Resurrection

[Athetotheist]

As I understand Christian doctrine, it says that every human being who dies is to be physically resurrected with the bodies of the righteous being perfected for existence in paradise and the bodies of the unrighteous being cast into hell.

Suppose there is a pair of conjoined twins who share the same body from the neck down. When they die, one of them is a Christian and the other is not. Which of them gets the body in the resurrection?

[tam]

Peace to you!

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #1]

Interesting question.

Without getting into a debate on what "Christian doctrines" state (since not all hold to the doctrine of 'hell'), I would suggest that they are each resurrected into their own body. That any 'error' in the flesh that had led to the lack of physical separation or development of individual bodies would be healed. So this would not be an issue.

(that being said, the blood of the lamb saves entire households, just as the blood of the lamb protected the entire household of an Israelite when Death passed over Egypt; so again it might not be an issue... but that might be another topic altogether)


Peace again to you!

[Athetotheist]

Peace to you!

[Replying to Athetotheist in post #1]

Interesting question.

Without getting into a debate on what "Christian doctrines" state (since not all hold to the doctrine of 'hell'), I would suggest that they are each resurrected into their own body. That any 'error' in the flesh that had led to the lack of physical separation or development of individual bodies would be healed. So this would not be an issue.

(that being said, the blood of the lamb saves entire households, just as the blood of the lamb protected the entire household of an Israelite when Death passed over Egypt; so again it might not be an issue... but that might be another topic altogether)


Peace again to you!

How could such an "error" be "healed" without an entirely new body being created?

And if the blood of Jesus saves entire households, what need is there for any Christian to evangelize relatives? As long as there's one Christian in the family, shouldn't the whole bunch go to heaven?

[unknown soldier]

As I understand Christian doctrine, it says that every human being who dies is to be physically resurrected with the bodies of the righteous being perfected for existence in paradise and the bodies of the unrighteous being cast into hell.

That's what the Bible says although it's often denied by those who want to make Christ and Christianity look good.

Suppose there is a pair of conjoined twins who share the same body from the neck down. When they die, one of them is a Christian and the other is not. Which of them gets the body in the resurrection?

I suppose the Christian twin will get the body while the unbelieving twin will suffer eternal perdition. So it's one way to separate conjoined twins, but I must wonder why God created them that way to begin with.

Anyway, the writers of the New Testament didn't seem to think too much about these kinds of difficulties. They seem to be unaware that not everybody fits their dogma. An example of a person who doesn't fit would be a person born with severe cognitive limitations who is simply unable to believe in Christ or even know who he is supposed to be. Would she be damned because she is an "unbeliever"? I'm guessing that Christian apologists will make something up that's not in the Bible to save their beliefs from this problem. They might say that God won't send such people to hell saying that one must have a "brain of accountability" to be judged as a person deserving hell.

Isn't that weird? Brain disfunction can guarantee you eternal paradise.

[unknown soldier]

Without getting into a debate on what "Christian doctrines" state (since not all hold to the doctrine of 'hell'), I would suggest that they are each resurrected into their own body. That any 'error' in the flesh that had led to the lack of physical separation or development of individual bodies would be healed. So this would not be an issue.

I've often wondered why God doesn't correct his "errors in the flesh" now rather than wait until the resurrection. For that matter, why does he goof to begin with?

Another explanation for congenital deformities is that we are all the product of unconscious and very imperfect natural forces that do not and cannot care if we are born "perfect" or not.

(that being said, the blood of the lamb saves entire households, just as the blood of the lamb protected the entire household of an Israelite when Death passed over Egypt; so again it might not be an issue... but that might be another topic altogether)

The "blood of the lamb" can split up families too which is what Christ reputedly said he would do. It's one prophecy of his that did come to pass.

[DavidLeon]

As I understand Christian doctrine, it says that every human being who dies is to be physically resurrected with the bodies of the righteous being perfected for existence in paradise and the bodies of the unrighteous being cast into hell.

Suppose there is a pair of conjoined twins who share the same body from the neck down. When they die, one of them is a Christian and the other is not. Which of them gets the body in the resurrection?

Each would be counted as a separate body.

In reality Christian doctrine only effects what takes place currently in the specific Christian congregation where that doctrine resides. And possibly the American CIA (Central Intelligence Agency otherwise known as Christians In Action) and GOP (Grand Old Party otherwise known as the Republican Party).

So what happens in the actual resurrection will in all likelihood differ substantially from Christian doctrine because Christian doctrine has been corrupted by apostacy. Hell, for example, is a pagan teaching adopted long after Christ. Hell is an Old English word meaning to cover or conceal and originally was correctly translated from Hebrew and Greek words meaning the common grave. It has also been translated incorrectly from the Greek words Gehenna and Tartarus. See link on Hell above.

