can you be Christian and bI?

[rapture101]

i know this sounds weird.One of the people I go to school with asked me this questian.So I became a little weird about it.I couldnt find the amswer.So what are your oppions?

[methylatedghosts]

I dont make the Law. I obey no matter how hard it may be for my own good. There is no way anyone can circumvent or oppose Gods Law yet remain in His kingdom. Why delude yourself? Read the bible and find out if what I am saying is the truth.

I have read the bible, and found for myself, that although some things in it may have happened, it isn't all truth as far as I can see.

In reality, I think we are much further ahead than you in the tolerance of other people and their sexual orientations.

I disagree. In reality, youre backward not progressive.

How about having sex with animals? Is this also ok? How about asking your govt. to legalise this too?

How in the world is allowing equality for all people, regardless of sexual orientation backwards?

Sex with animals is different, it is engaging in sexual acts with members of different species. How many animals do you see doing that? You DO see some species doing homosexual activities though, so why is it so unnatural for humans?

What does it matter whether someone is gay or not? God's system is very simple to go with. Experience, experience, experience.

Do you care whether your next door neighbour is gay or not?

A persons sexual orientation is his own business, they say. How I wish this was so. The bible says that the sins of a people desolate their land, destroy their country.

I don't see this as destroying this country, it is welcoming people regardless of who they are and choose to be regarding sex and prostitution.

Now, what my neighbour does affects me, right? Good or bad. Why should I suffer for my neighbours sin ? If I am going to suffer for my neighbours sin, you can bet I will go after his hide. Yes, I do care if my neighbour is a gay or a terrorist or a child molester or anything that acts against the good of society.

I still don't see how your neighbour being gay can affect you in any way. Just because he or she is gay doesn't mean he's out to target you. How will YOU suffer for it? Someone being gay is not against the "good of society". Gay people are just as law-abiding as straight people.

Really? Times have changed, so Gods rules changed too? Can you drink blood ? Can you eat animal fat ? Can you rape ? Can you take another mans wife ? Can a father sleep with his daughter ? Can you sleep with your mother? b/c times have changed and rules change along with time? The answer will show you that Gods Laws are perpetual. Immutable, unchangeable.

Agree. Gods laws have never changed - there never were any, so why change that. What reason is there for these laws?[/quote]
You contradict yourself when you say Gods laws have never changed and then you turn around and say there never were any. [/quote]

This is not a contradiction. If God never had laws, and there still are none, his laws have not changed.

The reason for these Laws?
The human specie is created to live with Father God in heaven. Sin caused the Law to be given in black and white. The Law, therefore, divides righteousness from sin in a clear cut way. God is systematic and orderly. Satan has no-system. Disobedience to the Law, automatically by default, places a person in the dark kingdom.

I agree that humans are here to experiences being with god. But what I don't get is that we need rules to do so. Rules allow us to stop thinking for ourselves - it's just so much easier to obey. True free will would let us do whatever we wished and there being no retributions from god. No rules is what people are afraid of. This means that they have to look at every situation and think for themselves, rather than blindly following orders and rules.

A parent does not care one way or another what his/her children do to play. Is it a matter of consquence whether they play tag, hide-and-seek or pretend? No, because you know you have placed the child in a safe environment. Would god put us in an "unsafe" environment? No. Not for spiritual advancement - only physical. But what does the physical side matter if you have 2nd, 3rd, or even 86th chances?

[topaz]

I have read the bible, and found for myself, that although some things in it may have happened, it isn't all truth as far as I can see.

First, we must know who gave us the bible. Would God lie ? Would a prophet lie and say something else that God didnt say ? Isaiah, Jeremiah, Moses, Based on these questions, I take the bible as Gods Word b/c God claims it as His word. I believe God. God would not allow lies into His Holy Book. That is why only certain versions of the Bible are reliable.

Where in the bible isn't all truth as far as I can see ? Let me know.

How in the world is allowing equality for all people, regardless of sexual orientation backwards?

Equality for women, this I understand. Homosexuals would be better off doing their own thing than to demand legal rights. From the beginning of time till now, no govt. has been so openly audacious against God. This to me, is not an issue of equality but a challenge to Gods Law. You see it as equal rights I see it as challenging Gods Law. Being lawless, to me, is a backward step.

You DO see some species doing homosexual activities though, so why is it so unnatural for humans?

