Hi everyone,
I would like to ask question about origin of non-christian religions (this is my first post , I'm christian )
OK - so I've been thinking and idea came:
As a christian, I believe in God, his creation of universe . There are, however, other religions such as buddhism, taoism, muslim, etc.
They don't believe in God *AND* because God is one who created universe (and they don't believe in him), their gods doesn't exist. Because there is good (God) and then evil (absence of God) - and they don't believe in him, are they product of evil (I mean those religions) ?
Are they work of evil to draw attention not to God, but to something other ?
OK, and last question - (if answer to last question is yes) - are those people evil / bad becouse there are spreading their non-christian religion ? (maybe there don't mean to do bad thing - they believe that they are doing good, but unknowingly doing bad)
(DISCLAIMER: I do not want to harass or find excuse to disdain non-christian people, I just want to know answer to stated questions)
Many thanks
Origin of non-christian religions
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Post #151
I'm sort of going after the Occam's Razor on the debating topic, here. Either I can prove that the Earth goes around the Sun, or you can prove an entire religion.You didn't ask me about my strong irrefutable evidence. Are you not keen to know The Miracle that challenges all people at the age of mind??
Well, for one, stars aren't terribly fixed. Note that I said one year.If the sun revolves then we revolve with it, how can we see stars fixed at one ???
If stars revolve each in a different orbit, why stars are fixed at one shape??
If the earth moves around itself, why the movement of water and air is not affected??
There's a thing I heard when I was a kid. "Look for the north star to go north." That's the Pole Star. The reason for this is because the "Pole star" appears to be straight north of our pole, and it seems to always be there over short periods of times. However, that's only short periods of times. I hate to quote wikipedia as a main point in a debate, but it highlights the issue quite clearly. Currently, Polaris is the North Star. We predict, however, that:
Gamma Cephei (also known as Alrai, situated 45 light-years away) will become closer to the northern celestial pole than Polaris around AD 3000. Iota Cephei will become the pole star some time around AD 5200.
First-magnitude Deneb will be within 5° of the North Pole in AD 10000.
Eventually we will behold witness to a new north star, depending on what time we're at. We have changed over the observable history of Earth, where:The brilliant Vega in the constellation Lyra is often touted as the best North Star (it fulfilled that role around 12000 BC and will do so again around the year AD 14000). However, it never comes closer than 5° to the pole.
As for fixed in one shape, the constellations become less consistent in our view as time goes on. There are a few that we've stopped observing because they're no longer in an appropriate location. The reason they so slowly blink out of existence is because of the massive distance between us and them. Plus, even if they did move swiftly, our distance in light years means that it will be a long, long time before we can observe movement in case they did suddenly move or die out.In 3000 BC the faint star Thuban in the constellation Draco was the North Star. At magnitude 3.67 (fourth magnitude) it is only one-fifth as bright as Polaris, and today it is invisible in light-polluted urban skies.
Lastly, for the spinning not affecting the water, it does. I'm not a great climatologist or geologist, but we owe our spherical-ish shape to our rotation. The force of gravity and movement forced us in to a spherical oblong shape. We owe a bit of our tidal forces to it as well, plus the whole night-and-day thing with us facing the moon and sun.
You may imagine a balloon with static electricity losing things attached to it when you spin it as reason for the spinning to throw us off. This discounts gravity being much stronger than spinning, however, and "centrifugal force". I can go over this if needed, but I have little on hand at the moment (in regards to time and sources).
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Post #152
Hahaha, can't you notice that I am not debating, I am setting facts and tell you I have a clear strong evidence challenging you and you write mere words with no slight evidence.Adurumus wrote:I'm sort of going after the Occam's Razor on the debating topic, here. Either I can prove that the Earth goes around the Sun, or you can prove an entire religion.You didn't ask me about my strong irrefutable evidence. Are you not keen to know The Miracle that challenges all people at the age of mind??
Well, for one, stars aren't terribly fixed. Note that I said one year.If the sun revolves then we revolve with it, how can we see stars fixed at one ???
If stars revolve each in a different orbit, why stars are fixed at one shape??
If the earth moves around itself, why the movement of water and air is not affected??
