Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 188 by onewithhim]



[center]Paradise for two
Part One[/center]

I'm wondering why people don't really get into this discussion.

It's a bit airy fairy for me..

Paradise on Earth, Hell on Earth, if we look for it, we can find it.
I bet you that people i Aleppo have trouble finding a paradise on earth these days..

Tahiti would be a better place to look for paradise, don't you think?

What could be better than Paradise on Earth?

Paradise on Earth for Two.
With beverages.

Are people so brain-dead after having been deluged with the idea of heaven for everybody that they can't relate to a physical existence?

Well, maybe "brain dead" is a bit of an exaggeration.
A whole lotta people don't really have a chance to GET to Tahiti...

How do we relate to a SPIRIT existence? I don't.

I do.

In a secular way.. I feel "spiritual", but then again, I really NEED to explain that, don't I? ( Hint: It has nothing at all to do with any supernatural )

The trick is.. TAKE OVER THE WORD.. "spiritual" can mean just about anything... It's like the word "gay"... It USED to just mean "happy", and now, it almost always means "homosexual", doesn't it? Well, we can just appropriate the word "spiritual" like the homosexuals appropriated "gay".

Let's take back the spiritual.

If people want an explanation, I am always happy to oblige, too !!

Give me grass and trees and animals and mansions made out of stone and cedar and glass and marble! Give me a relationship with a man. Give me fountains and waterfalls and rivers and pools.

I'm with you .. but could I have a woman, instead? I'm not as "flexible" in my sexuality as I might be.

The people of Aleppo will have a Paradise some day, and it will be even better than Tahiti. And I believe we will have our hearts' desires.

"The LORD sustains all who fall and raises up all who are bowed down. The eyes of all look to You, and You give them their food in due time. You open your hand and satisfy the desire of every living thing. The LORD is righteous in all His ways and kind in all His deeds. The LORD is near to all who call upon Him, to all who call upon Him in truth. He will fulfill the desire of those who fear Him; He will also hear their cry and will save them. The LORD keeps all who love Him, but all the wicked He will destroy." (Psalm 145:14-20, NASB)


(If you're a woman, though, you won't be given a woman. I thought you were a man. In that case you would be allowed a woman.)

[William]

The Earth is too small to enjoy forever.

No. If all the people who ever lived were brought back, we all would have at least an acre to ourselves. Not all will be resurrected, esp. those who fight God & Jesus right to the end. There will be room. If more people are born, God will either stop reproduction OR there might be options far out in the universe in other solar systems. We'll wait and see.

I don't think you appreciate the idea of existing forever on one planet or even in one universe and you have this belief that your idea of god will be able to grant you whatever you want. Like some fairy god-mother.

All in all the JW theory of future events/interpretation of biblical prophesy has too many holes in it. Personally I think the whole thing stems from politically motivated agenda and that idea of god has evolved along with this. Even from reading the posts pro 'eternity on earth' it seems to me that this god is the malleable subject - the clay shaped to fit the beliefs of the predominant group (JW) posting in this thread. God made in the image of human beings.

It all hinges on the belief that the bible is truth and all that is required is for the individual to believe that is the case, but I think it much more likely the whole thing was politically motivated and there is actually no savior going to come and fix the world. That is just the story told in order to pacify the ruled so that they would rely on an outside force to come and do something human beings are more than capable of demanding of themselves and those leaders.

Also, as much as it is tempting to believe in such promises, when I think it through I realize that being stuck on the same planet forever is more a curse than a blessing, no matter that everything might be peachy...for me - I would rather have the freedom to go wherever I wanted to, and worship no idea of a god...I think that anything which requires worship is most likely vainglorious and that is just one of the many things this god idea has been shaped into over the centuries. A little too human in many regards - evidence that it is more than likely a figment of human vanity - a mythical being shaped - as I said - in the image of human...even the fact that it is a male...but each to their own.

[William]

Double post.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 184 by Blastcat]

I don't view Genesis to be a science textbook.

so is Genesis true at all?

[William]

[Replying to post 184 by Blastcat]

I don't view Genesis to be a science textbook.

so is Genesis true at all?

Have you ever looked into Judaism to get opinions from that sector in relation to how they view those stories?

I can say that I have and some feel that Christianity hijacked their culture and misrepresented/misinterpreted them and used their idea of god to create another one.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 205 by William]

I don't view Genesis to be a science textbook.

so is Genesis true at all?

Have you ever looked into Judaism to get opinions from that sector in relation to how they view those stories?

not really, no.
would be cool.

I can say that I have and some feel that Christianity hijacked their culture and misrepresented/misinterpreted them and used their idea of god to create another one.

Hijacked is a strong word.. I think of Christianity as a spin off.

[onewithhim]

The Earth is too small to enjoy forever.

No. If all the people who ever lived were brought back, we all would have at least an acre to ourselves. Not all will be resurrected, esp. those who fight God & Jesus right to the end. There will be room. If more people are born, God will either stop reproduction OR there might be options far out in the universe in other solar systems. We'll wait and see.