It is interesting that you equate yourself to an animal. It is needless to argue that if animals can do it, so can the human specie. Why dont you compare yourself with angels instead ? Man is made in the image of God, animals are not. You testify to the truth in scripture that says we must focus on the high spiritual things of God. Otherwise, the mind tends to go downwards, into darkness.

I still don't see how your neighbour being gay can affect you in any way. Just because he or she is gay doesn't mean he's out to target you. How will YOU suffer for it? Someone being gay is not against the "good of society". Gay people are just as law-abiding as straight people.

As I said, homosexuals should just do their own thing instead of clamouring for legal rights. Legalising gay marriage impacts the country. Agriculture suffer when there is no rain, for example, I will just have to wait and see what God will do to your country. Yes, gay people are just like us, law-abiding folks except that they bring an abominable law into existence to magnify this sin that will destroy society.

This is not a contradiction. If God never had laws, and there still are none, his laws have not changed.

If God never had laws then there is no law to change NOT his laws have not changed meaning there are laws but these have not changed. I thought english is your mother-tongue.

True free will would let us do whatever we wished and there being no retributions from god.

Let me see you give your child true free will to do w/ever he please and bear no retributions from you when he plays with fire that will burn the house and neighbouring houses into ashes. With true free will, let your child rape you and steal from you and does w/ever he wants with you. I dont think you know what youre saying.

Dont tell me you do not have a child. This is a hypothetical scenario based on your words.

[bernee51]

I take the bible as Gods Word b/c God claims it as His word.

Perhaps a few lessons in logic would help you understand what a circular argument is.

Where does god claim it is his word - in the bible of course.

Where in the bible isn't all truth as far as I can see ? Let me know.

Talking snakes. men living in fish, the dead rising up...to name a few.

How in the world is allowing equality for all people, regardless of sexual orientation backwards?

I see it as challenging Gods Law...

I see it as religious bigotry and prejudice.

It is interesting that you equate yourself to an animal.

Why? We are animals - part of the biosphere. If we understood this we would not be in the environmental mess we are in today.

Why dont you compare yourself with angels instead ?

Because they don't exist. It would be the same as comparing myself with Santa.

As I said, homosexuals should just do their own thing instead of clamouring for legal rights.

I thought "All men are equal under god" actually meant something.

Legalising gay marriage impacts the country. Agriculture suffer when there is no rain, for example,...

Huh? What a glorious non-sequitor.

I dont think you know what youre saying.

More pots and kettles here than a hotel kitchen.

[Madeline]

What does the bible say? God says that fags will not inherit the Kingdom of God! So how can a gay person be a Christian? they can't!

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate (HOMOSEXUALS), nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. [1 Corinthians 6:9,10]


Love,
Madeline

[methylatedghosts]

First, we must know who gave us the bible.

Philosophers and historians.

Would God lie ?

No.


[quoteWould a prophet lie and say something else that God didnt say ?[/quote]
That's assuming god said something to him. But then, probably not. BUT translations and retellings change the original message.

Where in the bible isn't all truth as far as I can see ? Let me know.[/quote]

Adding to what bernee said: hares, according to bible, are ruminants/chew their cud. Anyway, wrong thread for this.... lets move this to the "Is the bible a work of god" thread.

It is interesting that you equate yourself to an animal. It is needless to argue that if animals can do it, so can the human specie. Why dont you compare yourself with angels instead ? Man is made in the image of God, animals are not. You testify to the truth in scripture that says we must focus on the high spiritual things of God. Otherwise, the mind tends to go downwards, into darkness.

I compare not only myself, but you also as with everyone to animals, because we all evolved from pretty much the same thing, and we are classified as part of the primate family. Take bonobo(sp?) monkeys. They are genetically very close to humans. They have ALOT of sex - including gay sex, and they hardly fight, like chimpanzees do.


As I said, homosexuals should just do their own thing instead of clamouring for legal rights. Legalising gay marriage impacts the country. Agriculture suffer when there is no rain, for example, I will just have to wait and see what God will do to your country. Yes, gay people are just like us, law-abiding folks except that they bring an abominable law into existence to magnify this sin that will destroy society.

If God never had laws then there is no law to change NOT his laws have not changed meaning there are laws but these have not changed. I thought english is your mother-tongue.

You know what I mean.

