Anglo-Israelism.

[McCulloch]

For debate:

1. Is there any evidence to support the idea that the people of Western European descent, particularly those in Great Britain, are the direct lineal descendants of the Ten Lost Tribes of Israel?
2. Are there any linguistic links between the Hebrew language and English, Welsh, Cornish or Manx?
3. Could the British Royal Family be directly descended from the line of King David?
4. Is it possible that the Stone of Jacob (Genesis 28:18) is the Stone of Scone, used for centuries in the coronation of the monarchs of Scotland, later British monarchs? Do the British Empire and the American republic feature in Jewish or Christian prophetic literature?
5. Is mixed-race marriage a sin?

[christian1488]

How many times must I post that Elizabeth Dilling photocopied pages from the Soncino Babylonian Talmud!

Doesn't matter. You want us to take you seriously in quoting the Talmud, then YOU quote from it.

.........and send us to the Talmud, not to Elizabeth Dillard.

I mean, why not? Either she got them correct, in which case you don't need her; you can go get the primary source yourself and cite it, or she messed with 'em, in which case you don't want to use her anyway.

There is a reason that scholars cite their sources. It is so that the reader can GO CHECK THEM OUT.

So.

Go check them out and report, please.

How can those pages be taken out of context?

Well, now, see, that's the problem. How do you know they haven't been? The solution to both questions is to go to the original source. If you do that, then you don't need to keep quoting one of the most virulent bigots ever published. You can include the context yourself. See how that works?

This is more of a cast that you don't want to read because it is to hard to believe!

You are quite right about that one. It is, actually, impossible to believe. I do, you see, consider the source.

As for the Jew's been God's chosen people,why in the world was Jesus sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel if the Jews do not believe in Jesus?

(grin)

I'm a Mormon. I know that seems to be a non-sequitur, but the thing is, *I* happen to believe that those 'lost sheep' were the folks over in the Americas.

Now this isn't an invitation to discuss MY beliefs, mind you. It's simply a notification that asking the above question is actually begging it. Don't assume that something means the same thing to your reader as it does to you when you use it as a prooftext.

<snip more Dilling stuff, unread.>

http://www.come-and-hear.com/dilling/chapt03.html

Click on exhibit,you can then see the PHOTOCOPIED PAGES

If they are photocopied, you can find the originals. Cite them. Make sure she didn't fiddle with the photocopies.

It's not that hard.
<snip to here>

READ THIS CAREFULLY

I don't think so.

It's not easy for a non-Jew to get a copy of the Babylonian Talmud,that is why Elizabeth Dilling was lucky to get a copy!

Jews do not exactly hand copies of the Talmud to non-Jews due to what it contains,from what I've gathered the Talmud you find in stores is censored,the uncensored one is for the Jews which they do not sell,in stores!

I send you to Elizabeth Dilling because she has photocopied the important bits from the Babylonian talmud!

If you think Elizabeth Dilling messed with the Talmud,then you would have to say the same for Martin Luther,as he read the Talmud then wrote his book ''the Jews and their lies''
And you would also have to state these men were ''wrong'' and had no reason to attack the Jews...

SYLVESTER I. Condemned Jewish anti-Christian activity.

GREGORY I ('The Great'). Protested wholesale circumcision of Christian slaves by Jewish traders, who monopolized the slave trade in Europe and the Middle East and were widely suspected of supplying white girls to Oriental and African buyers.
(They still do that today,in Israel,in their brothels!)
http://www.rense.com/general88/aston.htm - White Sex Slavery in Israel.

GREGORY IX. Condemned the TALMUD as containing "every kind of vileness and blasphemy against Christian doctrine."

BENEDICT XIII. His Bull on the Jewish issue (1450) declared:

"The heresies, vanities and errors of the TALMUD prevent their knowing the truth."

JULIUS III. Contra Hebreos retinentes libros (1554) ordered the TALMUD burned "everywhere" and established a strict censorship over Jewish genocidal writings -- an order that has never been rescinded and which presumably is still binding upon Catholics.

PIUS IV. Condemned Jewish genocidal writings.

GREGORY XIII. Declared that Jews "continue to plot horrible crimes" against Christians "with daily increasing audacity."

CLEMENT VIII. Condemned Jewish genocidal writings.

ALEXANDER VIII. Condemned Jewish genocidal writings.


I mean photocopied pages from their Talmud? I don't think the perversion and anti-Christianity is taken out of context,Dilling published the relevant bits...
Why else would the Jews be expelled out of 109 locations throughout history? Because they were so nice?


http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/luther.htm - The Jews and their Lies (Extracts) by Martin Luther












http://www.come-and-hear.com/dilling/chapt03.html

[dianaiad]

It's not easy for a non-Jew to get a copy of the Babylonian Talmud,that is why Elizabeth Dilling was lucky to get a copy!

Baloney. Just did a Google search using "'Babylonian Talmud' text" and got over 600,000 'hits.' I didn't look past the first five....and all five of them have the full text of the Talmud either in searchable text online or on CD's.

I'm sure that if you put a little thought into this, you'd find it. Took me a whole 10 seconds.

Jews do not exactly hand copies of the Talmud to non-Jews due to what it contains,from what I've gathered the Talmud you find in stores is censored,the uncensored one is for the Jews which they do not sell,in stores!

....and HOW do you know that there is an 'uncensored' version of the Talmud?

Because, of course, the one you can actually go look at doesn't have all the awful things you've been told are in it. Therefore there MUST BE another, 'secret' text that only Elizabeth Dillard, et al, knows about.

Uh huh.

I send you to Elizabeth Dilling because she has photocopied the important bits from the Babylonian talmud!

I see. Somehow she got a copy of this super secret Talmud that only Jews know about; so utterly secret that only Dillard has a copy?

Sure.

If you think Elizabeth Dilling messed with the Talmud,then you would have to say the same for Martin Luther,as he read the Talmud then wrote his book ''the Jews and their lies''
And you would also have to state these men were ''wrong'' and had no reason to attack the Jews...

Great Googly Moogly.

So you are excusing the Dillards of the world by pointing at Martin Luther, who was HUGELY antisemitic?

....and why would you think that I would be all that impressed with Martin Luther's credentials, anyway--even if he had NOT been frothing at the mouth antisemitic?

.....and here we go again with the Dillard stuff.

Goodness. Do you cheer for the Czar in 'Fiddler on the Roof?"

[christian1488]

It's not easy for a non-Jew to get a copy of the Babylonian Talmud,that is why Elizabeth Dilling was lucky to get a copy!

Baloney. Just did a Google search using "'Babylonian Talmud' text" and got over 600,000 'hits.' I didn't look past the first five....and all five of them have the full text of the Talmud either in searchable text online or on CD's.