I don't think you appreciate the idea of existing forever on one planet or even in one universe and you have this belief that your idea of god will be able to grant you whatever you want. Like some fairy god-mother.

All in all the JW theory of future events/interpretation of biblical prophesy has too many holes in it. Personally I think the whole thing stems from politically motivated agenda and that idea of god has evolved along with this. Even from reading the posts pro 'eternity on earth' it seems to me that this god is the malleable subject - the clay shaped to fit the beliefs of the predominant group (JW) posting in this thread. God made in the image of human beings.

It all hinges on the belief that the bible is truth and all that is required is for the individual to believe that is the case, but I think it much more likely the whole thing was politically motivated and there is actually no savior going to come and fix the world. That is just the story told in order to pacify the ruled so that they would rely on an outside force to come and do something human beings are more than capable of demanding of themselves and those leaders.

Also, as much as it is tempting to believe in such promises, when I think it through I realize that being stuck on the same planet forever is more a curse than a blessing, no matter that everything might be peachy...for me - I would rather have the freedom to go wherever I wanted to, and worship no idea of a god...I think that anything which requires worship is most likely vainglorious and that is just one of the many things this god idea has been shaped into over the centuries. A little too human in many regards - evidence that it is more than likely a figment of human vanity - a mythical being shaped - as I said - in the image of human...even the fact that it is a male...but each to their own.

Points taken. I agree that main-line religious thought is and has been politically motivated, for centuries upon centuries. But actually no religion (except JWs) has recently taught very much about a Savior coming to save mankind and set everything right . Religion is all about being buddies with the political entities, arm-in-arm to subjugate the people. A real cool set-up for them. The idea of Christ coming is anathema to political entities. In fact, the book of Revelation shows the political leaders en mass resisting Jesus Christ when he comes back to rid the earth of evil. (Revelation 19:11-21)

Do you concede that the Bible actually does speak of the earth becoming a Paradise? Most people don't see that in the Bible, strangely enough. They just go by what their religious leaders (who are buddies with politicians) tell them.

The political entities want people to rely on THEM and not an outside Christ.

You say you don't like the idea of being stuck on this planet forever and you don't want to pander to any god. Then, what is your belief about what will happen? What will there be for you from now on and forever?

One last thought. Jehovah insists on exclusive devotion because he knows that that is the most beneficial position that humans can take for themselves. What other god would be good for them to follow? Jehovah is the only true God. If men go off following some other god that they made up for themselves, they will not fare well. Jehovah knows exactly how to make humans happy, and he will make sure that we ARE happy.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 184 by Blastcat]

I don't view Genesis to be a science textbook.

so is Genesis true at all?

Have you ever looked into Judaism to get opinions from that sector in relation to how they view those stories?

I can say that I have and some feel that Christianity hijacked their culture and misrepresented/misinterpreted them and used their idea of god to create another one.

I have spoken with Jews and studied their Bible. I am perplexed that they have sabotaged their own religion with beliefs that are really not in their own Scriptures, such as their present belief in hell-fire and the immortality of the soul. I do not see either of those concepts in the Hebrew Scriptures (nor in the New Testament, for that matter). There is no mention of a burning hell, or, "Sheol," which is the equivalent of "hell" or "Hades" in the N.T. Regarding the soul, any Rabbi worth his salt is going to know that animals are also "souls", the soul can DIE (thus it is not immortal), and after death a person knows nothing.

"Behold, all souls are mine....the soul that sinneth [and we all sin], it shall DIE." (Ezekiel 18:4, KJV)

"For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not anything." (Ecclesiastes 9:5, KJV)


And if the dead aren't conscious of anything, how can they suffer in a fiery hell? So how can the Rabbis get it so screwed up? And they missed the whole Messiah thing. Not too cool.

[JehovahsWitness]

It all hinges on the belief that the bible is truth and all that is required is for the individual to believe that is the case, but I think it much more likely the whole thing was politically motivated and there is actually no savior going to come and fix the world.

We you are entitled to your beliefs but Genesis does speak of a "seed" or an offspring that would "crush" Satan (the serpent). Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, the Prophets, King David and others in scripture, reflected a hope in this coming one... by means of whom people all over the earth would be blessed.

Jehovah's Witnesses are not superimposing the idea of a Savior or of a coming paradise, its an integral part of the bible.

[Blastcat]

[Replying to post 209 by JehovahsWitness]



[center]WOO. [/center]

It all hinges on the belief that the bible is truth and all that is required is for the individual to believe that is the case, but I think it much more likely the whole thing was politically motivated and there is actually no savior going to come and fix the world.

We you are entitled to your beliefs but Genesis does speak of a "seed" or an offspring that would "crush" Satan (the serpent).

A book says that, woo.
I mean it's written down, yo.

Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, the Prophets, King David and others in scripture, reflected a hope in this coming one... by means of whom people all over the earth would be blessed.

Some people have hope, woo.
Heavy, dadio

Jehovah's Witnesses are not superimposing the idea of a Savior or of a coming paradise, its an integral part of the bible.

Woo, Jehovah's RULE.