Let me see you give your child true free will to do w/ever he please and bear no retributions from you when he plays with fire that will burn the house and neighbouring houses into ashes. With true free will, let your child rape you and steal from you and does w/ever he wants with you. I dont think you know what youre saying.

Dont tell me you do not have a child. This is a hypothetical scenario based on your words.

I said "A parent does not care one way or another what his/her children do to play. Is it a matter of consquence whether they play tag, hide-and-seek or pretend? No, because you know you have placed the child in a safe environment. Would god put us in an "unsafe" environment?"

I'm not talking about fire and burning down houses. Then the child was not put in a safe environment. I don't think you know what I'm saying.

I am linking this to god putting us in a safe environment. You should read more carefully. (not saying that I don't need to before you retort)

[topaz]

I take the bible as Gods Word b/c God claims it as His word.

Perhaps a few lessons in logic would help you understand what a circular argument is.

Where does god claim it is his word - in the bible of course.

Where in the bible isn't all truth as far as I can see ? Let me know.

Talking snakes. men living in fish, the dead rising up...to name a few.

You forgot, a talking donkey balaam. So you think all these are lies, illogical ? God being God, can do anything. Is this also illogical ? When you speak to your pet dog and he understands you .. is this illogical ?

I believe that animals can speak our language if God wants it so. I believe Jonah was in the whale for 3 days and 3 nights and didnt suffocate to death in there. Yes, I also believe in all the miracles of Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

Ive seen a big miracle in my life and people with such mental limitations as yourself couldnt influence me one iota. Youre the one who is illogical, bernee.

How in the world is allowing equality for all people, regardless of sexual orientation backwards?

I see it as challenging Gods Law...

I see it as religious bigotry and prejudice.

It is foolish to challenge when you know you cannot win. How can man make a law that is biblically unlawful in the first place ? You cannot win this war against God. You are backward when you align yourself with the dark forces. Satan is dead meat. I wonder how on earth some people can still be on his side.

Why dont you compare yourself with angels instead ?

Because they don't exist. It would be the same as comparing myself with Santa.

Youre delusional. Poor thing.

As I said, homosexuals should just do their own thing instead of clamouring for legal rights.

I thought "All men are equal under god" actually meant something.

You poor soul, youre so confused about everything. I dont know where to start.

Legalising gay marriage impacts the country. Agriculture suffer when there is no rain, for example,...

Huh? What a glorious non-sequitor.

Yes, what sin does is it desolates the land. My example no rain everybody is affected. Passing a law which is unlawful will only make Gods judgement more fiery. Youre inviting it. Woe.

I dont think you know what youre saying.

More pots and kettles here than a hotel kitchen.

Indeed bernee, you too dont know what youre saying. How can you align yourself with satan and say we seek God just as you do .. ? If you really seek God, then why are you challenging Him by claiming what is wrong to be right ? Youre playing semantics. This will not help you in your hour of need. Look at whats happening around in Asia. Tsunami, earthquake after earthquake, hurricanes, mud flood till it covers the rooftop, it is really scary God help you if you truly dont understand.

[methylatedghosts]

You forgot, a talking donkey balaam. So you think all these are lies, illogical ? God being God, can do anything. Is this also illogical ? When you speak to your pet dog and he understands you .. is this illogical ?

Talking to a dog and it understanding IS logical (if it's commands we're talking about) dogs learn that after much training, sit means sit. stay means stay. But it can't understand human language in conversation.

I believe that animals can speak our language if God wants it so. I believe Jonah was in the whale for 3 days and 3 nights and didnt suffocate to death in there. Yes, I also believe in all the miracles of Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

How in the world did Jonah not get killed by all the stomach acids - let alone drown in them? Impossible, illogical.

Ive seen a big miracle in my life and people with such mental limitations as yourself couldnt influence me one iota. Youre the one who is illogical, bernee.

What miracle was this? (honestly, I'm just curious)

It is foolish to challenge when you know you cannot win. How can man make a law that is biblically unlawful in the first place ?

Ummmm, by putting it in our law.....

It isn't about winning or losing. It isn't about who's right and who's wrong. It is about learning who you are in relation to everything else. It is taking what others say and working out for yourself whether or not it is true, not what a book or a guy in robes says

You cannot win this war against God. You are backward when you align yourself with the dark forces. Satan is dead meat. I wonder how on earth some people can still be on his side.

There is no war between god and I. secondly, there is no such thing as satan. This is only a mythology created to describe the creation of relativity.

