Important characteristics of Christianity

Exploring the details of Christianity

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OnceConvinced
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Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #1

Post by OnceConvinced »

OpenYourEyes wrote: if you probed deeper you'd find out that the differences are not that great when it comes to the important characteristics of Christianity. For instance, the overwhelming majority of Christian denominations believe in the divinity of Christ, the resurrection, the nature of God, the authority of Scripture, they share the same Bible canon, etc. Dividing over what day to worship, as Seventh-day Adventists are distinguished for has little impact on understanding the core messages of Christianity.
Which important characteristics/core messages do the majority of Christians agree upon?

Which are crucial when it comes to determining whether someone is a true Christian and saved?

Are these things listed by OpenYourEyes crucial for salvation?

Belief in:
- the divinity of Christ
- the resurrection

Do the majority of Christians agree on...
- the nature of god?
- the authority of scripture?
- which versions of the bible to use?

Society and its morals evolve and will continue to evolve. The bible however remains the same and just requires more and more apologetics and claims of "metaphors" and "symbolism" to justify it.

Prayer is like rubbing an old bottle and hoping that a genie will pop out and grant you three wishes.

There is much about this world that is mind boggling and impressive, but I see no need whatsoever to put it down to magical super powered beings.


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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #31

Post by onewithhim »

JehovahsWitness wrote:
OnceConvinced wrote:
JehovahsWitness wrote: [Replying to post 1 by OnceConvinced]

In the bible Jesus is reported as saying the chief characteristic of Christianity would be love. Most Christians accept that this to be the case.

JW
Could you clarify a little more please? Are you saying that the most important characteristic of Christianity is to love one another... as God loved you?
No, the first command is to love GOD above all else. The loving of "one another" is the second.
MATTHEW 22:35-40 (NIV)
35 One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: 36 “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?� 37 Jesus replied: “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and greatest commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.�
You're saying that's pretty much the only thing that really matters when it comes to judging whether one is saved or a "true Christian"?

No I made no mention of "being saved" or of "salvation". The question was about the important characteristics of Christianity and I pointed out the what Jesus said would be the chief or principle identifiable characteristic of true Christianity: Love. It is the basis upon which everything else (including meeting the requirements for salvation) must be based and the main way True Christianity will be able to be identified.

JOHN 13:35
By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another."


JW
Yes, excellent post! One has to ask, how is a person showing love to his fellow believer when he joins the military in any country to learn to kill members of his own religion in another part of the world? Also, how is learning to kill people following the command of Jesus at Matthew 5:44 where he says to "love your enemies"? Even our enemies! So, taking this into consideration, could religions that support war honestly be called Christian?


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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #32

Post by Monta »

[Replying to post 31 by onewithhim]


"Yes, excellent post! One has to ask, how is a person showing love to his fellow believer when he joins the military in any country to learn to kill members of his own religion in another part of the world? Also, how is learning to kill people following the command of Jesus at Matthew 5:44 where he says to "love your enemies"? Even our enemies! So, taking this into consideration, could religions that support war honestly be called Christian?"



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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #33

Post by onewithhim »

[Replying to post 32 by Monta]

Why the question mark Monta? The theme is important characteristics of Christianity, and JW brought up the point that the MAIN characteristic is love.

Can I surmise that you have never given that any thought?

:-s Now is as good a time as any to respond to that thought.

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #34

Post by Monta »

[Replying to post 33 by onewithhim]

"Why the question mark Monta? The theme is important characteristics of Christianity, and JW brought up the point that the MAIN characteristic is love.

Can I surmise that you have never given that any thought?

Eh? Now is as good a time as any to respond to that thought."

I kept starring at what you wrote for ages.
You are 100% with the scriptures and i agree but I still
could not give response therefore all I could do is a question mark.

I have not supported any wars in my living memory.

Are you still a Christian if you support war? I accept that I am responsible
for my views, would I be guilty of judging others if i commit myself with
the response?- or would that be a cop-out.

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #35

Post by onewithhim »

Monta wrote: [Replying to post 33 by onewithhim]

"Why the question mark Monta? The theme is important characteristics of Christianity, and JW brought up the point that the MAIN characteristic is love.

Can I surmise that you have never given that any thought?

Eh? Now is as good a time as any to respond to that thought."

I kept starring at what you wrote for ages.
You are 100% with the scriptures and i agree but I still
could not give response therefore all I could do is a question mark.

I have not supported any wars in my living memory.

Are you still a Christian if you support war? I accept that I am responsible
for my views, would I be guilty of judging others if i commit myself with
the response?- or would that be a cop-out.
No, a true Christian would not support war, because he would be going completely against Christ's teachings (Matt.5:44-47). And it is not judging someone to realize that someone is not following Christ and to speak out (probably in a tactful, patient manner). I would say that it IS a cop-out to not say anything. Jesus certainly said plenty when he saw hypocrisy. (E.g., Matthew chapter 23.)





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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #36

Post by marco »

onewithhim wrote:
No, a true Christian would not support war
Well many Jews will be thankful that Churchill did not follow Christ's advice. A saying often attributed to Edmund Burke is:


"The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing"

When Nazi Germany was destroying Europe, Britain did not surrender or join forces placidly with the perpetrators of the Holocaust. It is all very well to make nice statements when one lives in Eden; in the real world, things run differently.

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #37

Post by Elijah John »

marco wrote:
onewithhim wrote:
No, a true Christian would not support war
Well many Jews will be thankful that Churchill did not follow Christ's advice. A saying often attributed to Edmund Burke is:


"The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing"

When Nazi Germany was destroying Europe, Britain did not surrender or join forces placidly with the perpetrators of the Holocaust. It is all very well to make nice statements when one lives in Eden; in the real world, things run differently.
Also, many JWs were massacred by the Nazi's. Turning the other cheek did not move Hitler to repentance.