I'm sure that if you put a little thought into this, you'd find it. Took me a whole 10 seconds.

Jews do not exactly hand copies of the Talmud to non-Jews due to what it contains,from what I've gathered the Talmud you find in stores is censored,the uncensored one is for the Jews which they do not sell,in stores!

....and HOW do you know that there is an 'uncensored' version of the Talmud?

Because, of course, the one you can actually go look at doesn't have all the awful things you've been told are in it. Therefore there MUST BE another, 'secret' text that only Elizabeth Dillard, et al, knows about.

Uh huh.

I send you to Elizabeth Dilling because she has photocopied the important bits from the Babylonian talmud!

I see. Somehow she got a copy of this super secret Talmud that only Jews know about; so utterly secret that only Dillard has a copy?

Sure.

If you think Elizabeth Dilling messed with the Talmud,then you would have to say the same for Martin Luther,as he read the Talmud then wrote his book ''the Jews and their lies''
And you would also have to state these men were ''wrong'' and had no reason to attack the Jews...

Great Googly Moogly.

So you are excusing the Dillards of the world by pointing at Martin Luther, who was HUGELY antisemitic?

....and why would you think that I would be all that impressed with Martin Luther's credentials, anyway--even if he had NOT been frothing at the mouth antisemitic?

.....and here we go again with the Dillard stuff.

Goodness. Do you cheer for the Czar in 'Fiddler on the Roof?"

You did a search on Babylonian Talmud' ? right? do any of the search results contain what Elizabeth Dilling managed to get a hold of? or are they censored?

http://halakhah.com/ - SONCINO BABYLONIAN TALMUD ONLINE

Check Elizabeth Dilling's references,with the link above to her book on the Talmud

http://www.come-and-hear.com/dilling/dcontents.html - Come and hear


As for Martin Luther,he wrote the Jews and their lies AFTER he read the Talmud!

The Talmud and Martin Luther,
the Father of Protestantism

When Pope Leo X started selling indulgences in 1517, this helped precipitate Luther's break with the Church, and the nailing of his theses on the door of the Wittenberg Cathedral. Almost immediately Jews flocked to the new Protestant banner. Luther was sought after by 4 Jews. He in turn wrote a laudatory publication, "Jesus Christ Was Born a Jew," filled with sympathy for their long unbelief, which Luther laid to the unsympathetic attitude of the Catholic Popes and hierarchy, and on his part welcoming the Jews to his heart.

Present-day Catholic and Protestant sources are largely ignorant, however, of the fact that, later, Luther found that Jews who had encouraged him to break with the Church were [page 10] attempting to Judaize his followers. He then read the Talmud, as introduced to him by a truly converted Jew. Afterwards, he wrote "The Jews and Their Lies," with such denunciatory philippics that they make parallel utterances of the Popes almost pale by comparison " this only after he became aware of the truth.


ANTI-SEMITISM

Are we to say Jesus was anti-semite?

Read John 8 and see what Jesus said to the Jews...

John 8:44:Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

Read Matthew 23....

Matthew 23:2:Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:

Matthew 23:33:Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

Matthew 23:35:That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.

Rabbi Louis Finkelstein in Volume 1 of The Pharisees, the Sociological Background of their Faith says, "Pharisaism became Talmudism, Talmudism became Medieval Rabbinism, and Medieval Rabbinism became Modern Rabbinism. But throughout these changes of name, inevitable adaption of custom, and adjustment of Law, the spirit of the ancient Pharisee survives unaltered."

TRADITION OF THE ELDERS


Matthew 15:1-9:1Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,

2Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

3But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

4For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

5But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

6And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

7Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

8This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

9But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

The Babylonian Talmud was originally called "The Tradition of the Elders" (laws of men).

[Malachi-Zede-El]

Relax I was jokeing about marrying Nubian , It really doesn't matter to me FoReal you brought it duh , chill . Stop assumeing thing will ya . I see your still playing teacher , Trying to tell me , What I ought to say , And ought not to say .

Someone should. Or rather, it probably would do you some good to pay attention when they do.

Again your assumeing that when I went to these houses of worship to question these people , I went their to attack / asult them ,

Fair assumption, if you behave there as you do here.

Are you FoReal . I don't even do that here . Unless someone step to me wrong , A few people here have a problem with me because they think they are some type of Scholar . And they're not . Most here post thing they were told to say / believe have faith in from their Teacher / Minster / Pastor , Rabi , Iman Etc . They were not allow to question these people of fear of being call the devil or kick out .

I see. If they agree with you and all your cut and paste plagiarism, then they have free and open minds. If they disagree with you, and call you out on that plagiarism from discredited sites, then they are the ones who are being brainwashed and not thinking for themselves.

Gotcha.

You speak of being Serious '' Yes '' Within Religion rather it be Islamism , Mormanism , Christism , Judaism To name just a few , Keyword Ism = Denomination / Sect , All teaching diffrent doctrine , Which one would you say have the Truth . Mind your all these Teacher / Minster / Pastor , Rabi , Iman , Scholar , Theologian , Are writeing books , makeing tape etc ( All are teaching something diffrent . ) So again tell me who really teaching the word of God here .

My opinion?

Not you.

Plzzz don't tell me these men / woman were Inspired from on high to teach man / woman of a God , Who is every man's / woman personal God , Yet mediators were necessary as if God could not merely think his being into everyone's heart without the Stress and Strain of Religious instructions .

I see...so all those prophets mentioned in the bible were not necessary? Nothing they taught was/is required?

When I spoke of having and open mind , I meant I'm able to think / speak for myself . Unlike few here , They're told what to Do / How to do / When to do thing , And they just obey without questioning ; This is why you have the need to Correct / Tell people what to do . And when someone like myself doesn't obey / adhere to your order or regest . You take it personal .( Case and point lololol )

Let's see. You write an unintelligible sentence, and when I ask you to clarify what you wrote, you inform me that I don't speak English, but that it's OK with you if I want to think I'm an English teacher. You go on and on about how, if your grammar and syntax are lousy, it's because it's our fault for not speaking 'real' English. You have done little BUT issue personal insults, and then accuse me of taking it personally.

Well, gee whiz, how very odd of me, to be sure.

< You know, like the ESL learner who joins an English language debate forum, and when he massacres a sentence, blames the reader because WE don't speak 'real English' >

You know I could write a post on the english langauge ,

Oh, would you? It would be interesting reading.

But few here would take it as another Attack insult .

I would, actually, be rather interested in seeing how you do with it. Should I assign a topic? Perhaps you could give us a five page essay, complete with bibliography (at least three sources--Wikipedia isn't a source) regarding the Great Vowel Shift? Or perhaps you could write about a book called Ivanhoe and a certain conversation between two Saxon peasants at the beginning of the book regarding the difference between the Norman and the Saxon speech patterns...very funny, actually. Or how about a small article regarding the difference between English and Latin Grammar rules, and when we finally stopped trying to force Latin rules on a basically Germanic language?

