Of course, I wasn't necessarily looking for a logical argument, only what you thought.

Am I right in my attempt at analysis?

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Thanks,

Bill Green

[Aristarkos]

Thanls for your input, Aristarkos.

I choose to be moral because of a love of life, how its connected, and a vision for the future. For life to continue on this planet, people need to be somewhat moral and kind. If you see all life as one, its only natural to help each other. Based on this knowledge, I would be depressed if I wasn't kind.

Let me see if I understand you:

1.You love life in general (microscopic, human/animal and plant life), so you want to see it continue.

2.You see that all of life is connected ecologically and evolutionarily, so you see yourself as having a role to play in the continuance of life.

3.It seems to you that, in order for life to continue on the planet as it is (specifically higher forms of life), people must have certain basic standards of morality (don't murder, steal, bulldoze rainforests, etc.).

4.You feel a connection to all life ("as one"), and so you feel a responsiblity to cherish it as you do your own body.

5. Based on the above, you would be depressed if you were not kind.

I feel the same way, though these are not my only reasons for wanting to be good (I actually am not very good).

But let me try to understand your position more fully. This seems to be motivation based on inner "feelings" such as "love of life" and feeling "as one" and "being depressed." Am I wrong? It doesn't seem like a logical argument for being moral (not that one is necessarily needed for oneself).

It is easy to see how points 1 and 3 together could lead to the conclusion that I should be moral, but they are premised on my "love of life."

Points 2/4 and 3 could also lead there, but these are premised on my feeling as "one" with all of life.

Of course, I wasn't necessarily looking for a logical argument, only what you thought.

Am I right in my attempt at analysis?

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

Thanks,

Bill Green

Your analysis is pretty good, except that there is a scientific aspect that affects my feelings. For example, scientific studies have shown that intelligent life as we know it is rare at least in our galactic neighborhood. Also, in regard to oneness, scientific studies have shown more and more that various kinds of life on earth are physically dependent on each other.

[sue]

There is the good feeling I get from helping someone, but also lately I'm in a tricky position where I need to lead without any real authority. People are more likely to follow someone that they perceive as being a good person.

[The Persnickety Platypus]

Simple.


Social species (such as humans) are inderdependant of one another, therefore must act as such in order to survive.

One common phenomena amoung communal systems is the tendancy of the well being of one member to directly effect the well being of another. There is personal incentive in aid and cooperation. If more people could come to terms with this reality, we will truly be on our way to a better society.

I firmly believe that humans possess the means to bring about utopia/a united global state, and in a historical perspective, see us constantly inching closer to this reality. One of the main means by which this will happen is technology, which has linked, expanded, and assimilated different cultures in ways that was previously impossible. Interdependance begets inter-cultural stability, which currently appears to be our best bet for world peace.

I would also like to note that this can all be done without God; perhaps even more effectively than otherwise.

[bernee51]

I would like to hear from some atheists and agnostics who believe in leading moral lives (helping others, being compassionate, not murdering, stealing, etc.). Why do you lead a moral life?

I don't understand why you would.

Thanks in advance for your input.

Bill

Quite simple really...leading an ethical life leads to:

# reduced anxiety, guilt and fear
# less worry, defensivenes an ddenial
# fewer bouts of self doubt, depresion and despair
# increased confidence, courage and strength
# deeper relaxation, calmness and peace
# relationships that are closer, consierate and caring
# feelings of happiness joy and delight

so list a few.

Why wouldn't I want those things?