SABBATH...

[Capbook]

Is the Lord's Sabbath in the OT still for God's people in the NT?

Luk 23:56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment

[JehovahsWitness]

He [Jesus]is needed, if one has sin or lives in sin. But, obviously, if one is perfect, he doesn't need that. I don't think any human is perfect.

Please try and think about what this means in relation to the Mosaic law.

All humans are imperfect (sinful); God cannot say that which is sinful is righteous. What he can do however, is say "If you are obedient to my laws (whatever they are) and have a good heart, I will consider (think of) you as having a righteous standing / position. Sadly for Jews , who could not even do that perfectly, they were obliged to constantly sacrifice animals to "apologise" for breaking those laws. (The non-Jews didnt even come that close).

To DECLARE something, is to officially pronounce information about it. Paul is quite catagoric, God will not declare ANYONE righteous based on the law because nobody could keep them all without error.


If no one can perfectly keep Gods laws and animal sacrifices only temporarily allowed for God to overlook this fact, how can anyone ever have a proper relationship with God? What if God said, "You know what, you can never meet my perfect standards, and I can never simply ignore that fact ... What about if we do something different: you forget about trying to get to me by keeping the Sabbath, going to the temple and all the other laws and just put faith in my son. He'll carry and blame for not keeping the law AND carry the guilt of all those gentiles who didnt even know there were rules of behaviour.... put FAITH in him and I'll declare you righteous. It will be righteousness by FAITH not righteousness because YOU had the right attitude to the laws.


WHAT ABOUT THOSE WHO KEPT THE LAW WITH THE RIGHT ATTITUDE?

No one's attitude can earn or obtain a righteous standard: it's IMPOSSIBLE because all people are imperfectl. Your efforts (No matter how sincere) can never result in righteousness, its faith in Jesus, that is the key.[/i]


Can you see how important it is to recognise the end of the law? It represented the end of human action being the basis for a relationship with God and a new way of faith in Jesus sacrifice.

Compromise ( I'll do BOTH: I'll keep the Mosaic law AND have faith in Jesus ) is like saying to someone that offers to pay off your mortage, thanks, I accept. But I'm going to continue to pay the monthly installements of my mortage.

IS that not a de facto rejection of the offer?

To say that if a person keeps the law with the right attitude is claim can be declared righteous is claiming human attitude to their actions is the key and not faith in Jesus


JW

[1213]

...
All those who depend on works of law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not remain in all the things written in the scroll of the Law by doing them.”+ 11 Moreover, it is evident that by law no one is declared righteous with God, because “the righteous one will live by reason of faith.”+ 12 Now the Law is not based on faith. Rather, “anyone who does these things will live by means of them.”+ 13 Christ purchased us,+ releasing us+ from the curse of the Law by becoming a curse instead of us,+ because it is written: “Accursed is every man hung upon a stake.”

The curse of the law is that people must obey it against their will, or they perish. Jesus released people from that. But, it does not mean that the law is not valid, because Jesus says:

Don't think that I came to destroy the law or the prophets. I didn't come to destroy, but to fulfill. For most assuredly, I tell you, until heaven and earth pass away, not even one smallest letter{literally, iota} or one tiny pen stroke{or, serif} shall in any way pass away from the law, until all things are accomplished. Whoever, therefore, shall break one of these least commandments, and teach others to do so, shall be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven; but whoever shall do and teach them shall be called great in the Kingdom of Heaven.
Matt. 5:17-19

[1213]

...Can you see how important it is to recognise the end of the law? It represented the end of human action being the basis ...

I agree that human actions is not the basis and human actions will not save person. But, according to the Bible, people should be righteous. And if one is righteous, it will show in actions.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Matt. 25:46
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23
…He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is right-eous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

[JehovahsWitness]

I agree that human actions is not the basis and human actions will not save person. But, according to the Bible, people should be righteous. And if one is righteous, it will show in actions.

Can any human actually be righteous?

ECCLESIATES 7:20

For there is no righteous man on earth who always does good and never sins

If not how is it that one can have a righteous standard before God by obeying the Mosaic law with good motives?

GALATIANS 2


We who are Jews by birth, and not sinners from the nations, 16 recognize that a man is declared righteous, not by works of law, but only through faith+ in Jesus Christ.+ So we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, so that we may be declared righteous by faith in Christ and not by works of law, for no one will be declared righteous by works of law.

What more has to be written in the bible to prove to you it is ONLY by faith in Christ not obeying the commandements of the Mosaic law (from a good motive) that we can have a righteous standing with God?

Galatians 2:16b" --->>only through faith in Jesus Christ.

Why ? Because no obedience to ANY commandement, can wipe away sin : its impossible.

[Capbook]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

Is the Lord's Sabbath in the OT still for God's people in the NT?

Luk 23:56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment

Since you added a verse as an example, I assume you are referring to a Sabbath DAY. But what about Sabbath weeks, years, months, feasts?

**

What about Romans 14, Galatians 4, Colossians 2?

One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind. 6Romans 14:5

Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. Galatians 4:16-17

Formerly, when you did not know God, you were slaves to those who by nature are not gods. 9 But now that you know God—or rather are known by God—how is it that you are turning back to those weak and miserable forces[d]? Do you wish to be enslaved by them all over again? 10 You are observing special days and months and seasons and years! 11 I fear for you, that somehow I have wasted my efforts on you. Colossians 2: 8-11


I'm just curious where people draw the line and why there?

