Was Jesus a great teacher?

[McCulloch]

Christianity's biggest strength is the teachings of Jesus. They're the very foundation of Christianity. Jesus was a great teacher and being a Christian myself, I see no one who has ever topped Him, nor have I found any of His teachings too difficult to defend.

Questions for debate:
Was Jesus a great teacher? Are all of his teachings easy to defend? Is there anything that he could have made clearer? Did he make mistakes? Did he leave out anything important? How could he have improved as a teacher?

[Goat]

[Replying to Goat]

Hum. I have no idea what he said, or didn't say. However, the quote attributed to him about 'you must hate your parents if you want to me my disciple' is rather disturbing. Also, the parable that ends up "Those people who won't let me rule over them, bring them before me and slay them' has pretty bad overtones.

The second sentence contradicts your third. If you don't believe anything the scripture says then you will not believe any specific verse either. Now you are immediately in No Man's Land since we as believers primarily use the Bible to depict what Jesus said in history.

That is the believers problem. I don't accept the New Testament to be an accurate representation of what might or might not have been said by Jesus. There is enough hard evidence of things being modified and added later than I am sure not everything is from Jesus.. and they were written far enough in time away from the ministry of Jesus (if he indeed existed at all as an historical figure), that any saying attributed to him is filtered through the need of 'what does the writer want to teach', not what Jesus actually said.

[Nickman]

But Christians are not calling the support department and getting "false information." They are going straight to their bibles. They are praying to Jesus to guide their understanding, and apparently Jesus is not coming through.

Yes but the devil isn't waiting for the call. He is initiating the confusion.

Can you please provide evidence that an invisible imaginary entity is creating confusion among Christians? Can you show that this is a more plausible than the ambiguity of the Bible? If not, you have no argument.

What seems more reasonable and plausible;

A) There is an entity who is invisible who is running a muck behind Christians when they read their Bibles, and causing them to misinterpret the Bible?

I can confirm that with scripture.

2nd Cor 4: 3 Even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled in those who perish;
4 in whom the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn on them.
WEB

B) The Bible was written ambiguously, thus allowing any position or translation to be supported by its texts?

Again, I can only confirm it with scripture.....

Mark 4: 11 He said to them, "To you is given the mystery of the Kingdom of God, but to those who are outside, all things are done in parables,
12 that 'seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest perhaps they should turn again, and their sins should be forgiven them.'"
WEB

I understand that you can ONLY confirm it with scripture, but any religion can do the same thing for their beliefs just as you do with the ones you favor.

You see how you just proved my point? You can confirm BOTH answers with your bible. I am sure that I can ask another question with 3 or 4 answers and you can confirm them as well, with scripture.

[Zetesis Apistia]

But Christians are not calling the support department and getting "false information." They are going straight to their bibles. They are praying to Jesus to guide their understanding, and apparently Jesus is not coming through.

Yes but the devil isn't waiting for the call. He is initiating the confusion.

Can you please provide evidence that an invisible imaginary entity is creating confusion among Christians? Can you show that this is a more plausible than the ambiguity of the Bible? If not, you have no argument.

What seems more reasonable and plausible;

A) There is an entity who is invisible who is running a muck behind Christians when they read their Bibles, and causing them to misinterpret the Bible?

I can confirm that with scripture.

2nd Cor 4: 3 Even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled in those who perish;
4 in whom the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn on them.

So all those in conflicting demoninations who are trying to follow Jesus and the Bible are really unbelievers, and that is why their minds are veiled? Come on, this verse does not answer why there is confusion and contradiction between Christians.

The wheat and the tares must grow up together. Believers that have put their trust in Christ can be found in denominations across the board. So can false converts.

[Zetesis Apistia]

I understand that you can ONLY confirm it with scripture, but any religion can do the same thing for their beliefs just as you do with the ones you favor.

You see how you just proved my point? You can confirm BOTH answers with your bible. I am sure that I can ask another question with 3 or 4 answers and you can confirm them as well, with scripture.

Well duh. The bible is the foundation of my Christian beliefs. Everything about it must be confirmed or denied using scriptures as a filtering system. Even evolution needs science to confirm it. Things pertaining to Christianity are true, because the bible says they are true. Deviating from scriptures is the very reason we have so much confusion within Christianity.

[10CC]

[Replying to post 212 by Zetesis Apistia]
Hey Zed!
I would appreciate your input to either of these threads.
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23783
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752
TIA

[Zetesis Apistia]

[Replying to post 212 by Zetesis Apistia]
Hey Zed!
I would appreciate your input to either of these threads.
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23783
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752
TIA

The bible says that when we sin we become guilty souls and are subject to the prescribed penalty under God's law.

Eze 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

God gave us an opportunity to have our guilt transferred to Christ.

Isaiah 53: 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

So if we put our trust in Jesus we can escape the prescribed punishment.

Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

As for aborted fetuses or small children. We are born in a state of innocence. In other words, there will come a time in each of our lives when our sin consciousness will be awakened. You notice how a two year old can take a piece of candy from the shelf in a convenient store, and put in in his pocket as tho he had done no wrong? Well that is because the concept of right and wrong must be developed in each of us. Where there is no understanding of wrong there can be no guilt.

James 4:17 Therefore to him who knows to do good, and does not do it, to him it is sin.

So aborted fetuses and even small children are not guilty where the concept of sin is not developed. So according to that aborted babies and small children which are not "sin conscious" will go to heaven without the need for salvation. They are already innocent.

[10CC]

[Replying to post 212 by Zetesis Apistia]
Hey Zed!
I would appreciate your input to either of these threads.
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23783
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752
TIA

The bible says that when we sin we become guilty souls and are subject to the prescribed penalty under God's law.

Eze 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

God gave us an opportunity to have our guilt transferred to Christ.

Isaiah 53: 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

So if we put our trust in Jesus we can escape the prescribed punishment.

Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

As for aborted fetuses or small children. We are born in a state of innocence. In other words, there will come a time in each of our lives when our sin consciousness will be awakened. You notice how a two year old can take a piece of candy from the shelf in a convenient store, and put in in his pocket as tho he had done no wrong? Well that is because the concept of right and wrong must be developed in each of us. Where there is no understanding of wrong there can be no guilt.

James 4:17 Therefore to him who knows to do good, and does not do it, to him it is sin.

So aborted fetuses and even small children are not guilty where the concept of sin is not developed. So according to that aborted babies and small children which are not "sin conscious" will go to heaven without the need for salvation. They are already innocent.

I hope you don't mind Zed but I transferred this post to http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752

[Zetesis Apistia]

[Replying to post 212 by Zetesis Apistia]
Hey Zed!
I would appreciate your input to either of these threads.
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23783
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752
TIA

The bible says that when we sin we become guilty souls and are subject to the prescribed penalty under God's law.

Eze 18:4 Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

God gave us an opportunity to have our guilt transferred to Christ.

Isaiah 53: 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.

So if we put our trust in Jesus we can escape the prescribed punishment.

Joh 11:26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?

As for aborted fetuses or small children. We are born in a state of innocence. In other words, there will come a time in each of our lives when our sin consciousness will be awakened. You notice how a two year old can take a piece of candy from the shelf in a convenient store, and put in in his pocket as tho he had done no wrong? Well that is because the concept of right and wrong must be developed in each of us. Where there is no understanding of wrong there can be no guilt.

James 4:17 Therefore to him who knows to do good, and does not do it, to him it is sin.

So aborted fetuses and even small children are not guilty where the concept of sin is not developed. So according to that aborted babies and small children which are not "sin conscious" will go to heaven without the need for salvation. They are already innocent.

I hope you don't mind Zed but I transferred this post to http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... hp?t=23752

Not at all.

[Nickman]

I understand that you can ONLY confirm it with scripture, but any religion can do the same thing for their beliefs just as you do with the ones you favor.

You see how you just proved my point? You can confirm BOTH answers with your bible. I am sure that I can ask another question with 3 or 4 answers and you can confirm them as well, with scripture.

Well duh. The bible is the foundation of my Christian beliefs. Everything about it must be confirmed or denied using scriptures as a filtering system. Even evolution needs science to confirm it. Things pertaining to Christianity are true, because the bible says they are true. Deviating from scriptures is the very reason we have so much confusion within Christianity.

I disagree. How are these denominations deviating from the scriptures? Again, any view can be made from the bible. I can start a Christian Slavery Church and be completely justified by the "word."

[Zetesis Apistia]

I understand that you can ONLY confirm it with scripture, but any religion can do the same thing for their beliefs just as you do with the ones you favor.

You see how you just proved my point? You can confirm BOTH answers with your bible. I am sure that I can ask another question with 3 or 4 answers and you can confirm them as well, with scripture.

Well duh. The bible is the foundation of my Christian beliefs. Everything about it must be confirmed or denied using scriptures as a filtering system. Even evolution needs science to confirm it. Things pertaining to Christianity are true, because the bible says they are true. Deviating from scriptures is the very reason we have so much confusion within Christianity.

I disagree. How are these denominations deviating from the scriptures? Again, any view can be made from the bible. I can start a Christian Slavery Church and be completely justified by the "word."

If I tell another man I love him someone could interpret that as me being gay. People can spin things to say whatever they want things to say. That is just plain being dishonest when they do. Paul even warned against such the like......

Romans 16: 17 I urge you, Brothers, to be on your guard against people who, by disregarding the teaching which you received, cause divisions and create difficulties; dissociate yourselves from them.
18 For such persons are not serving Christ, our Master, but are slaves to their own appetites; and, by their smooth words and flattery, they deceive simple-minded people.

There is nothing wrong with the scriptures. There is much wrong with self serving people that interpret scripture in order to support their own devices. Why is that so difficult?