Translate Beowulf? That's also very funny. Chaucer's good, too, or Shakespeare..you could write about how the language has changed what we lost, what we say instead, some of the vocabulary shifts....

Feel free to write what you'd like, actually. As I said, it would be an interesting read.

But it also show how much you know about the language your pushing . But then again , You'll just say I'm Anti-english lolololol

Being yall love pushing this english langauge thing .

Actually, yes. I do 'love pushing this English language thing.' That's what English teachers do. It's in the job description and everything.

dianaiad < says > Someone should. Or rather, it probably would do you some good to pay attention when they do.

Mal < Says > You have very bad Habit of telling people what they should / shouldn't do , Because the way you were taught . That doesn't make what you was taught was right . Like I said before your only passsing on what was on by someone you feel was a teacher , that was pass on to Him / Her . Your like a robot you keep saying the same thing over and over , Until the one who have Program you add more information to you . ( And this not and Attack / Insult ) . You did say you have been doing this for 60 years ''Yes'' . That means your only know one thing , what you was taught nomore / noless . Again ( this not and Attack / Insult ) .

dianaiad < says > Fair assumption, if you behave there as you do here.

Mal < says > There you go again ( Behave ) lololol , What you really means I should act the way you feel I should . Meaning fall in line with your train of though .

dianaiad < says > see. If they agree with you and all your cut and paste plagiarism, then they have free and open minds. If they disagree with you, and call you out on that plagiarism from discredited sites, then they are the ones who are being brainwashed and not thinking for themselves.

Mal < says > Again your Assuming very bad Habit , But it's ok I understand you were taugh these things . Why would I or anyone expect someone to agree with them , When your Questioning there belief's / faith /religion . Unless your following the say school of though. Case in point christian1488 you attack / insult Him / Her because they see things diffrently- You say they're Anti-this or Anti-that . Just because they don't follow the same Script / Books You feel / t was right , It like everyone wrong who doesn't addhere to your train of though . It's people like you who breeds , Hatred , Separation , Ignorance , And the many War's on the planet because they dare not adhere to your though's . You also speak of ( cut and paste plagiarism ) . If I were posting things you Believe / Taught , Accept , You wouldn't say anything , And accept me has one of you , But I'm Not . This is what I meant when said I able to think for myself . This make me a Threat , Because I can't be control , And the fear of other might see what I'm posting have some truth in it . And that fact that you will nolonger be able to control their though . And they became to think for themselves like christian1488 , So you began to Attack / Insult / Label him Anti-this or that , But it's ok for you and those who think like to Speak Evil , Attack / Insult / Label , Other , Just like goat doe with me , Do you really think I didn't know he would search the web for my information , Did I at anytime claim I hadn't been to other fourms no . You can't really believe 80% of the question ask here are not being ask in other forum duh . goat does what the media does when they see someone as a threat they label that person , So you join in and Attack / Insult , christian1488 / me . To stay in his / her grace . It All In The Play Book . lololololol

dianaiad < says > My opinion? / Not you.
Mal < says > Wrong again , their not your opinion , Because your keep tell others what was pass on to you Right , So it can't be your opinion , Their your teacher opinion Right .

dianaiad < says > I see...so all those prophets mentioned in the bible were not necessary? Nothing they taught was/is required?

< Mal< says > Their you go again trying to be slick lololol ( This what I said ) Plzzz don't tell me these men / woman were Inspired from on high to teach man / woman of a God , Who is every man's / woman personal God , Yet mediators were necessary as if God could not merely think his being into everyone's heart without the Stress and Strain of Religious instructions . [ don't tell me these men / woman were Inspired from on high to teach man / woman of a God - speaking of the people of this day in time , Writeing Books making Tapes etc just to get payed / And they all tell a diffrent story then the prophet's . So again which one these story are the word of God , That these people are making money off , Saying they got their calling from God-himself ,

dianaiad < says > Let's see. You write an unintelligible sentence, and when I ask you to clarify what you wrote, you inform me that I don't speak English, but that it's OK with you if I want to think I'm an English teacher. You go on and on about how, if your grammar and syntax are lousy, it's because it's our fault for not speaking 'real' English. You have done little BUT issue personal insults, and then accuse me of taking it personally.

Mal < says > I Said according to what you were taught . What was english . Why should I be impress because you cliam to be a teach ? When you yourself say you were taught What To Say / How To Say The Things You Say . by someone who told you it was english . And you accept it on His / Her say so . And now your forceing / pushing it on other , What a joke . What your doing is Removeing one History / Culture / Language / Way of life etc etc . To live in the image and after the likeness of those who taugh you these thing . When you , yourself don't even speak english yourself , By the way the first Attack / Insult came from you when you felt the need to tell how I should be talking . Why would I want to Talk like you . your funny . What's [ Odd ] You really believe other cultures should live in the image and after the likeness of you . What Madness . One would think you and those who think like you ( Is / Or / Are God ) lololololol .

dianaiad < says > I would, actually, be rather interested in seeing how you do with it. Should I assign a topic? Perhaps you could give us a five page essay, complete with bibliography (at least three sources--Wikipedia isn't a source) regarding the Great Vowel Shift? Or perhaps you could write about a book called Ivanhoe and a certain conversation between two Saxon peasants at the beginning of the book regarding the difference between the Norman and the Saxon speech patterns...very funny, actually. Or how about a small article regarding the difference between English and Latin Grammar rules, and when we finally stopped trying to force Latin rules on a basically Germanic language?

Mal < says > Why waste time when according to you Most Languages Are Dead , And if you would be truthful in my post I use the language the scriptures where writen in , I also post a post explaing where your , Sorry not your Bible , Because your Bible was created by The founder of The Mormon church , Joseph Fielding Smith was A Freemason , An Entered Apprentice . Who cliam he found Plate's with God words on the and he Translated them . Now why would God put his scriptures on a plate , And give it to a Freemason to Translated them . When they see the devil equal to God . Hummm their goes that open mind thinking again . Now your going label Anti-Mormon . Because the above is a Fact .

It is a Scientific fact that Archeologists have found tablets dated thousands of years before your actual Kadmon , Zakar , Adam < aramic > A name merely meaning of the '' Dark Brownish Red , Ground '' And Eve , Nekaybaw , Hawwah < aramic >Whiuch mean '' Life or Living '' . The Earliest know documents in Cuneiform were recorded in Sumerian , The language of the inhabitants of Southern Mesoptamia and Chaldea . These document were Tablets know as ; The Atra -Hasis , The Enuma Elish , And The Gilgamesh Epics . Tablets Of The Descent Of Ishtar To The Underworld , Tablets Of Nergal and Arishkegal , Tablets Of Adapa . Tablets Of Etana , The Akkadian Tablets and many more . Cuneiform was used as a sctopt as well as a spoken language by the Eloheem .