There's a thing I heard when I was a kid. "Look for the north star to go north." That's the Pole Star. The reason for this is because the "Pole star" appears to be straight north of our pole, and it seems to always be there over short periods of times. However, that's only short periods of times. I hate to quote wikipedia as a main point in a debate, but it highlights the issue quite clearly. Currently, Polaris is the North Star. We predict, however, that:
Gamma Cephei (also known as Alrai, situated 45 light-years away) will become closer to the northern celestial pole than Polaris around AD 3000. Iota Cephei will become the pole star some time around AD 5200.First-magnitude Deneb will be within 5° of the North Pole in AD 10000.Eventually we will behold witness to a new north star, depending on what time we're at. We have changed over the observable history of Earth, where:The brilliant Vega in the constellation Lyra is often touted as the best North Star (it fulfilled that role around 12000 BC and will do so again around the year AD 14000). However, it never comes closer than 5° to the pole.
As for fixed in one shape, the constellations become less consistent in our view as time goes on. There are a few that we've stopped observing because they're no longer in an appropriate location. The reason they so slowly blink out of existence is because of the massive distance between us and them. Plus, even if they did move swiftly, our distance in light years means that it will be a long, long time before we can observe movement in case they did suddenly move or die out.In 3000 BC the faint star Thuban in the constellation Draco was the North Star. At magnitude 3.67 (fourth magnitude) it is only one-fifth as bright as Polaris, and today it is invisible in light-polluted urban skies.
Lastly, for the spinning not affecting the water, it does. I'm not a great climatologist or geologist, but we owe our spherical-ish shape to our rotation. The force of gravity and movement forced us in to a spherical oblong shape. We owe a bit of our tidal forces to it as well, plus the whole night-and-day thing with us facing the moon and sun.
You may imagine a balloon with static electricity losing things attached to it when you spin it as reason for the spinning to throw us off. This discounts gravity being much stronger than spinning, however, and "centrifugal force". I can go over this if needed, but I have little on hand at the moment (in regards to time and sources).
You are the weak here. You don't have clear knowledge, you don't have slight evidence, you are copypasta.
I set facts supported logically and have a strong irrefutable evidence which you are afraid even to ask me what is that evidence!!
Don't follow anyone or anything blindly, don't be a parrot.
Life is a big trick.
Take care
Post #153
Alright, I'll listen. What evidence do you have that contradicts findings by human beings and scientists and my own observations that agree with their conclusions? What evidence do you have that physicists have been horribly mistaken or llying for centuries about the universe? What evidence do you have that the Catholic church did not when they punished Galileo for going against them, after they claimed what you are claiming now (from another book)?
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Post #154
No brother .. just because we say that the sun 'sets', or the sun 'rose', does not prove that the sun orbits the earth. If you look into it more closely, you will see that everything is relative to the point of observation.happy forever wrote: The sun revolves around the earth, I found it in the Quran.
"And you might have seen the sun when it rose, declining from their cave towards the right; and when it set (west), it went past them towards the left while they were in a broad fissure of (the cave). That was one of the signs of Allah. Whomever Allah guides, then he is right-guided, and whomever He leads away into error, then you will never find for him a right-minded patron." [18:17]
I suggest that you read up on the advance of astronomy in Islamic civilisation..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_astronomyThe first empirical observational evidence of the Earth's rotation was given by Nasīr al-Dīn al-Tūsī in the 13th century and by Ali Qushji in the 15th century, followed by Al-Birjandi who developed an early hypothesis on "circular inertia" by the early 16th century.
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pre Islamic history is at the root of Islam?
Post #155I think one can make a pretty good argument that Islam has its origins in pagan pre Islamic history. Muhammad never brought anything new the medical field. What Muhammad came up with was put in writing by doctors before. Even his view of the stars and the sky has its roots in Roman belief; additionally, Allah was worshipped before Muhammad was born only Allah was the chief idol of some 360 deities during pre Islamic history. Muhammad single out Allah as the one true god. Finally, the oneness of God wasn't a unique claim of Muhammad, He learn of God being one from the Jews and the Christians.
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Post #156
Inspiration from God (but it was a possible misinterpritation).
Made up by their founders.
Demonically inspired.
Made up by their founders.
Demonically inspired.
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Re: Origin of non-christian religions
Post #158Islamic muslims also believe in that God created the Universe. Many other religions also believe in a Oneness God who are the Creator and Sustainer of All - for example - Judaism, Bahai, Sikhism, and many other Theistic or Deistic believers. Guess most of these are more or less good and probably not so evil religions, just as Christianity.wx47 wrote: Hi everyone,
I would like to ask question about origin of non-christian religions (this is my first post , I'm christian )
OK - so I've been thinking and idea came:
As a christian, I believe in God, his creation of universe . There are, however, other religions such as buddhism, taoism, muslim, etc.
