Evangelicals vs. Jehovah's Witnesses

[Elijah John]

Evangelicals often call Jehovah's Witnesses, a "cult" and not Christian.

Jehovah's Witnesses, seem to consider Roman Catholics, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox etc, "not-Christian" (JWs please correct me if I'm wrong on this)

Question for debate, why can't all of these groups rightly be considered "Christian"?

And part two of this OP question is directed primarily to Evangelicals, why don't you consider JWs to be Christian?

[Saved75]

[Replying to post 48 by Saved75]


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OK, Thanks.

[onewithhim]

Evangelicals often call Jehovah's Witnesses, a "cult" and not Christian.

Jehovah's Witnesses, seem to consider Roman Catholics, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox etc, "not-Christian" (JWs please correct me if I'm wrong on this)

Question for debate, why can't all of these groups rightly be considered "Christian"?

And part two of this OP question is directed primarily to Evangelicals, why don't you consider JWs to be Christian?

People use the terminology "Christian", But according to the Bible, not every born again believer is a Biblical Christian, Never mind the JWs Catholics and other false religions.
And the reason is, It was the people who saw the disciples acting just like Jesus and doing healings and miracles, That made them call the disciples "Christians".
Acts 11: 20--26.
The Bible tells us that The gospel is preached with Mighty signs and wonders, by the power of God, Rom 15: 19. Mk 16: 17--20. Hen 2: 3--4.

OK, so...

-What is the difference between a "born-again believer" and a "Biblical Christian"?
Sounds to me like an arbitrary dictinction. Please clarify.

-If Jehovah's Witnesses, and Roman Catholicism are "false religions" what is the "true" religion/denomination? Both sects honor God through Jesus, why would either be "false"?

-Doing healings, miracles, signs and wonders is the Biblical sign of a true Christian? So..unless one: a) does healings, b) walks on water, c) raises the dead, d) drinks poison safely, e) handles snakes....they are NOT Christian?

How 'bout you, do you do any or all of these things?

How 'bout these things instead: forgiving others, being a good example to others, giving to charity, giving people hope, being a peacemaker, lifting people's spirits...aren't these signs of a true Christian?

If that is the case, I'm certain that many Catholics and Jehovah's Witnesses qualify!

I have given you the Biblical meaning of a Christian.
People use the meaning of a Christian, as one who believes in Jesus, but the devil believes, but he isn't a Christian.

There is only one way to get saved, (become the true faith ),
and that's the Biblical way of salvation, which the Catholics and the JWS don't teach.

As for your last point, you are getting believers, (the religious type of Christians) mixed up with the Biblical definition of a Christian.

God does use me to heal the sick and do miracles.

Being good, charity, forgiving people , doesn't make one a Christian, even those who don't believe, can do those things.

You apparently aren't familiar with what JWs teach. You say that there is only one way to get saved and we don't teach it.....so, how does one do that? How does one find "the true faith"? What do you say is "the Biblical way of salvation"?

If you can heal the sick and perform miracles, why aren't you healing the world?

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.
In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, and the say only the 144.000 are the Anointed one's who will go to heaven.

Read the Bible, and you'll see which is the Biblical way to get saved.

I am healing the world. [Well God is through me].

Gosh, I guess I am missing your healing events! I really thought that if the world is being healed everyone would certainly hear of it!

[myth-one.com]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.

In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, . . .

But that is exactly what the Bible states.

Whoever teaches that one is not born again in this life is correct.

All teaching otherwise are wrong.

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So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. (I Corinthians 15:42-45)

The Christian body that is sown is corruptible, dishonored, weak, and a natural body. This is the physical body which is buried like a seed, or sown, when Christians die.

At the resurrection, Christians are raised up as incorruptible, glorified, powerful, spiritual bodies.

These Christians were born of water at their physical birth, then died, and were buried.

They will be born again of the spirit at their resurrection.

Since this will be their second birth, they will have been born again.

At the present time, no one has as yet been born again.

[Saved75]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.

In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, . . .

But that is exactly what the Bible states.

Whoever teaches that one is not born again in this life is correct.

All teaching otherwise are wrong.

======================================================================

So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. (I Corinthians 15:42-45)

The Christian body that is sown is corruptible, dishonored, weak, and a natural body. This is the physical body which is buried like a seed, or sown, when Christians die.

At the resurrection, Christians are raised up as incorruptible, glorified, powerful, spiritual bodies.

These Christians were born of water at their physical birth, then died, and were buried.

They will be born again of the spirit at their resurrection.

Since this will be their second birth, they will have been born again.

At the present time, no one has as yet been born again.

One HAS to be born again, IN THIS LIFE.
Eph 2: 1, & v5. "Quickened" means made alive, [Born again].
James 1: 18. "Begat" means Born again. 1 Pet 1: 23. 1 Jn 5: 1, & V4.
Plesee note, They are all in the PAST TENSE, Not future tense.


You are getting the future bodily resurrection mixed up with Present life Spiritual rebirth.