And later from this language came the languages Ashuric / Syriac ( Arabic ) and Aramic / Phoenician ( Hebrew ) . The Enuma Elish '' Mean '' When On High '' The Enuma Elish , which is the Babylonian story of creation is named after the first two words of the narrative of the Babylonian book '' Enuchus '' ,

These Tablets were recorded way before Aramic / Phoenician ( Hebrew ) or Ashuric / Syriac ( Arabic ) even existed . The Ashuric language spelled Asshur stemmed from Asshur , A son of Shem who was the son of Noah , Just like Aram ( Genesis 10 ; 21 - 23 ) . Bible on the Web Search was , Aranic / Phoenician ( Hebrew ) Genesis 10 ; 22 , Asshuric / Syriac ( Arabic ) Genesis 10 ; 22 .

Asshur son of Shem and Faatin , Aram son of Shem and Faatin . Aramic come from a man name Aram . The 5th son of Shem as mentioned in Genesis 10 ; 22 , Aramic ( Hebrew ) was the language of the Aramaens , The descendants of Aram .

Ancestral lineage of Aram ~
Aram son of Genesis 10 ; 33 .
Shem son of Genesis 5 ; 35 .
Noah son of Genesis 5 ; 32 .
Lamech son of Genesis 5 ; 28 - 29
Methusael son of Genesis 5 ; 25 .
Enoch son of Genesis 5 ; 21 .
Jared son of Genesis 5 ; 18 .
Mahalaleel son of Genesis 5 ; 15 .
Kenan son of Genesis 5 ; 12 .
Enosh son of Genesis 5 ; 9
Seth son of Genesis 5 ; 6 .
Adam son of Genesis 5 ; 3 . Bible on the Web Search

The country Aram settled in was then called '' Aram , '' Number 23 ; 7 . The fact , The language was named after Aram himself , Proves that he was a leader , A chief , Or a mighty man in his tribe . When a dialect evolved . It usually was named after the most powerful , Or outsanding member of the tribe , Or clan ; In this case it was Aram . The name of the country of Aram appears in The Hebrew Scripture Psalm 60 ; 1 Bible on the Web Search as Aramnaharaim meaning '' Aram Of The Two Rivers . '' It was called this , because it was located between The Tigris ( Idiglat ) and Euphrates ( Firattu ) rivers .

dianaiad < says > Actually, yes. I do 'love pushing this English language thing.' That's what English teachers do. It's in the job description and everything

Mal < Wrong > It your job to remove other people History and cultures bottom line . When You Can Control A Man's / Woman's Thinking You Don't Have To Worry About His / Her Action , Like your trying to do with christian1488 and anyone who doesn't fall in line with your train of though , Because it's your job Right lololololololol .

Oh forgot this

Capital Punishment Crimes ; - Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests . Deuteronomy 17 ; 12 , States And I Quote ; And the man that will do Presumptuously and Will Not Hearken unto the Priest that standeth to Minister there before the Lord thy God or unto the judge , even that Man Shall Die ; and thou shalt put away the evil from Israel .

Death To Followers Of Other Religions ; - Exodus 22 ; 20 , States And I Quote ; He That Sacrificeth unto Any God save unto the Lord Only , he Shall Be Utterly Destroyed .

Kill Nonbelievers ; - 2Chronicles 15 ; 12 - 13 , States And I Quote ; And they entered into a Covenant to seek the Lord God of their Fathers with all their heart and with all their soul . Verse 13 . That whosoever would Not Seek The Lord God Of Israel Should Be Put To Death whether small or great whether Man or Woman .


Kill Followers Of Other Religions ; - Deuteronomy 13 ; 7 - 12 ,States And I Quote ; Namely of the gods of the People which are round about you night unto thee , or far off from thee , from the one end of the Earth even unto the other end of the earth . Verse 8 . Thou Shalt not Consent unto him , nor Hearken unto him ; neither shall thine eye pity him , neither shalt thou spare , neither Shalt thou Conceal . Verse 9 . But thou shalt surely kill him thine Hand shall be First upon him to Put Him To Death , and afterwards the hand of all the people . Verse 10 .
And thou shalt stone him with stones that he Die , because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the Lord thy God , which brought thee out of the land of Egypt , from the house of bonfage . Verse 11 . And all Israel Shalt Hear and fear , and shall do no more any such Wickedness as this is among you . Verse 12 . If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities which the Lord thy God hath given thee to dwell there , saying .


Burn Nonbelievers

Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 ) So the next time some Christian tells you about the "love of God", show them this Post and ask them "Why does God want me to burn animals and humans?"









You know the more I talk to people like you it conformation of what I Have Research / Already Know . Thankyou .

First - christian1488 have the right post whatever he / she wish , And it doesn't make Him / Her Anti-anything . It just another way of calling Him / Her the Enemy because Him / Her doesn't see things the way The ( We ) You keep speaking . In most of your post you keep using the We in it . As if this ( We) you speak of Are Right , And those who doesn't see things the way the ( We ) are Wrong .

Now I'm not going answer everything you post because we have been overs this two or three time already . You keep saying same thing over and over as if you say it enough I'n going to accept it or believe it . Now you claim to be a teacher of language . Now anyone who call Him / Herself a teach language , Know Language comes with a History / Cultures / Away of Life . And these so-called teacher Know they are removeing one ( History / Cultures / Away of Life . ). By pushing / forcesing , Their language History / Cultures / Away of Life . on other . So stop acting like you don't know what I'm saying to you

Now you spoke of your mother and how you was rise and how english is part of you History / Cultures / Away of Life . Right ? Yet those who were not born speaking english nor does their History / Cultures / Away of Life . have anything to do with your .

Should drop their language , History / Cultures / Away of Life . And be force to speak english , which doesn't have anything to do with their History / Cultures / Away of Life . Just because the ( We ) you use in the post . Said so .

Now I'm not going to get into how prople like yourself go into other country and push your way of life , meaning religion / language etc etc . on other people . Because then your going come up with all these Excuse / Lie's . The reson why I know this because have been to few of these country . They go into these country with the Red Cross , Keyword Cross say they're helping people , And change their whole History / Image .

Funny thing when I said something about Tone's in one of my post to you , You act as if you didn't know what I were saying . When I said something about the 50 States in the U.S. How they call themselve speaking english and they all sound diffret because of their Tone , Now you speak of Tone. Lololololol.