They don't believe in God *AND* because God is one who created universe (and they don't believe in him), their gods doesn't exist. Because there is good (God) and then evil (absence of God) - and they don't believe in him, are they product of evil (I mean those religions) ?
Are they work of evil to draw attention not to God, but to something other ?
OK, and last question - (if answer to last question is yes) - are those people evil / bad becouse there are spreading their non-christian religion ? (maybe there don't mean to do bad thing - they believe that they are doing good, but unknowingly doing bad)
(DISCLAIMER: I do not want to harass or find excuse to disdain non-christian people, I just want to know answer to stated questions)
Many thanks
Personally I believe "God is. All is. All in God, God in All. God is All.".
From that pointview I'm some skeptical and liberal when comes to any particular religion, but also want to respect them even if they may not fully or properly represent the entire "True" and just a more or less big portion of it.
So my answer is that many religions - including Christianity - possibly are more or less good and evil. Let's promote or apply the good portions of them, and avoid promote or apply the evil portions of them.
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Re: Origin of non-christian religions
Post #159[Replying to post 1 by wx47]
My faith in our creation as spirits in the spirit world pre-earth suggests that we made our true free will decision so to accept GOD or to reject HIM as a false GOD.
This was an organic process rather than a one time stand up and be counted type thing and part of the process was that anyone who wanted to could make a claim similar to YHWH's to be god and offer the kind of situation they thought people might go for and worship them.
Acceptance and rejection were both based on faith, a hope without proof, as proof would destroy our true free will because if GOD showed HIS divine glory who could stand against HIM?
Thus as we talked it over, everyone slowly settled into believing in the kind of reality they thought would give them the best hope for eternal happiness, no god, many gods, the one true loving GOD, YHWH, or some other god.
Then to cut this short, when the earth was created we all get to live here under the god / gods / no god or YHWH as we fore-chose pre-earth.
Thus all the gods arose from the hope of some that the definition that this god offered of reality would bring them the happiest life because faith is hope, not proof, Heb 11:1.
Peace, Ted
My faith in our creation as spirits in the spirit world pre-earth suggests that we made our true free will decision so to accept GOD or to reject HIM as a false GOD.
This was an organic process rather than a one time stand up and be counted type thing and part of the process was that anyone who wanted to could make a claim similar to YHWH's to be god and offer the kind of situation they thought people might go for and worship them.
Acceptance and rejection were both based on faith, a hope without proof, as proof would destroy our true free will because if GOD showed HIS divine glory who could stand against HIM?
Thus as we talked it over, everyone slowly settled into believing in the kind of reality they thought would give them the best hope for eternal happiness, no god, many gods, the one true loving GOD, YHWH, or some other god.
Then to cut this short, when the earth was created we all get to live here under the god / gods / no god or YHWH as we fore-chose pre-earth.
Thus all the gods arose from the hope of some that the definition that this god offered of reality would bring them the happiest life because faith is hope, not proof, Heb 11:1.
Peace, Ted
PCE Theology as I see it...
We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.
This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.
We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.
This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.
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Re: Origin of non-christian religions
Post #160Did you make the right choice before you were born? How do you know? You were apparently not given conclusive evidence before making the choice nor are we given conclusive evidence in this lifetime. To me the assertion that you were able to make the right choice, intuitively and without evidence while millions of others made the wrong choice, seems to be a somewhat arrogant assertion.ttruscott wrote: [Replying to post 1 by wx47]
My faith in our creation as spirits in the spirit world pre-earth suggests that we made our true free will decision so to accept GOD or to reject HIM as a false GOD.
This was an organic process rather than a one time stand up and be counted type thing and part of the process was that anyone who wanted to could make a claim similar to YHWH's to be god and offer the kind of situation they thought people might go for and worship them.
Acceptance and rejection were both based on faith, a hope without proof, as proof would destroy our true free will because if GOD showed HIS divine glory who could stand against HIM?
Thus as we talked it over, everyone slowly settled into believing in the kind of reality they thought would give them the best hope for eternal happiness, no god, many gods, the one true loving GOD, YHWH, or some other god.
Then to cut this short, when the earth was created we all get to live here under the god / gods / no god or YHWH as we fore-chose pre-earth.
Thus all the gods arose from the hope of some that the definition that this god offered of reality would bring them the happiest life because faith is hope, not proof, Heb 11:1.
Peace, Ted
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John