Doesn't matter if JWs believe in non-violence, if Hitler didn't.

It was the use of righteous force that eventually stopped him.

The same can be applied to current events.

Doesn't matter if some extreme leftists protest against violence and war, not if enemies like ISIS still practice it against the innocent.
My theological positions:

-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.

I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #38

Post by JehovahsWitness »

Elijah John wrote:Also, many JWs were massacred by the Nazi's.
This is very true, thank you for pointing this out, often people forget this. The witnesses resistance against Hitler and his targeting them for their stand is too often overlooked. Many of our German brothers and sisters paid the ultimate price for refusing to join Hitler's army.

JW

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #39

Post by Yahu »

OnceConvinced wrote:
Yahu wrote:
Most if not all translations are bias by the doctrines and contextual understanding of the translators. That is why using multiple translations is advisable.
So from your perspective there's not even one trustworthy translation that would stand on its own?
No. None I have found are without error.

One passage I tend to check when looking at a translation is Isa 57:9

The codex that the KJV translated from has a vowel pointing error. The passage in Isa 57 is clearly about the pagan Baalim worship conducted outside Jerusalem.

The word with the wrong vowel points is from the original un-vowel-pointed 'MLK'. The KJV sees it as 'melek' the word meaning 'king' but the passage is about sacrifices to the pagan deity Molech. Molech is the same word but is vowel pointed with the pattern for 'shame' and turns 'Shameful King' into a proper name of that pagan deity. It isn't really a name but an epitaph.

For example, if you look at the Amplified version, it says 'king [ or Molech]' and leaves it up to the reader to determine which is accurate. I tend to use the Amplified for general usage because it also provides alternate translations in [ ] when a passage can be disputed.

Granted the Amplified doesn't do that will all errors I am aware of.

Even if there isn't an error in the translation, many times they just leave names and such in transliterated Hebrew. Then you have to look up the meaning of the name. A good example of that is the 'field of Zophim' in the story of Balaam and his donkey. Zophim is the Hebrew word for Watchers and is a reference to fallen angels that took human wives. If you don't look up the name meaning, the reference goes right over most reader's head.

So should a name be translated or just transliterated? Should a passage be reworded to give an interpretation of meaning or stay as closely to a word for word translation? Remember Hebrew was an ancient language that didn't contain nearly as many words so many times word pictures were used to convey meaning. Should a passage give the actual meaning or some obscure word picture that gets turned into poetry?

Then you have bias of translators that don't want to be sexual graphic whereas the original text is. An example is in the story of Ruth when Naomi tells Ruth to wait for Boaz to sleep after feasting and drinking at a feast, uncover his penis and have intercourse with him to get a child by a near relative of her dead husband. That was actually allowed under the law for a Levirate widow but many translators cover up the graphic nature because they don't understand the law or don't want to put something so sexual graphic in a holy text. In this case, there are multiple problems. The 'feet' that she uncovers. It actually means apendage and is also an idiom for 'penis'. "Waters of the feet" is a reference to urine for example.

So to hide the sexual nature, they turn it into some cultural myth that laying as someones uncovered feet is somekind of act of ceremony instead of a direct sexual reference.

Another reference gets translated as 'behind a tree in the midst of the garden' when the actual reference is to a sexual act in the tended garden, ie the pagan grove. It is actually 'a tree (asherah pole) in the midst of the backside in the grove' as a reference to having anal sex with a standing phallic symbol to appease the pagan gods. So how many Christians would be offended by a translation that actually said something like that? Now if the translators are not even aware of the activities involved in the pagan sexual worship, they turn the reference into a bit of meaningless poetry. You will probably NEVER see a translation that will do a passage like that. Too many Christians would be outraged.

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Re: Important characteristics of Christianity

Post #40

Post by Yahu »

PghPanther wrote:
Yahu wrote:
OnceConvinced wrote:
Checkpoint wrote:
The majority of Christians do agree on the nature of God and the authority of scripture,
Can you define the nature of God in a way that you think most other Christians would agree on?

When it comes to bible authority, what would you say most Christians would believe?:
A) It's God's infallible word
B) It's God inspired, but contains human errors
c) Other
I would say the Original message was inspired by the Holy Spirit if the passage is prophetic. Then you have things like history or wisdom books that are advice.

Translations will always have human errors because the original language has a lot to do with understanding the context. There is broad variations in how the original Hebrew can be translated. It was not a very precise language which is why many word pictures are used and passages repeated in other words to clarify the meaning.

The God of the Bible is a joke using ancient nomads with primitive oral traditions and scrolls to document the "most important message ever to humanity"......that's absurd.

......what God should have done was put his whole revelation down in digital CD format or on a memory stick and tell humanity to wait a couple thousand years until they could invent a way to access that information.............that way there would be no loss of fidelity or error.
There is a purpose to the imprecise nature of scripture. You can study it your entire life and still gain new insight after years of study.

He rewards those that dig out the mysteries. The more you study, the more that is revealed. It allows for a spiritual growth process over time.

It isn't a clear instruction manual of A do this then B do that. Many of the passages link with other passages elsewhere in scripture that help to clarify things. Then the Holy Spirit may only reveal a new truth to an individual once they are ready to accept it. You have to build a firm foundation them build on top of it with more advanced doctrines. The problems come in when some denomination has its foundational truths in error.

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