Since the wage of sin is death, then upon death we are acquitted or freed from our sins. (Romans 6:8) There is also a resurrection of the unrighteous as well as the righteous. (Acts 24:15) I believe this to mean that those throughout time who haven't been introduced to the resurrection promise are resurrected and given that introduction. If they decide through their actions to reject the resurrection then they suffer what is called the second death, from which there is no further resurrection hope. (Revelation 20:10, 14, 15; 21:8; Matthew 25:41)

Its my understanding that we basically judge ourselves. If someone is presented with or aware of God and his resurrection promise and that person rejects it there is no need for judgment. If someone puts their faith in apostate Christian doctrine they judge themselves as upholding the traditions of men which offers no real resurrection.

When Jesus died for our sins he gave his body (his blood, soul, life) as a ransom sacrifice to free us of our sins. When you sacrifice something you can't take it back. Since this sacrifice can't have been taken back Jesus was resurrected in a new body similar to the former. This is why some of his followers didn't recognize him, mistaking him for the gardener. Burial places had gardeners who tended the grounds. Likewise we are resurrected in new bodies, not our former bodies. (1 Corinthians 15:35-45; John 20:14-16; Luke 24:30-32)

[JehovahsWitness]

As I understand Christian doctrine, it says that every human being who dies is to be physically resurrected with the bodies of the righteous being perfected for existence in paradise and the bodies of the unrighteous being cast into hell.

Suppose there is a pair of conjoined twins who share the same body from the neck down. When they die, one of them is a Christian and the other is not. Which of them gets the body in the resurrection?

Lol.... it's rare post makes me laugh out loud but yours did ; we live in grim times and I take my laughs when available so I thank you for that.. Seriously though, I think most Christians believe God can resurrect a body free of any handicaps the individuel died with, including seperating cojoined twins to individual and completly healthy bodies.

How could such an "error" be "healed" without an entirely new body being created?

Well, I believe God is more than capable of creating an an entirely new body. After all, if the bible is to be believed, he created the first human body entirely out of dust. And when you think about it, bodies quickly begin to decompose after the person dies so all resurrected people will need entirely new bodies, whether they died physically impaired or not.

JW

[JehovahsWitness]

[Would ] a'person born with severe cognitive limitations who is simply unable to believe in Christ or even know who he is supposed to ... be damned because she is an "unbeliever"?

No, the bible say God will condemn only "the wicked". Someone incapable of thought, is by necessity incapable of intentional wickedness so such a person biblically would not be conndemned.

PROVERBS 2:22
As for the wicked, they will be cut off from the earth, And the treacherous will be torn away from it.

PSALMS 37:10, 11
Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more; You will look at where they were, And they will not be there. But the meek will possess the earth, and they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.

2 PETER 2:9

... unrighteous people to be destroyed on the day of judgment

All passages NWT

RELATED POSTS

What fate awaits those who do not come to honour Jesus through no fault of their own?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 451#851451

What does the bible mean when it speaks about ARMAGEDDON?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 289#865289

WHO will destroy the wicked at Armageddon ?
viewtopic.php?p=944434#p944434

To read more please go to other posts related to...

LIFE, THE CONDITION OF THE DEAD and ...RESURRECTION

[unknown soldier]

No, the bible say God will condemn only "the wicked". Someone incapable of thought, is by necessity incapable of intentional wickedness so such a person biblically would not be conndemned.

I suppose that depends on which Bible you cite. I see that The New World Translation skips Mark after 16:8. If we check The New Revised Standard Version, then verse 16 reads:

The one who believes and is baptized will be saved; but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

It seems obvious to me that what the "Bible" says depends on the version. Anyway, if we read John 3:18 (NRSV) it says:

Those who believe in him are not condemned; but those who do not believe are condemned already, because they have not believed in the name of the only Son of God.

I see no exceptions to these "unbelievers" who are condemned. People with cognitive limitations will be condemned to hell if we can trust what we are told.

Anyway, my main point here isn't really that the Bible writers say that people who are unable to believe will be condemned. My point is that the Bible's writers just did not think through what they were saying.

[JehovahsWitness]

No, the bible say God will condemn only "the wicked". Someone incapable of thought, is by necessity incapable of intentional wickedness so such a person biblically would not be conndemned.

I suppose that depends on which Bible you cite.

No not really. All the scripture I cited either use the word "wickedness" or "iniquity" (which is simply an marchais Word for wickedness".

There are links to various translations so boucan comparé, you will see there is little variation on the working.

Proverbe 2:22
https://biblehub.com/proverbs/2-22.htm

Psaume 37:10
https://biblehub.com/psalms/37-10.htm

2 Peter 2:9
https://biblehub.com/2_peter/2-9.htm