Is atheism lacking?

[historia]

This is an oft made point on this forum, but one I want to explore in a bit more depth:

If you don't believe that God exists, then that itself is a belief.

I lack belief in god/gods. Lack of belief is quite clearly not a belief.

I think we can all appreciate the case where a person might be ignorant of a particular topic and thus have no beliefs about it. That seems straight-forward.

But, if a person previously believed in X but now no longer believes in X, while spending time on an online forum debating X, it seems less straight-forward (to me anyway) to say that they simply "lack" belief in X. Even if that person is merely contending that there is insufficient evidence (for them, at least) to believe in X, surely we must conclude that constitutes a belief about X.


Question for debate: Is it accurate to say that atheists debating the existence of God on an online forum lack belief in God (or gods), or is there a more accurate way to describe their beliefs vis-a-vis God (or gods)?

[brunumb]

"All of you who believe that there is a god go stand over there. You are hereby called theists. The rest of you are therefore atheists".

It's just a classification. In my opinion we can too easily get bogged down in the finer details of the thinking involved within both groups. You really have no burden to justify your position until you attempt to convince others that it is the correct one. Two cents worth?

[Bradskii]

So 'God exists' is the positive claim [rejected] by 'I don't believe it'.

If you said 'God doesn't exist' then I would respond 'Yes, that's a statement that I believe'.

I'm not sure what overarching point you wish for me to take away from this, or how this relates back to the points I've raised in the thread.

Sorry. I tried to make it as simple as I could.

[TRANSPONDER]

"All of you who believe that there is a god go stand over there. You are hereby called theists. The rest of you are therefore atheists".

It's just a classification. In my opinion we can too easily get bogged down in the finer details of the thinking involved within both groups. You really have no burden to justify your position until you attempt to convince others that it is the correct one. Two cents worth?

That's the best explanation of atheism I've heard. Anyone who is not a god (including God) - believer is an atheist.

And they are all going to hell

[Tcg]

"All of you who believe that there is a god go stand over there. You are hereby called theists. The rest of you are therefore atheists".

It's just a classification. In my opinion we can too easily get bogged down in the finer details of the thinking involved within both groups. You really have no burden to justify your position until you attempt to convince others that it is the correct one. Two cents worth?

That's the best explanation of atheism I've heard. Anyone who is not a god (including God) - believer is an atheist.

Indeed. It is astonishingly clear until some try to muddy the waters with Straw Man arguments. Thankfully this thread hasn't yet degenerated into a discussion as to whether or not rocks should be considered atheists. Those discussions are the perfect cure for insomnia.

ETA: This one doesn't provide much reason to stay awake either.


Tcg

[brunumb]

Thankfully this thread hasn't yet degenerated into a discussion as to whether or not rocks should be considered atheists.

Heaven forbid! There were countless posts about that back on the now defunct Amazon forum and they never achieved more than elevated blood pressure. Let's hope this thread has run its course.

[TRANSPONDER]

"All of you who believe that there is a god go stand over there. You are hereby called theists. The rest of you are therefore atheists".

It's just a classification. In my opinion we can too easily get bogged down in the finer details of the thinking involved within both groups. You really have no burden to justify your position until you attempt to convince others that it is the correct one. Two cents worth?

That's the best explanation of atheism I've heard. Anyone who is not a god (including God) - believer is an atheist.

Indeed. It is astonishingly clear until some try to muddy the waters with Straw Man arguments. Thankfully this thread hasn't yet degenerated into a discussion as to whether or not rocks should be considered atheists. Those discussions are the perfect cure for insomnia.

ETA: This one doesn't provide much reason to stay awake either.


Tcg

Oh, what a pity. I do a wonderfully spirited argument for rocks being atheist. It's all part of whether Babies are Theists from birth or whether they were atheists until somebody tells them about God.

[historia]

"All of you who believe that there is a god go stand over there. You are hereby called theists. The rest of you are therefore atheists".

It's just a classification.

Sure, but again my question is not about who should be classified as an atheist.

My question concerns the nature of atheist belief: If you don't believe that God exists, is that a belief?

[JoeyKnothead]

My question concerns the nature of atheist belief: If you don't believe that God exists, is that a belief?

"Is a nonbelief a belief" is a question I don't think any atheist has ever had to ask, least long as they wasn't on the pipe.

Lacking belief is, by definition, NOT A BELIEF.

I think this goes to show theists just don't understand how or why someone'd reject their unproven, unprovable beliefs.

[Tcg]

Lacking belief is, by definition, NOT A BELIEF.

Indeed. wiploc cleared that up for us:

"Not believing isn't the same as believing not."

Of course, both your eight words and wiploc's eight reveal such an obvious reality it's odd they need to be stated. But here you are stating them and here I am quoting wiploc.

________________________________________________

Jan - "Hey, did you notice our neighbor ain't got no dogs!"

Wally - 'Yeah, but what kind of a dog owner are they?'

Jam - "Say what now?"


Tcg

[historia]

Lacking belief is, by definition, NOT A BELIEF.

Sure, but as already noted in post #21, to hold an opinion or stance with regard to a proposition -- even if your opinion is to reject or not affirm the proposition -- is a belief. In that case you are not lacking a belief.

Jan - "Hey, did you notice our neighbor ain't got no dogs!"

Wally - 'Yeah, but what kind of a dog owner are they?'

Jam - "Say what now?"

That was just silly. This is not an apt analogy in any way shape or form.