Imatating Christ

[Jester]

Looking through the probation list on this site, I saw something that troubled me. Most of those on probation were Christians.

Here are the stats:
6 Christians
1 Athiest/Agnostic (not certain which)
4 Unknown

Looking at the posts, I felt that all of these people had, in fact, broken the rules (and, in general, feel that the moderators do not discriminate). This makes me feel that we, as Christians, tend to be the bigger behavior problems.

Forgive the long intro, but I must admit that "are we worse than the non-Christians?" is not really my question (it's merely what got me thinking). I'd like to exclude the debate over who is "worse" from this topic (if you feel the need, please start a new topic. Instead, I'd like us to discuss how we can be better. What is it that causes us to break rules, or seek those grey areas in order to attack others? More importantly, what can we do about it?
Of course the Gospel is inherently offensive to some, but that means that we don't need to help make it more abrasive. So how can we debate intelligently while showing everyone on this site that we "love our neighbors"?
Any and all constructive thoughts are welcome.

[otseng]

What is it that causes us to break rules, or seek those grey areas in order to attack others? More importantly, what can we do about it?
Of course the Gospel is inherently offensive to some, but that means that we don't need to help make it more abrasive. So how can we debate intelligently while showing everyone on this site that we "love our neighbors"?

Thanks for bringing this up.

I think part of the challenge is that it's not common to find forums on the internet where civility is expected and enforced. Another thing is that Christians are not taught how to "connect" with non-Christians. But perhaps the biggest part is that some Christians feel it's their duty to change others, even if it requires violating the forum rules.

Most of the moderating here is reactionary. That is, the moderators do not usually intervene until a rule has been broken. But, perhaps one way to help control the rule violations is to be more proactive. If someone starts heading toward the edge, then someone could contact that person privately and encourage him to pay attention to the rules.

[MagusYanam]

What is it that causes us to break rules, or seek those grey areas in order to attack others? More importantly, what can we do about it?
Of course the Gospel is inherently offensive to some, but that means that we don't need to help make it more abrasive. So how can we debate intelligently while showing everyone on this site that we "love our neighbors"?
Any and all constructive thoughts are welcome.

Good questions, Jester. I know I for one have not been as forbearing as I should be with those with whom I disagree, and I know I've come extremely close to breaking the rules many, many times and have on occasion stepped over the line.

I think it may be because I don't really understand often how those debaters I disagree with think or feel. When I see a blanket attack on 'Christians' or 'liberals' I get angry because almost 100% of the time, the attack is unjust and insupportable. What I have to force myself to remember is that people who make such attacks are so afraid and so blinded against what they themselves don't understand that they lash out at it.

So how can we debate intelligently while at the same time 'loving our neighbours'? I think the number one thing we can do is simply remember that the Gospel in which we believe has at its core the principle of God's radical grace. We have been forgiven, far beyond our deserving, for everything we have done wrong and everything we have yet to do wrong, by a God of infinite love, infinite justice and infinite forbearance. It is incumbent on us, then, in light of this, to bear ourselves lovingly, fairly and forbearingly toward others.

As for what you say about the Gospel (and you needn't take my opinion for more than it's worth), I don't see how such a message of radical grace is needfully abrasive or offensive. It is provocative and challenging - it often requires a rethinking of our 'common sense', so to speak. Jesus challenged us to give of ourselves where we would normally reserve ourselves.

As to the 'behaviour problems' you mentioned, perhaps they have more to do with zealotry than anything else. When the cause becomes more important than the people, it is never a good sign - that's where I think a lot of the rule violations come in: when someone is not willing to respect another debater because s / he is challenging the violator to rethink doctrine.

[Jester]

Another thing is that Christians are not taught how to "connect" with non-Christians.

This is very true! Perhaps we should have a separate discussion (or series of discussions just to learn more about this.

But perhaps the biggest part is that some Christians feel it's their duty to change others, even if it requires violating the forum rules.

Again, I agree. I think I might try to sprinkly some "let the spirit convict" advice into myself and others.

If someone starts heading toward the edge, then someone could contact that person privately and encourage him to pay attention to the rules.

This is good advice. I'll have to make an effort to really follow it.

[Jester]

Good questions, Jester. I know I for one...

This really encouraged me about the issue (and in general).
Thank you.

[Sleepy]

In their enthusiasm to proclaim who God is they forget that they are also called to reflect who God is.

[achilles12604]

I think it has to do with several factors.

1) We are unclear about the atheist position. It is totally foreign to us and therefore, we see it as illogical.

2) We are striving to clear up the facts, yet I know a lot of Christians (myself to a moderate degree) that are affected by facts which do not point the way we want.

3) We feel that the bible is divinly inspired and could easily take offense to it being attacked.

But the biggest reason. . . .

For the atheist this is a game. For us, it is personal.


By the way, I am asking, strongly requesting that ANYTIME I get anywhere close to an "edge" of insulting anyone, PLEASE please please PM me on it . . .

I promise I wont take offense. I may disagree, but I wont take offense.

Please do this for me.

[Jester]

I think it has to do with several factors.

1) We are unclear about the atheist position. It is totally foreign to us and therefore, we see it as illogical.

2) We are striving to clear up the facts, yet I know a lot of Christians (myself to a moderate degree) that are affected by facts which do not point the way we want.

3) We feel that the bible is divinly inspired and could easily take offense to it being attacked.

But the biggest reason. . . .

For the atheist this is a game. For us, it is personal.


By the way, I am asking, strongly requesting that ANYTIME I get anywhere close to an "edge" of insulting anyone, PLEASE please please PM me on it . . .

I promise I wont take offense. I may disagree, but I wont take offense.

Please do this for me.

Sure, and do this for me, too, if you would.
I can understand how easy it is to get defensive- I really want to commit to avoiding it.