The Kingdom of Heaven

[Elijah John]

Does (or will) the Kingdom of Heaven transcend the walls (metaphorical) of the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Will those outside of the Watch Tower organization be part of the Kingdom? Will they inherit "eternal life in Paradise on Earth"?

Why or why not?

[onewithhim]

Does (or will) the Kingdom of Heaven transcend the walls (metaphorical) of the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Will those outside of the Watch Tower organization be part of the Kingdom? Will they inherit "eternal life in Paradise on Earth"?

Why or why not?

This has been thoroughly discussed with you, E.J.

[onewithhim]

Does (or will) the Kingdom of Heaven transcend the walls (metaphorical) of the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses?

Will those outside of the Watch Tower organization be part of the Kingdom? Will they inherit "eternal life in Paradise on Earth"?

Why or why not?

I will not be part of it because I am Christian.

Not part of what?

If you're a Christian then you would be preaching the truth to people and making disciples, just like we are doing. If you are doing that, then I commend you.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 20 by JehovahsWitness]

I think you have, perhaps deliberately, missed the moral of the story.

Best wishes, 2RM.

Sadly, I think YOU are missing a lot that needs to be understood. God never intended for humans to go to heaven. Not until Adam sinned. If he hadn't sinned he would still be here and the planet would be perfect, just the way Jehovah planned. AFTER Adam sinned, God planned for a certain number of people to go to heaven to help bring the earth back to perfection, so that we can live here just the way it was intended in the beginning. Adam dropped the ball big time. Even so, Jehovah's original plans have not been abandoned.

For you to think that the majority of humans will end up in heaven is quite odd, IMHO. Who will all those billions of people in heaven rule over?

Put some thought into reading the posts on the thread "Paradise Earth."

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 28 by Monta]

I think it is invalid because the Bible does not give "being a Jehovah's witness" as a requirement to enter the Kingdom of God, and surely not to be saved. In order to enter the Kingdom one must be born of the water and the Spirit, Jesus said it in John 3. The question is if the members of a specific religion (JW) can only enter the Kingdom and that is ludicrous. Catholic, Protestant, JW, Mormon, these labels don't really matter in the end. It comes down to whether you "confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord" to be saved and whether you were "Born of the water and the Spirit" to enter the Kingdom of God. If anybody tells you anything else it is extra-Biblical. To be clear, I think there are certain denominations where this is more likely to take place (like my own), but the denomination doesn't save you or give you entrance into the Kingdom of God.

I was raised in a church like your own. I saw clearly, after a number of years, that the truth was not evident there.

[onewithhim]

Can't help thinking that your ill-will does you, and your church, no credit. Or is the lack of any sense of humour a necessary attribute for a Jehovah's Witness?

Moderator Comment

Snide comments and digs at other person's personality are considered uncivil on this site. Please refrain from such comments and remain on topic.

Please review the Rules.

So, it's OK to call my posts 'garbled, nonsensical writing', but not OK for me to respond robustly? I told a simple story, with a simple moral, pertinent to the thread title, which was neither garbled nor nonsense. And I resent it being portrayed that way. But, I consider myself duly admonished, and will try to do better in future, though I think JW could do a lot better, also.

Best wishes, 2RM.

You accused JW of being sneaky and misconstruing your story on purpose. Why don't you explain the "moral to the story," if there is one.

[Petrameansrock]

[Replying to post 34 by onewithhim]

What church if you don't mind me asking? These views aren't too mainstream so I think that we might have gone to the same church....

[2ndRateMind]

Can't help thinking that your ill-will does you, and your church, no credit. Or is the lack of any sense of humour a necessary attribute for a Jehovah's Witness?

Moderator Comment

Snide comments and digs at other person's personality are considered uncivil on this site. Please refrain from such comments and remain on topic.

Please review the Rules.

So, it's OK to call my posts 'garbled, nonsensical writing', but not OK for me to respond robustly? I told a simple story, with a simple moral, pertinent to the thread title, which was neither garbled nor nonsense. And I resent it being portrayed that way. But, I consider myself duly admonished, and will try to do better in future, though I think JW could do a lot better, also.

Best wishes, 2RM.

You accused JW of being sneaky and misconstruing your story on purpose. Why don't you explain the "moral to the story," if there is one.

Nowhere did I accuse anyone of being 'sneaky'. I accused JW of being deliberately obtuse, but that is a perfectly valid debating tactic, although one which, like much of rhetoric, becomes less effective when identified and challenged.

As for the moral of the story, it would be far more more telling if you and JW realised it for yourselves. It's a bit like the punch-line of a joke - if someone needs to explain it to you, it loses much of it's impact. So I am loath to explain it, unless you absolutely insist. Much better for you to ponder for yourselves who is really in Heaven, Steve, or the Jehovah's Witnesses.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 34 by onewithhim]

What church if you don't mind me asking? These views aren't too mainstream so I think that we might have gone to the same church....

The majority of JEHOVAH'S witnesses are actually from other churches, some of us searched for the truth for years before finding it with the witnesses. The key is having confidence that God cares enough to have "a people got his name"

JW

[2ndRateMind]

[Replying to post 34 by onewithhim]

What church if you don't mind me asking? These views aren't too mainstream so I think that we might have gone to the same church....

The majority of JEHOVAH'S witnesses are actually from other churches, some of us searched for the truth for years before finding it with the witnesses. The key is having confidence that God cares enough to have "a people got his name"

JW

Oh dear. I really think it is time we Christians got beyond the facile argument:

I believe X
Therefore X is true
Therefore everyone who doesn't believe X is wrong/stupid/sinful.

Can you spot the logical flaws?

As for the idea that:

I believe God is called Jehovah
Therefore God is called Jehovah
Therefore everyone who doesn't believe God is called Jehovah is wrong/stupid/sinful.

Not only would it seem to suffer the same flaws as the general case, but it appears to be an irrelevant and trivial bone of contention as well.

I really don't think God cares what we call Him, so long as we love Him, and each other, as Jesus explicitly wants of us*.

Best wishes, 2RM.

*Mark 12:30-31 KJV

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 39 by 2ndRateMind]

If I have to choose between what you think and what God thinks as expressed in his word the bible, I will choose the latter. I hope you understand,

No offense,

JW