What About the Sea Creatures?

[Skeptical]

I know that JWs believe in a Paradise on Earth. And I know that some of the Bible verses that they base their beliefs on are Genesis 1:28-30 in conjunction with Isaiah 11:6-9 and Revelation 21:1-4. However, I would like to ask JWs and other Christians who have the belief in paradise earth: What about the sea creatures?

Because even in the Bible, the dangerous and ferocious creature Leviathan was created by God according to Psalm 104:24-26. Plus, according to science, there are other dangerous and ferocious creatures that God created such as sharks. But in all fairness, I would like to post this 2 minute and 8 seconds video, which puts sharks in the best light possible.



However, if that was too long for you, I have this 51 second video, which features characteristics that only a Creator God could create. (Hebrews 3:4 and Revelation 4:11)



Therefore, are the scriptures that mention total peace in the human kingdom and the animal kingdom only referring to land creatures? And do those verses exclude the sea creatures? Because I don't quite get it.

But here is another example of the electric eel in this 2 minute and 25 second video, even though there are many, many more dangerous and predatory sea creatures such as this.

[Skeptical]

... Bible verses such as Psalm 104:21 and Job 38:39-41 paint a different picture ...

Psalm 104:21 and Job 38:39-41 describe animals as they exist today. Isaiah 11 is pointing forward and has its major fulfillment during the reign of the promised Messiah (compare verses 4).

But according to Hebrews 3:4 and Revelation 4:11, animals exist like that today because God made them that way, but why?

[JehovahsWitness]

But your answer leans into fictional territory because it doesn't make sense as to why God made them predators/carnivores in the first place.

Whether the bible promises are "fictional" is a matter of opinion, I do not happen to share yours. I believe I have already addressed the question of whether animals were created predators/carnivores.

Did God purpose for animals to be dangerous?
viewtopic.php?p=1029607#p1029607

Why did some animals become "wild"?
viewtopic.php?p=1029636#p1029636

Neither Hebrews 3:4 nor Revelation 4:11 actually say God made animals predators/carnivores/dangerous to humans. Both scriptures identify Jehovah (God) as the Creator so while all animals exist because of Him, evidently animal behaviour and morphology adapt according to their environment. This might explain how animals originally purposed to be harmless to humans (or even arguably herbivores or omnivores) may have become dangerous.

[Skeptical]

But your answer leans into fictional territory because it doesn't make sense as to why God made them predators/carnivores in the first place.

Whether the bible promises are "fictional" is a matter of opinion, I do not happen to share yours.

But when you avoid certain questions that I ask, then what else am I to believe? Like the question that I asked in my post #7:

Well, is there a reason why an omnipotent God made digestive systems of predatory animals carnivorous capable in the first place? Because that would answer a lot of questions for me.

I believe I have already addressed the question of whether animals were created predators/carnivores.

You haven't addressed those questions here. Therefore, why didn't you just refer me to your other threads at the beginning of this thread? But now I have to click on those links and read your answers from those other threads. Plus, I may bring some of those quotes from over there to this thread along with some new questions. However, if you choose to ignore certain questions, then what is the whole point to this section of the forum for JWs? Proselytization? Because like you had said, it kind of makes things appear as if, like you had said that all this is really just about "is a matter of opinion," even though it's being argued as being truth.

Did God purpose for animals to be dangerous?
viewtopic.php?p=1029607#p1029607

Why did some animals become "wild"?
viewtopic.php?p=1029636#p1029636

Neither Hebrews 3:4 nor Revelation 4:11 actually say God made animals predators/carnivores/dangerous to humans.

Now, you're avoiding this issue because in the OP, I specially asked:

Therefore, are the scriptures that mention total peace in the human kingdom and the animal kingdom only referring to land creatures?

And then in my post #5, I had to repeat that question because you hadn't answered it the first time:

So, is that a yes to my questions of: "are the scriptures that mention total peace in the human kingdom and the animal kingdom only referring to land creatures? And do those verses exclude the sea creatures?"

Also, you do know that other people besides us are reading this thread, and they are able to see what you are doing, don't you?

Both scriptures identify Jehovah (God) as the Creator so while all animals exist because of Him, evidently animal behaviour and morphology adapt according to their environment. This might explain how animals originally purposed to be harmless to humans (or even arguably herbivores or omnivores) may have become dangerous.

Once again, you are avoiding the issue of animals being dangerous to one another.

[Skeptical]

... Bible verses such as Psalm 104:21 and Job 38:39-41 paint a different picture ...

Psalm 104:21 and Job 38:39-41 describe animals as they exist today.

But wouldn't animals have always been that way?

[Skeptical]

But how do you know whether or not Isaish 11:6-7 is to be taken literally?

Because God's original purpose is presented in Genesis and the bible promises his word will come true.

GENESIS 1 :26

Then God said: “Let us make man in our image,+ according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth

GENESIS 9 :2

A fear of you and a terror of you will continue upon every living creature of the earth and upon every flying creature of the heavens, upon everything that moves on the ground and upon all the fish of the sea. They are now given into your hand

But wouldn't that be anatomically impossible? I.e, if you have any knowledge about the digestive systems of both carnivores and herbivores and understand how different those digestive systems are.

