He didnt do it.

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:26 pm

God didn't restore the lost tribes of the northern kingdom to their homeland as he expressly comments in this chapter of Ezekiel.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?s ... ersion=NIV
Why not?

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 2:49 pm

Peace to you postroad.

[Replying to post 29 by postroad]

From the quote:

...renewed the covenant...

Renewing a covenant is not the same as making a NEW covenant, is it? It is just a renewal of the same covenant that they (Judah) had broken. A renewed vow to keep that previous covenant they had previously broken.

The new covenant is the one made through Christ.

Peace to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:03 pm

postroad wrote: Is these still a future event?

Isaiah 56:6-8New International Version (NIV)

6
And foreigners who bind themselves to the Lord
to minister to him,
to love the name of the Lord,
and to be his servants,
all who keep the Sabbath without desecrating it
and who hold fast to my covenant"

7
these I will bring to my holy mountain
and give them joy in my house of prayer.
Their burnt offerings and sacrifices
will be accepted on my altar;
for my house will be called
a house of prayer for all nations.

8
The Sovereign Lord declares"
he who gathers the exiles of Israel:
I will gather still others to them
besides those already gathered.

Zechariah 8:20-23New International Version (NIV)

20 This is what the Lord Almighty says: Many peoples and the inhabitants of many cities will yet come, 21 and the inhabitants of one city will go to another and say, Let us go at once to entreat the Lord and seek the Lord Almighty. I myself am going. 22 And many peoples and powerful nations will come to Jerusalem to seek the Lord Almighty and to entreat him.

23 This is what the Lord Almighty says: In those days ten people from all languages and nations will take firm hold of one Jew by the hem of his robe and say, Let us go with you, because we have heard that God is with you.

Well, people are being gathered now; granted holy spirit; the Body of Christ is being built up now; some from Israel (physical Israel) in Christ are also being sealed (from the 144 000 in the book of Revelation).

So the above is ongoing - people being gathered, people being part of the new covenant; people inviting others to come with them.

But Christ has not yet returned to gather them UP, or yet returned to establish His Kingdom upon the earth.

Peace again to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:16 pm

[Replying to post 32 by tam]

The text seems to indicate a continuation of ritual and temple worship as does the following. is this correct IYO.

Isaiah 66:22-24New International Version (NIV)

22 As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me, declares the Lord, so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me, says the Lord. 24 And they will go out and look on the dead bodies of those who rebelled against me; the worms that eat them will not die, the fire that burns them will not be quenched, and they will be loathsome to all mankind.

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:31 pm

[Replying to post 33 by postroad]

Does it actually state anything about ritual or temple worship? Or does it simply state that worship will continue?

Peace again,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:40 pm

[Replying to post 34 by tam]

Their burnt offerings and sacrifices
will be accepted on my altar;
for my house will be called
a house of prayer for all nations.

A little more context.

Isaiah 66:19-23New International Version (NIV)

19 I will set a sign among them, and I will send some of those who survive to the nations"to Tarshish, to the Libyans[a] and Lydians (famous as archers), to Tubal and Greece, and to the distant islands that have not heard of my fame or seen my glory. They will proclaim my glory among the nations. 20 And they will bring all your people, from all the nations, to my holy mountain in Jerusalem as an offering to the Lord"on horses, in chariots and wagons, and on mules and camels, says the Lord. They will bring them, as the Israelites bring their grain offerings, to the temple of the Lord in ceremonially clean vessels. 21 And I will select some of them also to be priests and Levites, says the Lord.

22 As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me, declares the Lord, so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me, says the Lord.

Is it not implied in the language indicating that worship will be at a location to which people will travel and the appointing of priests and Levites?

Zzyzx · Post by **Zzyzx** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 3:55 pm

.

tam wrote: Well, people are being gathered now; granted holy spirit; the Body of Christ is being built up now; some from Israel (physical Israel) in Christ are also being sealed (from the 144 000 in the book of Revelation).

100 Billion estimated as the number of people who have lived on Earth. http://www.prb.org/Publications/Article ... Earth.aspx

100 Billion divided by 144 Thousand = 1 per 700,000 (approaching one in a million)

Present world population a little over 7 billion. Thus, the current saved number about 1,000 worldwide. Competition to earn one of the few tickets to heaven and to get through the gate must be fierce.

tam · Post by **tam** » Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:33 pm

Zzyzx wrote: .
tam wrote: Well, people are being gathered now; granted holy spirit; the Body of Christ is being built up now; some from Israel (physical Israel) in Christ are also being sealed (from the 144 000 in the book of Revelation).
100 Billion estimated as the number of people who have lived on Earth. http://www.prb.org/Publications/Article ... Earth.aspx

100 Billion divided by 144 Thousand = 1 per 700,000 (approaching one in a million)

Present world population a little over 7 billion. Thus, the current saved number about 1,000 worldwide. Competition to earn one of the few tickets to heaven and to get through the gate must be fierce.

The 144 000 are just those who are reserved from literal (physical) Israel. 12 000 from each of the twelve tribes listed in Revelation. That is what the script states.