Why dont you compare yourself with angels instead ?

Because they don't exist. It would be the same as comparing myself with Santa.

Youre delusional. Poor thing.

Yet, here you are believing in a "wrathful, loving god". THAT doesn't make a lick of sense.

As I said, homosexuals should just do their own thing instead of clamouring for legal rights.

I thought "All men are equal under god" actually meant something.

You poor soul, youre so confused about everything. I dont know where to start.

Who's to say you aren't? He doesn't seem confused to me at all, he seems to know exactly what he's talking about. You, however come across as confused in relation to this above quote.

Legalising gay marriage impacts the country. Agriculture suffer when there is no rain, for example,...

Huh? What a glorious non-sequitor.

Yes, what sin does is it desolates the land. My example no rain everybody is affected. Passing a law which is unlawful will only make Gods judgement more fiery. Youre inviting it. Woe.

How can legalising gay marriage "desolate the land? Please explain how and why and what the result will be.

Indeed bernee, you too dont know what youre saying. How can you align yourself with satan and say we seek God just as you do .. ? If you really seek God, then why are you challenging Him by claiming what is wrong to be right ? Youre playing semantics. This will not help you in your hour of need. Look at whats happening around in Asia. Tsunami, earthquake after earthquake, hurricanes, mud flood till it covers the rooftop, it is really scary God help you if you truly dont understand.

Earthquakes are not caused by god or satan. It is the shifting tectonic plates. Tunamis are caused by the earthquakes. Hurricanes are only very low pressure systems. A mud flood is caused by too much water added to the soil.

[bernee51]

You forgot, a talking donkey balaam. So you think all these are lies, illogical ? God being God, can do anything.

Ah the wonderful "god works in myserious ways" cop out. I was expecting that from you sooner.

Is this also illogical ?

Yes

When you speak to your pet dog and he understands you .. is this illogical ?

Ever heard of Pavlov? My dog does not 'undertand' me. It knows that when a bell rings he gets fed.

Besides this is a straw man argument. My dog does not talk back to me and advise mt wo eat the fruit from a particular tree.

I believe that animals can speak our language if God wants it so. I believe Jonah was in the whale for 3 days and 3 nights and didnt suffocate to death in there. Yes, I also believe in all the miracles of Jesus Christ of Nazareth.

But not in unicorns, the easter bunny or santa? Why not?

Ive seen a big miracle in my life...{/quote]
I see a miracle in my life every day

and people with such mental limitations as yourself couldnt influence me one iota.

Ad hominems don't win arguments - the only demonstrate the paucity of yours.

Youre the one who is illogical, bernee.

You sayiong so doens't make it so. In order to do that you have to use logic to show mine to be suspect. You have not done that. Al you have done is attack me personally. Calling me illogical or mentally limited is a cop out.

It is one often used by self proclaimed "true christians"(tm) such as yourself.

It is foolish to challenge when you know you cannot win.

Without challenge there is no growth. You should try it sometime.

I am not out to 'win'. I could care less that you believe the illogical. If it provides meaning and purpose in you liffe that is wonderful for you. That is the function of the translative religion you have attached yourself to.

How can man make a law that is biblically unlawful in the first place ? You cannot win this war against God.

I am not at war with your god. How can I be at war with a non-existent entity?

Youre delusional. Poor thing.

You saying so doesn't make it so.

Use some logic to prove it

You poor soul, youre so confused about everything.

Really - how so?

I dont know where to start.

And you call me confused. I am the one providing the argument - all you can say is "you're confused, your edelusional, you're illogical"

Ad hominems with no meat.

[topaz]

Hi meth

You talk of relativity, Einstein. Do you know that Einstein was a christian. Yes a messianic christian. How about that ?

So please don't give me all that crap explanation about tsunami, earthquake and all. God is bigger and deeper than science.

And ... don't you know that the bible says sin desolates the land ?

[McCulloch]

You talk of relativity, Einstein. Do you know that Einstein was a christian. Yes a messianic christian. How about that ?

Topaz, this one is news to me. Can you provide any supporting evidence to your claim that Albert Einstein, winner of the 1921 Nobel prize, who raised funds for Hebrew University of Jerusalem and who was offered the post of president of the Israeli government in 1952 was a Christian? Please do cite your references, there are quite a number of well researched biographies of this man.