You also speak of me copying & paste and these are not my words and some one else . Hummm you have a very big ego , Thinking no-one can have knowledge but you , Now that funny I see coat have brian wash you into thinking I'm not able to have the knowledge I have been posting . And have to use another person knowldge . But I Notice you or him didn't even try to disprove what I post .

Yet you claim to be knowledge-able when it come to scripture . Righttttttttt .

Now Joseph Fielding Smith was Freemason was The Mormon church . Was a Freemason and this a fact . And like I said I'm not buying into this thing , God written his scritures on some plates , Bereal . At anytime a flag should have went it should have been he said God written scriptures on some plates LOLOLOLO He new it was people like you out their who believe anything if he use the name God .Well another saying . If I Can Get You To Believe I Can Get You To Do Most Anything . Just like they have you believing your english should been spoke all over the planet Lolololol. By the way I never said I had anything against Freemason , I said I don't accetp that God would sent a Freemason some plates with his scriptures to teach his people .

But you do have the habit of trying to put your words in other people mouth .

Leave you with this At anytime you wish to Challege anything I have post . Your more them welcome ok . But understand something that Anti-thing doesn't get it with me , That just another play on words / You realy don't have an answer . So you labe a person to change the subject at hand .

By the way by personal life his none of you business , Un-like you feel you have to share things about your personal life . As if it should matter , It doesn't to me . this was about the english language . Meaning you can't Teach me anything , About anything . It a big diffrent between believeing / knowing . I can say this because you use the word believe alot . Anytime a person can believe God write scripture on plates . OOOOO-boy look out .

You'll be wasteing your time if answer this post . I only step into your post to see where your head was at . And my though's were right .

[dianaiad]

[quote="christian1488"]<snip to end>

You are wasting time.

....and not getting the point.

Which is: it is not my job to hunt down the sources for your assertions. It's YOUR job. The Talmud is online, easily searchable. YOu made the claims as to what's in it; it's your job to go there and prove your claims.

NOt through some photocopied cut and paste silliness from a woman who thought that Theodore Roosevelt was a Jew, a Marxist, that we shouldn't have entered into WWII and that the Jews got what was coming to them.

OF course it is impossible to prove to you that there is NOT some secret Talmud that only the Jews know about, that says something that the ones you can find actually say...but if there is such a critter, you will have to find it and show it to us.

You know, YOU will.

nothing Dillard has to say is worth the paper it's not written on. I will ignore any references to her works or her site, if you use them as a primary text for what Jews 'really' believe.

[JohnPaul]

<snip to end>

You are wasting time.

....and not getting the point.

Which is: it is not my job to hunt down the sources for your assertions. It's YOUR job. The Talmud is online, easily searchable. YOu made the claims as to what's in it; it's your job to go there and prove your claims.

NOt through some photocopied cut and paste silliness from a woman who thought that Theodore Roosevelt was a Jew, a Marxist, that we shouldn't have entered into WWII and that the Jews got what was coming to them.

OF course it is impossible to prove to you that there is NOT some secret Talmud that only the Jews know about, that says something that the ones you can find actually say...but if there is such a critter, you will have to find it and show it to us.

You know, YOU will.

nothing Dillard has to say is worth the paper it's not written on. I will ignore any references to her works or her site, if you use them as a primary text for what Jews 'really' believe.

Hello, Dianaiad,

Congratulations on maintaining your cool. I have never seen a thread like this. What are the chances of two such (-censored-) coming together at the same time?
I thought most anti-Semitism in America was a more subtle, high-class thing, not the frothing-at-the-mouth gutter lunacy displayed here. The only thing missing was an accusation that Jews roast and eat Christian babies. Or maybe that one slipped by me?

John

[Goat]

I posted from the talmud,read from the come and hear website...they are photocopied pages from the soncino babylonian talmud!
http://www.come-and-hear.com/dilling/index.html

No, you posted from Elizabeth Dilling, who used her own cherry picking style with the Talmud. If you had 'posted from the Talmud,' you would be sending us to a PRO-Jewish site which had the entire Talmud available for our use.

To quote the very first line of the site you sent us to:

Elizabeth Dilling was a widely known critic of Judaism prior World War II until her death in 1967.

In fact, Elizabeth Dilling was a very well known anti-semite. She never had anything good to say about Jews--and actually thought that Roosevelt was probably a Jew and a Marxist. She was notorious for her antisemitism. Anybody who uses her as a source for information about Judaism would use Jack Chick to study Catholicism and Ed Decker to study Mormonism.

So, no, you did NOT 'quote the Talmud." Sorry.

If the Jews are God's chosen people why don't they believe in Jesus,I wrote that,that is not copy and paste,though you do not have an answer to that...

They were God's chosen people long before Jesus came along. They remain God's chosen people. If they are still waiting for the Messiah, well....so they are wrong about that. It will all get figured out in the end.

Tell me; if you have a child, and that child becomes unreasonably stubborn about something you care deeply about, does he suddenly become NOT your child?

<snip everything from Elizabeth Dilling...as I wouldn't believe anything she said about the Jews. I would go to another source for confirmation if she had written that some Jews live in Israel.>

Find your Talmud quotes from reading the Talmud. Do not use antisemitic, hatefilled, NON-Jewish sites as a source. Not with me. I will not accept them as valid.

BTW, neither would any peer-reviewed journal or respectable professor. Get your information from the primary sources, please.

How many times must I post that Elizabeth Dilling photocopied pages from the Soncino Babylonian Talmud!

How can those pages be taken out of context?

This is more of a cast that you don't want to read because it is to hard to believe!

As for the Jew's been God's chosen people,why in the world was Jesus sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel if the Jews do not believe in Jesus?

The Jews consider themselves the messiah.....
Kethuboth 111a) In other words, to call the Jewish people the Messiah is no metaphor; they are literally just that; they are the "Messiah," says the Talmud.

Why would they be waiting for a messiah if they consider themselves the messiah?

Why in the world would Jesus be sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel,if the Jews would not believe in Jesus,if they are God's people....

the word Jew is not even mentioned in the torah!

Adam,Noah,Abraham,Issac,Jacob,the 12 Tribes,Moses-WERE NOT JEWS

THAT WOULD MAKE THE MISSION OF JESUS TO ISRAEL-POINTLESS!

Matthew 4:17:From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

What say you?The ministry of Jesus,the Crucifixion,the resurrection?

A future messiah for the Jews makes all what Jesus did POINTLESS!

The Jews connect with the definition of ''antichrist''





The Talmud " Five Deaths to Jesus

Jesus, as stated in both the Talmud and Jewish Encyclopedia, gets "four legal methods of execution" and is Crucified as well, as a blasphemer of Pharisee Judaism.

