Would Jesus Support Republican or Democratic Values More?

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Elijah John
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Post #81

Post by Elijah John »

[Replying to post 79 by ElCodeMonkey]

No, that's how I see ILLEGAL immigration.

Again, you are conflating legal and illegal immigration. Border crashing is indeed breeching. And that includes hurling rocks at border patrol, sneaking in, digging under fencing, and crossing in places other than legal ports of entry, and checkpoints.

Would you want people knocking on your door and asking permission to enter? Or breaking the lock, entering through a window, etc.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

Elijah John
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Post #82

Post by Elijah John »

[Replying to post 79 by ElCodeMonkey]

No, that's how I see ILLEGAL immigration.

Again, you are conflating legal and illegal immigration. Border crashing is indeed breeching. And that includes hurling rocks at border patrol, sneaking in, digging under fencing, and crossing in places other than legal ports of entry, and checkpoints.

Would you want people knocking on your door and asking permission to enter? Or breaking the lock, entering through a window, etc.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

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ElCodeMonkey
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Post #83

Post by ElCodeMonkey »

[Replying to post 81 by Elijah John]

Does motive not weigh in at all? These people are seeking asylum and freedom from oppression. They're not seeking to overthrow us. When a dog is cornered, it is natural to bite. The morality of such is quite complicated, of course, but you're acting like these are all criminal people out to destroy our country which is a far sell from reality. (at least, that's how I'm seeing your argument).
I'm Published! Christians Are Revolting: An Infidel's Progress
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Elijah John
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Post #84

Post by Elijah John »

ElCodeMonkey wrote: [Replying to post 81 by Elijah John]

Does motive not weigh in at all? These people are seeking asylum and freedom from oppression. They're not seeking to overthrow us. When a dog is cornered, it is natural to bite. The morality of such is quite complicated, of course, but you're acting like these are all criminal people out to destroy our country which is a far sell from reality. (at least, that's how I'm seeing your argument).
Did I ever say "all"? No, my point is that even if some of them are criminals, it's not worth the risk to our citizens to let any of them in, unless and until they can each and every one be properly vetted for criminal backgrounds, contagious disease, and terrorist ties.

I would rather keep every migrant out than to risk the health, safety and well being of even one of our citizens. I think that is President Trump's position as well. And that is what makes him a good president. He is more concerned about the interests of the American people than he is about the interest of illegal immigrants.

If the American people were a family, and the borders were the walls of our house, wouldn't any good father or mother take the same position?

Illegal immigrants by definition bypass scrutiny. And you ask about motive? OK, say someone was banging at your door demanding entry. Would you want to know anything about that person? Would you open the door for someone you didn't know? Or didn't already have legitamate business with? How would you know they have good motives?

Did ever you see the movie "mother!" ? Good unintended metaphor/allegory for the illegal immigration situation. I'm reading into it, but here's how I see it.

Javier Bardem's character, the husband, a poet, is the well intentioned but naive Democrat. His wife, Jennifer Lawrence's character is the sane American citizen (the only sane person in the movie). Ed Harris' character, the guest, is the immigrant. His family and friends, chain migration. Their disorderly and rude conduct is the mayhem that unfettered immigration is already beginning to bring. The husband doesn't see it, the wife does, much to her dismay.

And on a subsequent occasion the poet's fans come to the couple's farmhouse, saying they have "traveled great distances" just to see him. They take Bardem's hospitality "our house is your house" far too literally, to say the least. Chaos and destruction ensue.

I think the Left is far too complacent on this issue, and everyone should see this film.It may be prophetic.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

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ElCodeMonkey
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Post #85

Post by ElCodeMonkey »

Sorry, apparently I dropped the ball a while back. In the end, I think we've mostly beaten the topic to death and we simply have discussion on how immigration should look. We both agree that it's terrible the way it is, and we may disagree on how it should look. I just want it to be fair and not fear-mongering race-hate-oriented which is how it seems to be to a lot of people. In the end, I think Jesus would have a hard time supporting a side at all even if one side is 55% more aligned than another. He may still vote, but I think he'd work on other endeavors moreso than uplifting a side. He'd probably start by encouraging Instant Runoff Voting or Ranked Choice Voting so that the two-sided problem can be avoided all together. This would permit much better choices and less polar dispositions where we have to choose between two evils. Meanwhile (or perhaps instead of politics entirely), he'd focus on loving locally and teaching others to do likewise. That's my best bet :-).

Seeing as I know little about border policies and immigration, and along with my love of this particular comic artist, I think this could be a fun book to discuss once it's released :-).
https://www.amazon.com/Open-Borders-Sci ... 1250316960
I'm Published! Christians Are Revolting: An Infidel's Progress
My Blog: Friendly By Nurture
The Wisdom I've gleaned.
My Current Beliefs.

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