**

I did see the term "The Lord's day" mentioned somewhere in this thread. If people are getting that term from Revelation, then perhaps some have not considered (or asked Christ) if:

The Lord's Day = the Day of the Lord.

John was in the spirit on the Lord's day (on the day of the Lord), and saw things that happen on that Day.



Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

I am referring to "the Sabbath" not "a Sabbath" in Exodus 20:8-11.
Romans 14:5 the verse does not mentioned the Sabbath.
Galatians 4:16,17 does not talked about the Sabbath as well;
Col 2:8-11, I believe you misquote verses.

I did misquote, I apologize.

Galatians should be 4:9-11 and Colossians 2:16-17. I wrote the actual verses out correctly, but attributed them incorrectly.


I am sorry for the confusion.

Peace again to you.

Yes, again Gal 4:16,17 does not mention Sabbath.
Colossians 2:16,17 The apostle speaks here in reference to some particulars of the hand-writing of ordinances, the Sabbath is in finger written Commandments of God.

[Capbook]

I agree that human actions is not the basis and human actions will not save person. But, according to the Bible, people should be righteous. And if one is righteous, it will show in actions.

Can any human actually be righteous?

ECCLESIATES 7:20

For there is no righteous man on earth who always does good and never sins

If not how is it that one can have a righteous standard before God by obeying the Mosaic law with good motives?

GALATIANS 2


We who are Jews by birth, and not sinners from the nations, 16 recognize that a man is declared righteous, not by works of law, but only through faith+ in Jesus Christ.+ So we have put our faith in Christ Jesus, so that we may be declared righteous by faith in Christ and not by works of law, for no one will be declared righteous by works of law.

What more has to be written in the bible to prove to you it is ONLY by faith in Christ not obeying the commandements of the Mosaic law (from a good motive) that we can have a righteous standing with God?

Galatians 2:16b" --->>only through faith in Jesus Christ.

Why ? Because no obedience to ANY commandement, can wipe away sin : its impossible.

We are saved by God's grace through our faith but not of our works.
We do good actions or works because we are already saved, not to be save.
Keeping the law of God is the result of being saved through our faith. (Eph 2:10)

Eph 2:8 For by such grace you have been saved through faith. This does not come from you; it is the gift of God
Eph 2:9 and not the result of actions, to put a stop to all boasting.
Eph 2:10 For we are God's masterpiece, created in the Messiah Jesus to perform good actions that God prepared long ago to be our way of life.

[1213]

I agree that human actions is not the basis and human actions will not save person. But, according to the Bible, people should be righteous. And if one is righteous, it will show in actions.

Can any human actually be righteous?

This is the history of the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless among the people of his time. Noah walked with God.
Gen. 6:9

If not how is it that one can have a righteous standard before God by obeying the Mosaic law with good motives?

I think this implicates that one can become righteous by the words Jesus said:

But as many as received him, to them he gave the right to become God's children, to those who believe in his name: who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
John 1:12-13
It is the spirit who gives life. The flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and are life.
John 6:63
…He who does righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous. He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. To this end the Son of God was revealed, that he might destroy the works of the devil. Whoever is born of God doesn't commit sin, because his seed remains in him; and he can't sin, because he is born of God. In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the devil. Whoever doesn't do righteousness is not of God, neither is he who doesn't love his brother.
1 John 3:7-10

The words can cause change in person. And when that happens, I believe the law is written in persons heart.

For finding fault with them, he said, "Behold, the days come," says the Lord, "That I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah; Not according to the cov-enant that I made with their fathers, In the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; For they did-n't continue in my covenant, And I disregarded them," says the Lord. "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel. After those days," says the Lord; "I will put my laws into their mind, I will also write them on their heart. I will be to them a God, And they will be to me a people. They will not teach every man his fellow citizen,{TR reads "neighbor" instead of "fellow citizen"} Every man his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,' For all will know me, From the least of them to the great-est of them. For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness. I will remember their sins and lawless deeds no more."
Heb. 8:8-12 (Jer. 31:31-34)

If the law is written in persons heart, then he wants to live accordingly. That leads to righteous actions. But, the righteous actions are not the reason for being counted righteous, it is the change that happened by the words that makes one righteous.

[JehovahsWitness]

Jesus says:

Don't think that I came to destroy the law or the prophets. I didn't come to destroy, but to fulfill.

Did you read the explanarion of this verse ?



Did Jesus not say he had not come to destroy the law [Mat 5:17] ?
viewtopic.php?p=1153894#p1153894

[JehovahsWitness]

...I believe the law is written in persons heart.

Which law ...are you refering here to the mosaic law?

..., "That I will make a new covenant ...

What is the new covenant ?

LUKE 22:20

Also, he did the same with the cup after they had the evening meal, saying: “This cup means the new covenant by virtue of my blood, which is to be poured out in your behalf

Did you know that Jesus instigated a "

• new covenant"

?

• If the "former" Mosiac covenant had laws could it be that the new covenant that Jesus instigated also has laws ?

• Could it be that the laws of Jesus "new covenant" are superior to the the laws in the old former Mosaic covenant ?

• If Jesus law is better than the Mosaic law and could it be that the new law replaces the old ?

[JehovahsWitness]

This is the history of the generations of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless among the people of his time. Noah walked with God.
Gen. 6:9

So how can these two scriptures be harmonised ...

ECCLESIATES 7:20

For there is no righteous man on earth who always does good and never sins

And how does this relate to the scriptures that speak lf the mosaic law being obsolete ?