[Monta]

[Replying to onewithhim]


"Gosh, I guess I am missing your healing events! I really thought that if the world is being healed everyone would certainly hear of it! "

And who are we to judge another man's servant?

[myth-one.com]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.

In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, . . .

But that is exactly what the Bible states.

Whoever teaches that one is not born again in this life is correct.

All teaching otherwise are wrong.

======================================================================

So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. (I Corinthians 15:42-45)

The Christian body that is sown is corruptible, dishonored, weak, and a natural body. This is the physical body which is buried like a seed, or sown, when Christians die.

At the resurrection, Christians are raised up as incorruptible, glorified, powerful, spiritual bodies.

These Christians were born of water at their physical birth, then died, and were buried.

They will be born again of the spirit at their resurrection.

Since this will be their second birth, they will have been born again.

At the present time, no one has as yet been born again.

One HAS to be born again, IN THIS LIFE.

Saved75 says one has to be born again in this life.

Jesus simply states that one must be born again:

"Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. (John 3:5-7)

I'll have to side with Jesus.

Eph 2: 1, & v5. "Quickened" means made alive, [Born again].
James 1: 18. "Begat" means Born again. 1 Pet 1: 23. 1 Jn 5: 1, & V4.
Plesee note, They are all in the PAST TENSE, Not future tense.

Here is what Jesus states:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him, should not perish, but have everlasting life. (John 3:16)

And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life (future tense): and I will raise him up at the last day.

If one is born again into everlasting life during this lifetime as you claim, why would they need to be resurrected?

One only needs to be resurrected to life -- if they are dead!

You are getting the future bodily resurrection mixed up with Present life Spiritual rebirth.

Nope, only nonbelievers will be resurrected with mortal physical bodies, and that will be at the second resurrection for mankind which occurs a thousand years after the Second Coming.

Christians will be resurrected and born again into ever lasting spiritual life at the Second Coming:

So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. And so it is written, The first man Adam was a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. (I Corinthians 15:42-45)

You are confusing what you were taught with what the Bible states.

[2timothy316]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.
In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, and the say only the 144.000 are the Anointed one's who will go to heaven.

http://biblehub.com/revelation/7-4.htm

"And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel." Rev 7:4

Isn't Biblical? As you can see it is Biblical. Don't you mean it doesn't fit your doctrine?

However, there will be more that 144,000 saved. Just not saved to Heaven. The Bible says no man can number those.

Rev. 7:9, 14: “After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues..."

[liamconnor]

Evangelicals often call Jehovah's Witnesses, a "cult" and not Christian.

Jehovah's Witnesses, seem to consider Roman Catholics, Protestants, Eastern Orthodox etc, "not-Christian" (JWs please correct me if I'm wrong on this)

Question for debate, why can't all of these groups rightly be considered "Christian"?

And part two of this OP question is directed primarily to Evangelicals, why don't you consider JWs to be Christian?

Hi JW,

The common arguments differentiating Christians from JW's is surely accessible on the internet.

Why do you think they are insubstantial?

[Saved75]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.
In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, and the say only the 144.000 are the Anointed one's who will go to heaven.

http://biblehub.com/revelation/7-4.htm

"And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel." Rev 7:4

Isn't Biblical? As you can see it is Biblical. Don't you mean it doesn't fit your doctrine?

However, there will be more that 144,000 saved. Just not saved to Heaven. The Bible says no man can number those.

Rev. 7:9, 14: “After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues..."

You have overlooked the fact that Rev 7: 15, says the great crowd that no one could number,
we're BEFORE THE THRONE OF GOD ---- In heaven.

[2timothy316]

I do know what the JWs teach about salvation, And I know it' isn't Biblical.
In fact they don't believe one is born again in this life, and the say only the 144.000 are the Anointed one's who will go to heaven.

http://biblehub.com/revelation/7-4.htm

"And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel." Rev 7:4

Isn't Biblical? As you can see it is Biblical. Don't you mean it doesn't fit your doctrine?

However, there will be more that 144,000 saved. Just not saved to Heaven. The Bible says no man can number those.

Rev. 7:9, 14: “After these things I saw, and, look! a great crowd, which no man was able to number, out of all nations and tribes and peoples and tongues..."

You have overlooked the fact that Rev 7: 15, says the great crowd that no one could number,
we're BEFORE THE THRONE OF GOD ---- In heaven.

I didn't over look that scripture, that's why it's in my post. But what many have overlooked is there there are two folds of sheep. 'Little flock' = 144,000 to Heaven and 'Other Sheep' = Uncountable number to stay on Earth. (Luke 12:32; John 10:16)

But you said that 144,000 was not scriptural and that was not true. It is also not true that Witnesses believe only 144,000 will be saved. We believe a 'Great Crowd' will be saved. What we don't believe is that saved means one must go to Heaven. The Bible says that the both Heaven and Earth will be filled with the meek and righteous. "But there are new heavens and a new earth that we are awaiting according to his promise, and in these righteousness is to dwell." 2 Peter 3:13 (Matthew 5:5, Psalm 37:11, Isa 45:18)