Paradise on Earth

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JehovahsWitness
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Post #1301

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote: Do note, however, that the sheep (from the sheep and the goats parable) inherit the Kingdom. So the "Kingdom" cannot refer ONLY to those who reign with Christ.

Do note however that "inherit the kingdom" means to be part of the kingdom arrangement. A kingdom comprises of a KING (ruler) + DOM: a domain (carrying the sense of that which is ruleed over). The sheep will be the earthly subjects in that arrangement.


JW
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Mar 19, 2020 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Post #1302

Post by tam »

JehovahsWitness wrote:
tam wrote: Do note, however, that the sheep (from the sheep and the goats parable) inherit the Kingdom. So the "Kingdom" cannot refer ONLY to those who reign with Christ.

Do note that "inherit the kingdom" means to be part of the kingdom arrangement (a kingdom comprises of a KING (ruler) + a domain (carrying the sense of “ruling over� or “having power of influence�). The sheep will be the earthly subjects in that arrangement.


JW

Yes, to be part of the Kingdom. Not as rulers, but as subjects.



Peace again to you.

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Post #1303

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote: A Christian is indeed a disciple of Christ but ALSO one who has been chosen and anointed with holy spirit.

The bible makes no such stipulation. The word Anointment/ anointing means to pour oil on something, a reference to the ancient Hebrew custom of anointing men to signal royal appontment. The expression "anointing with holy spirit" is usually mentioned in the context of a heavenly hope. There is no scripture that stipulates one must be "anointed" with spirit to qualify as a Christian.

Jehovahs Witnesses ignore those that like the Pharisees go beyond scripture.


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RELATED POSTS

Is that different than receiving/ having the holy spirit and being ANOINTED with holy spirit?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 24#1001124
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Mar 19, 2020 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Post #1304

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote:
Yes, to be part of the Kingdom. Not as rulers, but as subjects.

Yes, the sheep will be the subjects.; Christ and his (144,000) "brothers" will be the rulers (KINGS)

Two groups (1) rulers (2) subjects
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Post #1305

Post by tam »

Peace to you,
JehovahsWitness wrote:
tam wrote: A Christian is indeed a disciple of Christ but ALSO one who has been chosen and anointed with holy spirit.

The bible makes no such stipulation. The word Anointment/ anointing means to pour oil on something, a reference to the ancient Hebrew custom of anointing men to signal royal appontment.
Yes, that is the physical example... but the spiritual reality is to be anointed with holy spirit. The oil is the physical example of holy spirit.

As well,

Christ/Messiah = Anointed One/Chosen One.

Christians are chosen ones (anointed with holy spirit). And Christ is the One who chooses. (John 15:16; see also Matthew 22:14 "Many are called, few are chosen...")

The expression "anointing with holy spirit" is usually mentioned in the context of a heavenly hope.


There are not two different types of Christians who have two different hopes - that is indeed going beyond scripture. (in fact it contradicts "There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism.."; but most important, Christ never taught it)
There is no scripture that stipulates one must be "anointed" with spirit to qualify as a Christian.
All Christians were anointed with holy spirit. That IS the example that we have in what is written. The apostles, those at Pentecost, Cornelius and his household, etc. Christ - the word - means Anointed One, and Christian - the word - is derived from that.


There is not a different teaching in what is written.
Jehovahs Witnesses ignore those that like the Pharisees go beyond scripture.
By those standards, you should be ignoring the WTS.



Christ being Michael the arkangel goes beyond scripture; and Christ never taught it. Christians having two different hopes (some for earth and some for heaven) goes beyond what is written; and Christ never taught it - worse than that, the two-hope doctrine assists in getting people to disobey Christ (and obey men instead) when Christ commanded us to eat His flesh and drink His blood (and to keep doing this), and that anyone may do this, and that unless one does this, one has no life in oneself.

But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat and not die.I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.�


53 “Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day. 55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. 56 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them.


He does not teach that only some Christians may eat and others must not. Not in the passage above or anywhere else. And Christ is the One to whom God said to listen.

"This is my Son, my Chosen One. Listen to Him."



May anyone who wishes them be given ears to hear so as to get a sense of this truth from THE Truth: Christ Jaheshua, who, along with His Bride, says to YOU, "Come!" May anyone who thirsts and anyone who wishes "Come! Take the free gift of the water of Life!"


Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

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Post #1306

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote:
Jehovahs Witnesses ignore those that like the Pharisees go beyond scripture.
By those standards, you should be ignoring the WTS.
I dont come here for unsolicited advice thank you very much, what I do in my own time is my own concern.

Returning to the point, you are contradicting your own conclusion. By your own admisson anointing is spiritually associated with kingship yet there is a group of people that will not be kings. Logically those individuals will not be anointed. In any case please understand I am not interested in your interpretation of scripture. You don't seem to be able to produce a scripture (with the word anointed in it) that says one has to be anointed to be a Christian.

I think that rests my case,




JW
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Post #1307

Post by tam »

Peace to you,
JehovahsWitness wrote:
tam wrote:
Jehovahs Witnesses ignore those that like the Pharisees go beyond scripture.
By those standards, you should be ignoring the WTS.

Show me a scripture that says one has to be anointed to be a Christian (with the word anojnted in it) I am uninterested in your "interpretaton of gaps".



Can you show me a Christian in what is written who is not anointed? Can you give me an example from what is written of a Christian NOT eating or drinking because they had a different hope than other Christians (the earthly hope verses the heavenly hope)?




Peace again to you.

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Post #1308

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote:
There are not two different types of Christians

Did I say there were {quote} "two types of Christians"?


tam wrote:
Yes, to be part of the Kingdom. Not as rulers, but as subjects.
Emphasis MINE

I am saying there will be (1) rulers and (2) subjects.



JW
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
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"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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Post #1309

Post by tam »

Peace to you,
[Replying to post 1303 by JehovahsWitness]

Reurning to the point, you are contradicting your own conclusion.


I am not.
By your own admisson anointing is spiritually associated with kingship yet there is a group of people that will not be kings.


Yes. Non-Christians who are also invited into the Kingdom, as subjects of that Kingdom. These ones were not Christian (chosen and anointed with holy spirit), but they are still blessed on the basis of what they have done.
Logicallymthose individuals will not be anointed.
Indeed. I never stated otherwise.
In any case please understand I am not interested in your interpretation of scripture.



No need to take my word for it. If we are Christian (or even just disciples of Christ), then should it not be Christ we listen to?





Peace again to you, and to you all,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

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Post #1310

Post by JehovahsWitness »

tam wrote:
Logically those individuals will not be anointed.
Indeed. I never stated otherwise.
Good then there are individuals that are anointed and those that will not be anointed.

Unless you are suggesting that those that will not be anointed, are anointed now and will somehow be un-anointed in the future, there are on the earth now individuals who are anointed and others who are not (and will not be) anointed.

Now all you have to do is provide a scripture (with the word "anointed" in it) that says the latter cannot become Christians.



JW
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Mar 19, 2020 10:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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