[JehovahsWitness]

...are the scriptures that mention total peace in the human kingdom and the animal kingdom only referring to land creatures?

No, I don't believe so. We will just have to wait and see but one thing is for sure, God promises peace in all his kingdom and his kingdom covers both the land and the sea .

ISAIAH 11:9

They will not cause any harm Or any ruin in all my holy mountain, because the earth will certainly be filled with the knowledge of Jehovah As the waters cover the sea.

PSALM 72:8-9 ASV
He shall have dominion also from sea to sea, And from the River unto the ends of the earth

GENESIS 1

Further, God blessed them, and God said to them: “Be fruitful and become many, fill the earth and subdue it, and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth.”

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[JehovahsWitness]

DO VERSES THAT SAY GOD MADE ALL THE ANIMALS MEAN GOD CREATED CERTAIN OF THEM ANIMALS TO BE DANGEROUS CARNIVORES THAT EAT EACH OTHER?


Bible verses such as Psalm 104:21, Job 38:39-41 , Hebrews 3:4 or Revelation 4:11 do not actually state God made animals predators/carnivores and dangerous to humans or each other. Such scriptures identify Jehovah (God) as the Creator so all animals exist because of Him but evidently animal behaviour and morphology can adapt according to their environment.

To illustrate : An adult human can become overweight. Even if he owes life to his parents and may continue to rely on them for food, his environment and choices may not reflect his parents original desire for him.

In a similar way, the animal kingdom are here by divine will and design but may not fully reflect how God wanted it to develop. .



Does the Watchtower magazine not say God created eagles originally to be carnivorous?
viewtopic.php?p=1124379#p1124379

When will land and sea creatures cease to be a threat to humans or each other?
viewtopic.php?p=1124146#p1124146

[JehovahsWitness]

But how do you know whether or not Isaish 11:6-7 is to be taken literally?

Because God's original purpose is presented in Genesis and the bible promises his word will come true.

GENESIS 1 :26

Then God said: “Let us make man in our image,+ according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth

GENESIS 9 :2

A fear of you and a terror of you will continue upon every living creature of the earth and upon every flying creature of the heavens, upon everything that moves on the ground and upon all the fish of the sea. They are now given into your hand

But wouldn't that be anatomically impossible? ...

LUKE 1 :37 ISV

Nothing is impossible with respect to any of God's promises

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Would it not be impossible for God anatomically adapt carnivores to herbivores?
viewtopic.php?p=1124286#p1124286

Did God originally create animals to kill and each each other?
viewtopic.php?p=1124287#p1124287

[JehovahsWitness]

DID GOD ORIGINALLY CREATE ANIMALS CARNIVORES TO BE DANGEROUS TO EACH OTHER?


The bible does not provide every detail about the land and sea creatures in the beginning, but there is every indication he did not. There is no indication of violence of any kind in the garden of Eden and even today, animals that are natural enemies can be raised to live peacefully together.



Indeed there are remarkable examples of observable symbiotic relationships today which arguably indicate God's original purpose was peaceful coexistence across the animal kingdom.


RELATED POSTS

Did God originally purpose for animals to be dangerous?
viewtopic.php?p=1029607#p1029607

Did God originally create animals to kill and each each other?
viewtopic.php?p=1124287#p1124287

Why did some animals become "wild"?
viewtopic.php?p=1029636#p1029636

Would it not be impossible for God anatomically adapt carnivores to herbivores?
viewtopic.php?p=1124286#p1124286

Do numerous scriptures not attribute violent carnivorous behaviours as being Gods will?
viewtopic.php?p=1124285#p1124285

Do the scriptures that mention peace with animals INCLUDE sea creatures?
viewtopic.php?p=1124284#p1124284

When will land and sea creatures cease to be a threat to humans or each other?
viewtopic.php?p=1124146#p1124146

[Skeptical]

But how do you know whether or not Isaish 11:6-7 is to be taken literally?

Because God's original purpose is presented in Genesis and the bible promises his word will come true.

GENESIS 1 :26

Then God said: “Let us make man in our image,+ according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth

GENESIS 9 :2

A fear of you and a terror of you will continue upon every living creature of the earth and upon every flying creature of the heavens, upon everything that moves on the ground and upon all the fish of the sea. They are now given into your hand

But wouldn't that be anatomically impossible? ...

LUKE 1 :37 ISV

Nothing is impossible with respect to any of God's promises

But that sounds like the logical fallacy of an Argument from authority:

An argument from authority (argumentum ab auctoritate), also called an appeal to authority, or argumentum ad verecundiam, is a form of argument in which the opinion of an authority on a topic is used as evidence to support an argument.

Also, keep in mind that the way you applied that verse is based upon your interpretation of that verse.

Plus, it still dodges my question as to why God created carnivorous animals with carnivorous digestive systems in the first place. Because that question cannot be ignored in the discussion of this topic.