Is Christianity/Religion to blame for attrocities?

[The Persnickety Platypus]

This topic was split from "is life meaningless for athiests".

Wow. Well I appreciate your honesty. I must say your revelation is quite disheartening. I hope there aren't hordes of people out there that are refraining from evil because of the god/heaven incentive. That's scary. I would rather think good people are just plain good.

Am I a rare breed of person? I think not.

Animal nature is the fufilling of self-interests. Every organism on the planet is subject to selfish tendancies. Maybe some more than others.

Are there hordes or people out there right now refraining from evil because of the heaven incentive? The simple truth- yes. Are there even more people that commit evil due to a lack of incentive? Of course.

Must religion be present for people to do good? No, but it sure helps. I would consider myself a pretty good person by nature, but religion makes me better. We all have our flaws, but I feel that religion helps to compensate for many of them.

Fortunately, humans possess a power most animals lack- empathy. With the right stimulation we may be good. Religion serves as a good stimulant, and can bring out the best in people.

You consider yourself to be a good person. That's great. But perhaps you could be even better as a Christian, hypothetically speaking. How many people do you see who manage to dredge themselves from a wild unethical life by instituting a Christian worldview? The changes that come about are remarkable.

[ShieldAxe]

Animal nature is the fufilling of self-interests. Every organism on the planet is subject to selfish tendancies. Maybe some more than others.

Are there hordes or people out there right now refraining from evil because of the heaven incentive?The simple truth- yes.

Are there also people doing evil because of their religion? Certainly.

Are there even more people that commit evil due to a lack of incentive? Of course.

Must religion be present for people to do good? No, but it sure helps. I would consider myself a pretty good person by nature, but religion makes me better. We all have our flaws, but I feel that religion helps to compensate for many of them.

It helps in some regard but harms in others.

Fortunately, humans possess a power most animals lack- empathy. With the right stimulation we may be good. Religion serves as a good stimulant, and can bring out the best in people.

Or the worst.

You consider yourself to be a good person. That's great. But perhaps you could be even better as a Christian, hypothetically speaking. How many people do you see who manage to dredge themselves from a wild unethical life by instituting a Christian worldview? The changes that come about are remarkable.

The amount of people doing evil for religion is remarkable too. Religion is not wholly positive.

[The Persnickety Platypus]

Religion (or more specifically, Christianity) is nearly always positive when used in the way it was intended.

Blaming Christianity for the many evils and attrocities commited in its name is like blaming Marx for the spread of Capitalism. No where in Biblical text will you find grounds for intolerance or murder. The same can be said for most other religions. Those who commit attrocities in the "name of God" have actually left their religion in favor of self-indulgent instincts.

The Bible advocates kindness, tolerance, and charity. Only the fiercest of animal impulses can negate that.

[McCulloch]

Religion (or more specifically, Christianity) is nearly always positive when used in the way it was intended.

Blaming Christianity for the many evils and attrocities commited in its name is like blaming Marx for the spread of Capitalism. No where in Biblical text will you find grounds for intolerance or murder. The same can be said for most other religions. Those who commit attrocities in the "name of God" have actually left their religion in favor of self-indulgent instincts.

What is the first commandment? Did the chosen tribe of God following God's instructions show kindness, tolerance and charity to the indiginous people of the promised land? Did the Jewish religion coexist peacefully with the other religions of the region, according to the Jewish historical and prophetical books?

The Bible advocates kindness, tolerance, and charity. Only the fiercest of animal impulses can negate that.

[The Persnickety Platypus]

I don't see what Old Testament accounts have to do with Christianity.



The New Testament teachings (the only bit of doctrine a Christian conversation need relate to) are as clear and straightforward a text as one could ever hope to find. Be kind. Be gentle. Love one another. Don't take revenge. ect ect ect.

[McCulloch]

I don't see what Old Testament accounts have to do with Christianity.



The New Testament teachings (the only bit of doctrine a Christian conversation need relate to) are as clear and straightforward a text as one could ever hope to find. Be kind. Be gentle. Love one another. Don't take revenge. ect ect ect.

Oh, sorry. I thought that the Christian Bible consisted of both the Old and New Testaments all inspired by the same unchanging eternal God.

[QED]

I don't see what Old Testament accounts have to do with Christianity.

The New Testament teachings (the only bit of doctrine a Christian conversation need relate to) are as clear and straightforward a text as one could ever hope to find. Be kind. Be gentle. Love one another. Don't take revenge. ect ect ect.

Hold on a moment, I thought that both testaments of the Bible stated that the word of God endures for all time:

The grass withers, the flower fades, but the word of our God will stand forever.

...but the word of the Lord stands forever." And this is the word that was preached to you.

All your words are true; all your righteous laws are eternal.

So if the morality of the Old Testament came from God's perfect knowledge of absolute moral truth, and God's word is eternal, then it follows that the moral judgments of the Old Testament are also eternal. In this light I'm afraid to say that your cherry-picking looks particularly contrived.

[The Persnickety Platypus]

Romans 7:4
You have died to the laws in Moses' Teachings through Christ's body. You belong to someone else, the one who was brought back to life.

Am I cherry-picking, therefore, when I decide to ignore the Old Testament laws? I am merely doing as the Bible instructs.

Allow me to take a step back for a second...

Did the chosen tribe of God following God's instructions show kindness, tolerance and charity to the indiginous people of the promised land?

The chosen tribe, following God's instructions. Is that not the prime difference between the scourge of the promised land and the various attrocities committed in the name of God? God instructed the Jews to clear out the Canaanites; clearly this was done to benefit His grand scheme. The people of Canaan were evil, and had rejected God's commandments.

How can the Old Testament wars be used as models for the justification of attrocities? God never gave orders to carry out the Crusades or Inquisition. According to Moses' account, the people of Canaan deserved death. The standard in those times was an eye for an eye. Was God wrong to rid the world of them?

God's laws are eternal, but that does not mean the teachings will not change in accordance to the given time frame. Hebrews 4:12, "God's word is living and active".

The New Testament gives absolutely no pretext for violence. My original argument was that the NT teachings are a sound model for how to conduct one's life. I stand by that.

[McCulloch]

The chosen tribe, following God's instructions. Is that not the prime difference between the scourge of the promised land and the various attrocities committed in the name of God? God instructed the Jews to clear out the Canaanites; clearly this was done to benefit His grand scheme. The people of Canaan were evil, and had rejected God's commandments.

Clearly God seems to have changed his modus operandi. In ancient times God tells his people to brutally wipe out their enemies because they are evil and have rejected Him. Now God wants his people to forgive their enemies and to preach and to teach forgiveness and God's love to those who are evil and reject his commandments. Yes, the Christian God is a vast improvement over the Ancient Hebrew God.

[The Persnickety Platypus]

I don't think the change was as drastic as you make it seem...

Isa 55:7
Let wicked people abandon their ways. Let evil people abandon their thoughts. Let them return to the LORD, and he will show compassion to them. Let them return to our God, because he will freely forgive them.

God has always been merciful (often to varying degrees, depending on the circumstance). The people living in the promised land seemed to have surpassed their limit.

The only difference in the New Testament is the comming of Christ and his sacrifice for all sin. The crucifiction illustrates God's true mercy.