Jesus stoned, then "hanged" or crucified, Sanhedrin 43a-45b (Exhibit 46 and Exhibit 48); Sanhedrin 67a (Exhibit 75), where under another phony name (Ben Stada) Jesus is identified as "Jesus of Nazareth." See Jewish Encyclopedia, Exhibit 277 and Exhibit 8.

As to Judas, we are told (Exhibit 279) that: "when Judas found he could not touch Jesus in any way, in aerial battle, he defiled him" (the "privy concept," once again, which runs through the Talmud).

Jesus' apostles all killed, Sanhedrin 43a, b (Exhibit 47). Their names are decoded by Jewish Encyclopedia (see Exhibit 278, right column.)

Jesus crucified as a "blasphemer," Sanhedrin 46a (Exhibit 51), Jewish Encyclopedia (Exhibit 276).

Jesus burned, Sanhedrin 52a (Exhibit 52); manner of burning, Yebamoth 6b (Exhibit 151), verified by Jewish Encyclopedia under "Balaam" (Exhibit 274). He is "lowered into dung up to his armpits then a hard cloth was placed within a soft one, wound round his neck and the two loose ends pulled in opposite directions forcing him to open his mouth. A wick was then lit, and thrown into his mouth so that it descended into his body and burnt his bowels his mouth was forced open with pinchers against his wishes (Exhibit 52) And: "The death penalty of 'burning' was executed by pouring molten lead through the condemned man's mouth into his body, burning his internal organs. (Exhibit 152)

Jesus strangled: "He was lowered into dung up to his armpits then a hard cloth was placed within a soft one, wound round his neck, and the two ends pulled in opposite directions until he was dead." (Talmud, Sanhedrin 52a, Exhibit 53)

Well, this here is a lie, since Sanhedren 52a is not talking about Jesus at all



And, it just so happens I have a copy of Sanhedrin, and while it does in rather graphic language discuss execution, it never mentions Jesus, nor does it take those words literally. After looking at those words, there is a discussion about what the polemics means.

This is what I would consider 'Lying by removing context.'

The entire discussion of Sanhedrien 52A (which suffers because 51B and 52B are not included) is as follows

Talmud - Mas. Sanhedrin 52a
the verse, she profaneth her father?1 " He employs it in accordance with R. Meir's dictum, as it has
been taught : R. Meir used to say: What is meant by the verse, she profaneth her father? If he [the
father] was regarded as holy, he is now regarded as profane;2 if he was treated with respect, he is
now treated with contempt; and men say, Cursed be he who begot her, cursed be he who brought
her up, cursed be he from whose loins she sprung. R. Ashi said: in accordance with whose view is a
wicked man called the son of a wicked man, even if he is actually the son of a righteous man? " It
is in accordance with this Tanna's dictum.3
THAT IS THE MANNER OF STONING.
To what does this refer?4 " To the statement [in a preceding Mishnah]: When the verdict [of
guilty] was finally announced, he [the accused] was led out to be stoned . . .5 Now, the scaffolding
[for stoning] was twice a man's height etc.6 And because the Tanna is about to teach the manner of
death by fire, he sums up the foregoing with the words: THAT IS THE MANNER OF STONING
etc.
MISHNAH. THE MANNER IN WHICH BURNING IS EXECUTED IS AS FOLLOWS: HE
WHO HAD BEEN THUS CONDEMNED WAS LOWERED INTO DUNG UP TO HIS ARMPITS,
THEN A HARD CLOTH WAS PLACED WITHIN A SOFT ONE,7 WOUND ROUND HIS NECK,
AND THE TWO LOOSE ENDS PULLED IN OPPOSITE DIRECTIONS, FORCING HIM TO
OPEN HIS MOUTH. A WICK WAS THEN LIT, AND THROWN INTO HIS MOUTH, SO THAT
IT DESCENDED INTO HIS BODY AND BURNT HIS BOWELS. R. JUDAH SAID: SHOULD
HE HOWEVER HAVE DIED AT THEIR HANDS [BEING STRANGLED BY THE BANDAGE
BEFORE THE WICK WAS THROWN INTO HIS MOUTH, OR BEFORE IT COULD ACT], HE
WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN EXECUTED BY FIRE AS PRESCRIBED. HENCE IT WAS DONE
THUS: HIS MONTH WAS FORCED OPEN WITH PINCERS AGAINST HIS WISH, THE WICK
LIT AND THROWN INTO HIS MOUTH, SO THAT IT DESCENDED INTO HIS BODY AND
BURNT HIS BOWELS. R. ELEAZAR B. ZADOK SAID: IT ONCE HAPPENED THAT A
PRIEST'S DAUGHTER COMMITTED ADULTERY, WHEREUPON BUNDLES OF FAGGOTS
WERE PLACED ROUND ABOUT HER AND SHE WAS BURNT. THE SAGES REPLIED,
THAT WAS BECAUSE THE BETH DIN AT THAT TIME WAS NOT WELL LEARNED IN
LAW.
GEMARA. What is meant by a WICK? " R. Mathna said: A lead bar.8
Whence do we know this?9 " It is inferred from the fact that burning is decreed here;10 and was
also the fate of the assembly of Korah,11 just as there the reference is to the burning of the soul, the
body remaining intact, so here too. R. Eleazar said: It is deduced from the employment of the word
burning here and in the case of Aaron's sons;12 just as there the burning of the soul is meant, while
the body remained intact, so here too.
Now, he who deduces it from the assembly of Korah, whence does he know [that they were thus
burnt]? " Because it is written: [Speak unto Eleazar . . . that he take up the censers out of the
burning . . . The censers of these sinners against their own souls,13 implying that their souls were
burned, but their bodies were unharmed. And the other?14 He maintains that they were literally burnt
[i.e., their bodies], and what is the meaning of against their own souls? " That they incurred the
punishment of fire because of [the pollution of] their souls; as Resh Lakish [taught]. For R. Simeon
b. Lakish said: What is the meaning of the verse, with hypocritical mockers in feasts, they gnashed
upon me with their teeth?15 Because they hypocritically [i.e., polluting their own sincerity] flattered
Korah in return for the feast he set before them, the Prince of Gehenna16 gnashed his teeth against
them [for their destruction]. Now he [R. Eleazar] who infers it from the sons of Aaron, whence does
he know [that their bodies were not burnt]? " Because it is written, And they died before the
Lord,17 teaching that it was like normal death [from within]. And the other? " He maintains that
they were actually burnt, whilst the verse, And the died before the Lord, shews that the fire
commenced from within, as in normal death. For it has been taught: Abba Jose b. Dosethai said: Two
streams of fire issued from the Holy of Holies, branching off into four, and two entered into each of
their nostrils and burned them.18 But it is written, And the fire devoured them?19 " This implies
them but not their garments.
But why should we not learn [the manner of death by fire] from the bullocks that were burnt,20
just as there they were actually burnt, so here too? " It is logical to learn this from man, because
these have the following points in common: " man, [ii] sin, [iii] soul, and [iv] piggul.21 On the
contrry, should we not compare it rather to the burnt bullocks, since they have in common the
carrying out of God's command , and [ii] permanency?22 " Even so, the others have more in
common.
Now, he who deduces it from the assembly of Korah, why did he not learn it from Aaron's sons?
" Because they were actually burnt [this being his opinion]. Then why not deduce from them [that
this shall be the method of burning]? " R. Nahman answered in the name of Rabbah b. Abbuha:
The verse saith, But thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself,23 [which implies:] choose an easy death
for him.24 Now, since we have R. Nahman's dictum, what need is there of the gezerah shawah? "
But for the gezerah shawah " I would think that burning of the soul, the body remaining intact, is
not deemed burning at all; whilst as for [the implication of the verse], Thou shalt love thy neighbour
as thyself, this can be fulfilled by piling up an abundance of faggots to cause a speedy death. Hence
the teaching of the gezerah shawah.
Moses and Aaron once walked along, with Nadab and Abihu behind them, and all Israel following
in the rear. Then Nadab said to Abihu, Oh that these old men might die, so that you and I should be
the leaders of our generation. But the Holy One, blessed be He, said unto them: We shall see who
will bury whom. R. Papa said: Thus men say: Many an old camel is laden with the hides of younger
ones.25
R. Eleazar said:
____________________
(1) Ibid. XXI, 9. Since R. Ishmael maintains that an arusah is burnt, but not a nesu'ah, deducing this by analogy, and not
admitting the gezerah shawah based upon the phrase her father, what do these words teach?
(2) In the sense of not holy.
(3) That the father is cursed and reviled for his offspring's misdemeanours.
(4) [This is Rashi's reading, found also in MS.M.; cur edd.: What does be teach that he states?]
(5) Supra 42b.
(6) Supra 45a.
(7) The soft one alone could not exert sufficient pressure to open his mouth; whilst a hard one alone would bruise the
skin and unnecessarily disfigure him (Rashi).
(8) Lit in the Mishnah will therefore mean melted.
(9) That death by fire was thus carried out, instead of burning the body.
(10) Lev. XXI, 9. She shall be burnt with fire.
(11) Num. XVII, 4. And Eliezer the priest look the brazen censers, wherewith they that were burnt had offered.
(12) Lev. X, 6. Let your brethren . . . bewail the burning which the Lord hath kindled.
(13) Num. XVII, 2f(E. V. XVI, 37f).
(14) R. Eleazar.
(15) Ps. XXXV, 16.
(16) In the valley to the south of Jerusalem, known as the valley of the son of Hinnom, children were at one time
sacrificed to Moloch (II Kings XXIII, 10; Jer. II, 23; VII, 31f). For this reason the valley was deemed accursed, and
Gehenna thus became a synonym for hell. It is assumed to be in charge of a demon prince, who voraciously demands
multitudes of victims (Shab. 104a).
(17) Lev. X, 12.
(18) So that the fire commenced, within and spread without.
(19) Ibid. This implies limitation: them, but not something else; now, if they were entirely burnt, what does this word
exclude?
(20) As sacrifices, where, of course, the carcasses were burnt. Lev.IV, 12 et passim.
(21) I.e., both refer to (i) man, (ii) punishment for sin, (iii) destruction of the soul, and (iv) in both there is no law of
piggul. Piggul, lit., abomination, a sacrifice slaughtered with the unlawful intention of eating it beyond the prescribed
limits of time; for the flesh of sacrifices had to be eaten within prescribed times (v. Zeb. V, 2. 53a). But the burnt
bullocks differed from man on all these points
(22) I.e., they have the following in common: (i) each is performed by man in obedience to God's command, but Aaron's
sons and the assembly of Korah were destroyed by God himself; (ii) the law of execution by fire, as that of sacrifices,
was of permanent validity, whereas in the other two cases their deaths were unique, the result of miracles confined to
particular times.
(23) Lev. XIX, 18.
(24) But the burning of the body is a most painful death.
(25) I.e., many an old man surprises the young.