But the Great Crowd also written about in Revelation is a great crowd that no one can count. Because this number is not set.

So there are many more than just the 144 000 who are in Christ, who rule with Christ. More than just the 144 000 from literal Israel can be among those in Christ as well, as part of the great crowd... but 144 000 are specifically reserved and sealed. That number is set.

Both the 144 000 from Israel AND the rest of the Great Crowd (from every tribe, nation and tongue)... make up those who will be kings and priests with Christ during the millennial reign.

I cannot prove that to you, though I can show you it from scripture. But your comment was based on my comment about the 144 000, so I thought it best to clarify what I meant.

(In addition to that, there are also the sheep who are invited into the Kingdom on the basis of the good they did to even the least of Christ's brothers. These ones are not Christian. They are people from the nations who show that they have the law (of love) written upon their hearts, and so NATURALLY do the requirements of that law. These are the subjects of that Kingdom; and they are also given eternal life. That is a different thread perhaps.)

Peace to you Z!
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

tam · Post by **tam** » Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:31 pm

postroad wrote: [Replying to post 34 by tam]

Their burnt offerings and sacrifices
will be accepted on my altar;
for my house will be called
a house of prayer for all nations.
A little more context.

Isaiah 66:19-23New International Version (NIV)

19 I will set a sign among them, and I will send some of those who survive to the nations"to Tarshish, to the Libyans[a] and Lydians (famous as archers), to Tubal and Greece, and to the distant islands that have not heard of my fame or seen my glory. They will proclaim my glory among the nations. 20 And they will bring all your people, from all the nations, to my holy mountain in Jerusalem as an offering to the Lord"on horses, in chariots and wagons, and on mules and camels, says the Lord. They will bring them, as the Israelites bring their grain offerings, to the temple of the Lord in ceremonially clean vessels. 21 And I will select some of them also to be priests and Levites, says the Lord.

22 As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me, declares the Lord, so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me, says the Lord.
Is it not implied in the language indicating that worship will be at a location to which people will travel and the appointing of priests and Levites?

Yes, but not necessarily in the way that you are thinking. The new heavens and the new earth are specific to what is written in the book of revelation; which has not yet occurred.

Burnt offerings and sacrifices are NOT referring to literal sacrifices because that ended with Christ.

So when burnt offerings and sacrifices are referred to, one might want to remember what God said about the kind of fasting he desired:

"Is not this the kind of fasting I have chosen: to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke, to set the oppressed free and break every yoke?

Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter-- when you see the naked, to clothe them, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?

Then your light will break forth like the dawn, and your healing will quickly appear; then your righteousness will go before you, and the glory of the LORD will be your rear guard.

Then you will call, and the LORD will answer; you will cry for help, and he will say: Here am I."

In the passage that you quoted specifically, the offerings are of people, yes... but not people to be killed. They are the people being gathered. Recall that Christ said to go and make disciples of all nations? Recall also that He said "many are called; few are chosen"... so some of those who are called are also chosen (anointed with holy spirit) and are made into priests (king-priests who rule with Christ for the thousand years)

Ceremonial clean vessels would then refer to those who have been washed clean in the blood of the lamb, yes?

As for God's house - that is not made of bricks or mortar. It helps to understand that the examples that we have been given - the temple construct, etc, the items in the temple, the arrangement of priests, etc - are physical examples of spiritual realities.

For example: the Holy Place in the temple represents the Holy One (Christ). The Most Holy Place in the temple represents the Most Holy One (God). One must pass through the Holy Place (Christ) first, in order to reach the Most Holy Place (God). Just as Christ said, "no one comes to the Father except through me."

Hold everything up to the light that is Christ. He is the Teacher. He is the Truth. He is the One who opened the scriptures to His apostles.

Peace again to you, and to your house (which means your loved ones),
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

rikuoamero · Post by **rikuoamero** » Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:39 pm

[Replying to post 35 by postroad]

and I will send some of those who survive to the nations"to Tarshish, to the Libyans[a] and Lydians (famous as archers), to Tubal and Greece, and to the distant islands that have not heard of my fame or seen my glory. They will proclaim my glory among the nations.

I would believe this was an actual prophecy...if the people doing this, the people going out to proclaim God's glory...did so having no previous knowledge or belief of this god.
In other words, it cannot be a self-fulfilling prophecy. It would have to not be the case that Jews read this in their sacred texts, believed this to be a command from God and set out to do as they believed he commanded, so 'fulfilling' the prophecy.
If I write down in 2016 that my sons will one day go to college in 2026, and I prepare them in the ten years before then, save up and such...is that a case of divine prophecy, if my sons do indeed go to college?

postroad · Post by **postroad** » Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:59 pm

[Replying to post 38 by tam]

So we have the concept of the NT interpreting the OT?

Basically insisting that much of the OT isn't literal but rather spiritually written?

Who decides what is literal and what is spiritual truth?

Can the NT be interpreted in the same way and can we expect a further progression of revelation through new scriptures in the future?