While graphic language, it does not mention Jesus at all, and then you get a whole discussion from various rabbi's about what it means.. and many do not take it literally, but rather figuratively.

This is just one example.. but all the examples show equal amounts of lying.

[Slopeshoulder]

I'm with johnpaul.
Can this thread be locked and the persons in question banned for hate speech? (and for mangling language and logic). We don't need neo nazi's here, by whatever name they call themselves. Let them poison some other more appropriate forum.

[dianaiad]

First - christian1488 have the right post whatever he / she wish , And it doesn't make Him / Her Anti-anything . It just another way of calling Him / Her the Enemy because Him / Her doesn't see things the way The ( We ) You keep speaking . In most of your post you keep using the We in it . As if this ( We) you speak of Are Right , And those who doesn't see things the way the ( We ) are Wrong .

OK, Christian1488 has the right to post as he wishes, within the rules of the forum.

By the same token, the rest of us have the right to react to what he says.

Or does freedom of speech only go your way?

Now I'm not going answer everything you post because we have been overs this two or three time already . You keep saying same thing over and over as if you say it enough I'n going to accept it or believe it . Now you claim to be a teacher of language . Now anyone who call Him / Herself a teach language , Know Language comes with a History / Cultures / Away of Life . And these so-called teacher Know they are removeing one ( History / Cultures / Away of Life . ). By pushing / forcesing , Their language History / Cultures / Away of Life . on other . So stop acting like you don't know what I'm saying to you

I'm not acting. You aren't making any sense.

Now you spoke of your mother and how you was rise and how english is part of you History / Cultures / Away of Life . Right ? Yet those who were not born speaking english nor does their History / Cultures / Away of Life . have anything to do with your .

Should drop their language , History / Cultures / Away of Life . And be force to speak english , which doesn't have anything to do with their History / Cultures / Away of Life . Just because the ( We ) you use in the post . Said so .

You are not being forced to speak English. If you don't want to do so, go participate in a forum that uses a different language. . Trust me, I won't follow you there, because I'm only fluent in one language. English. That is my culture...and you are here participating in it. It is not destroying YOUR history and culture to expect you, if you attempt to speak to me in English, to actually make sense when you do--or if you don't, be graceful when people ask you to repeat/restate/clarify.

Now I'm not going to get into how prople like yourself go into other country and push your way of life , meaning religion / language etc etc . on other people . Because then your going come up with all these Excuse / Lie's . The reson why I know this because have been to few of these country . They go into these country with the Red Cross , Keyword Cross say they're helping people , And change their whole History / Image .

I see. You are angry at English speakers for going into YOUR culture and changing it, insisting that you speak English in your nations, and refuse to learn your language and respect your history and culture. Well, you are quite right. English speakers HAVE done some pretty extensive invading, conquering and colonialization throughout history. So have the Spanish. And the Arabic speaking Muslims. And the Romans, the Greeks, the Germans, the Huns, the Chinese, the Japanese, the Portuguese....and various native American tribes to one another...

It's history. We have all had ancestors guilty of it.

Your solution is to come to a religious debate forum that was designed for English speakers, and return the favor by declaring that we don't really speak English, that if you mangle our language that it's our fault for not understanding you, and that no matter who screws up, its our fault?

If this were a thread about English colonialism, I could see the object lesson. However, I don't think the irony here is intentional.

Funny thing when I said something about Tone's in one of my post to you , You act as if you didn't know what I were saying . When I said something about the 50 States in the U.S. How they call themselve speaking english and they all sound diffret because of their Tone , Now you speak of Tone. Lololololol.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Dialect? Accent? Something else?

Are you really going to sit there and declare that there is only one English language, one dialect....and that all others are somehow 'not English?"

You also speak of me copying & paste and these are not my words and some one else . Hummm you have a very big ego , Thinking no-one can have knowledge but you , Now that funny I see coat have brian wash you into thinking I'm not able to have the knowledge I have been posting . And have to use another person knowldge . But I Notice you or him didn't even try to disprove what I post .

That's because I'm pretty much ignoring it.

Yet you claim to be knowledge-able when it come to scripture . Righttttttttt .

Have I, now?

Now Joseph Fielding Smith was Freemason was The Mormon church

I think we visited this already. Joseph Fielding Smith was never a Freemason. Joseph Fielding Smith didn't come along until considerably after Joseph Smith Jr. was murdered.

Now Joseph Smith Jr. was a Freemason. Not an 'entered apprentice.' He was further up the heirarchy than that.

. Was a Freemason and this a fact .

No, you have the wrong man...and the wrong level of Freemasonry if you HAD identified the right guy.

And like I said I'm not buying into this thing ,

I'm not asking you to 'buy into it,' just get the facts straight.

God written his scritures on some plates , Bereal . At anytime a flag should have went it should have been he said God written scriptures on some plates LOLOLOLO He new it was people like you out their who believe anything if he use the name God .Well another saying . If I Can Get You To Believe I Can Get You To Do Most Anything . Just like they have you believing your english should been spoke all over the planet Lolololol. By the way I never said I had anything against Freemason , I said I don't accetp that God would sent a Freemason some plates with his scriptures to teach his people .

If you don't have anything against Freemasons, why do you think that God does?

But you do have the habit of trying to put your words in other people mouth .

Just getting the facts straight.

Leave you with this At anytime you wish to Challege anything I have post .

I just, uh, did. Your 'expose' of Mormonism didn't have a single fact correct.

It wasn't Joseph Fielding Smith.
It was Joseph Smith Jr, who was NOT an 'entered apprentice,' he was closer to a 'Master Mason.'
He didn't 'find' the plates. He claimed to have been given them.
If you are going to make fun of someone else's beliefs, it really is more effective if you actually know what the facts are.

Your more them welcome ok . But understand something that Anti-thing doesn't get it with me , That just another play on words / You realy don't have an answer . So you labe a person to change the subject at hand .

By the way by personal life his none of you business , Un-like you feel you have to share things about your personal life . As if it should matter , It doesn't to me . this was about the english language . Meaning you can't Teach me anything , About anything .

You are right. I can't.

It a big diffrent between believeing / knowing . I can say this because you use the word believe alot . Anytime a person can believe God write scripture on plates . OOOOO-boy look out .

You'll be wasteing your time if answer this post . I only step into your post to see where your head was at . And my though's were right .

Well, it was my time to waste.

[christian1488]

<snip to end>

You are wasting time.

....and not getting the point.

Which is: it is not my job to hunt down the sources for your assertions. It's YOUR job. The Talmud is online, easily searchable. YOu made the claims as to what's in it; it's your job to go there and prove your claims.

NOt through some photocopied cut and paste silliness from a woman who thought that Theodore Roosevelt was a Jew, a Marxist, that we shouldn't have entered into WWII and that the Jews got what was coming to them.

OF course it is impossible to prove to you that there is NOT some secret Talmud that only the Jews know about, that says something that the ones you can find actually say...but if there is such a critter, you will have to find it and show it to us.

You know, YOU will.

nothing Dillard has to say is worth the paper it's not written on. I will ignore any references to her works or her site, if you use them as a primary text for what Jews 'really' believe.

Jesus attempts to seduce women, is excommunicated by a rabbi and then worships a brick, was a seducer of Israel, and practiced magic. (Talmud, Sanhedrin l07b; Exhibit 117), also the Jewish Encyclopedia (See Exhibit 277).

http://halakhah.com/sanhedrin/sanhedrin_107.html#PARTb - Sanhedrin 107b

Read note 13 and 17


http://halakhah.com/sanhedrin/sanhedrin_106.html#PARTb - Sanhedrin 106b

Read notes 2,3 and 6

Sanhedrin 106b

Did the children of Israel slay with the sword among them that were slain by them.1 Rab said: They subjected him to four deaths, stoning, burning, decapitation and strangulation.2

A certain min3 said to R. Hanina: Hast thou heard how old Balaam was? " He replied: It is not actually stated, but since it is written, Bloody and deceitful men shall not live out half their days,4 [it follows that] he was thirty-three or thirty-four years old.5 He rejoined: Thou hast said correctly; I personally have seen Balaam's Chronicle, in which it is stated, 'Balaam the lame was thirty years old when Phinehas the Robber killed him.'6


Mar, the son of Rabina, said to his sons: In the case of all [those mentioned as having no portion in the future world] you should not take [the Biblical passages dealing with them] to expound them [to their discredit], excepting in the case of the wicked Balaam: whatever you find [written] about him, lecture upon it [to his disadvantage].

2.This is suggested by the use of the plural 'among them that were slain by them,' intimating that the various deaths inflicted upon others were all suffered by Balaam. Thus he was hung (strangulation), a fire was lit under him (burning), his head was struck off (decapitation), and then he was allowed to fall to earth (stoning); v. supra 45a.

3.Heretic, v. Glos.

6.[According to the view that all the Balaam passages are anti-Christian in tendency, Balaam being used as an alias for Jesus, Phinehas the Robber is thus taken to represent Pontius Pilatus, and the Chronicle of Balaam probably to denote a Gospel (v. Herford op. cit. 72ff.). This view is however disputed by Bacher and others: cf. Ginzberg, Journal of Biblical Literature, XLI, 121.]


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