A Question Unanswered, When in Church...

[POI]

During the last year or so of attending church, I was still reluctant to ask probing questions for fear of 'rocking the boat'. In the back of each chair were suggestion/question cards, which anyone could fill out and turn in... I asked the same question, about a dozen times, and never received any type of response.

For debate:

Why would an all knowing and all loving God ever place favor towards one specific race, the Jews?

[tam]

Peace to you,

Peace to you,

[Replying to Clownboat in post #113]

Just a warning POI. See Tam's signature line:
your servant and a slave of Christ,

slave
noun
a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.

Tam has no choice as she is owned by and has been forced to obey Christ.

How can the words of a slave be trusted when their obedience is being forced? Just something to keep in mind.

Come now. Not only is this purely ad hominem, as someone who claims to have once BEEN a Christian, you must know that what you just said is false. Christ does not FORCE anyone to serve and obey Him. We choose to do so out of love; just as He made Himself a least one (taking the form of a slave), to SERVE, even though He is the King and Heir of God. He gives His will over to His Father's will. Not because He is forced to do so. But because of His love for Father.

It is about serving and love. As one who claims to have once been a Christian, surely you knew this.



Peace again,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

slave
noun
a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.

Why do you claim to be a slave and then lament when it is pointed out?

No lamenting here.

And if you read my post, you know that is not what this is about.

How can you claim to be a slave while ignoring that a slave is forced into obedience?

How can you have once been a Christian, supposedly having read the NT, and not know what it means to be a slave of Christ?

I have supplied the definition for slave.

See above.

If you are not one, it would be wise to stop claiming to be one as it is an insult to actual humans suffering due to slavery.

See above.

You also need correction on an ad hominem.
ad ho-mi-nem
adjective
(of an argument or reaction) directed against a person rather than the position they are maintaining.

Your position is one that you are a slave.

It was ad hominem. Your 'argument' was against anything I said based purely on something personal about me, and it had nothing to do with the content of my posts, and nothing to do with the thread topic.

It's in every one of your posts. My words are directed at this position of yours.

Are you trying to suggest that the 'position' that is being referenced in that definition is a role... such as servant, slave, wife, CEO, supervisor, etc? Is that really the position you want to take here? (<-note the actual and intended meaning of the word position here... a point of view/argument Not your seated or standing position, not your position in a company, not your position in a room, not your position in the family as eldest or youngest.)

In case that is not clear enough:

Ad hominem attacks can take the form of overtly attacking somebody, or more subtly casting doubt on their character or personal attributes as a way to discredit their argument. The result of an ad hom attack can be to undermine someone's case without actually having to engage with it.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem

Perhaps English isn't your first language?

I think you know you got caught out.



Peace again.

[POI]

(Tam) As one who claims to have once been a Christian, surely you knew this.

(Me) I feel I need to interject here.... Even though it will take us off topic....

Your statement appears quite false. The term "Christian" is quite unspecified, being we have countless sub-denominations within, (3) major sects alone ---- (Catholics, Protestants, and (Eastern) Orthodox)....

I would think twice before I again attempted to offer up such a possible gaslighting....

[brunumb]

During that long period, the king of Egypt died. The Israelites groaned in their slavery and cried out, and their cry for help because of their slavery went up to God. God heard their groaning and he remembered his covenant with Abraham, with Isaac and with Jacob.
Exodus 2:23, 24

That really paints God as a doddering old fool who really hasn't got a clue about what is going on in his world.

[1213]

...

(Tam) Even in the verses that you are referring to, God gives His reason that they are not to rule harshly over their fellow Israelite: He purchased the Israelites for Himself. They belong to Him. He just rescued them OUT of slavery.

(POI) Why ONLY rescue Israelites from slavery? If God does not like slavery, rescue all. Again, we can refer to this 'god' favoring 'accidental properties'.

Ok, thanks for the clarification. This leads to question, have the others asked help from God, as the Jews did?

[POI]

...

(Tam) Even in the verses that you are referring to, God gives His reason that they are not to rule harshly over their fellow Israelite: He purchased the Israelites for Himself. They belong to Him. He just rescued them OUT of slavery.

(POI) Why ONLY rescue Israelites from slavery? If God does not like slavery, rescue all. Again, we can refer to this 'god' favoring 'accidental properties'.

Ok, thanks for the clarification. This leads to question, have the others asked help from God, as the Jews did?

This appears to be a silly question, for more than one reason:

1) I'm sure they all asked for help. I doubt anyone would want to be enslaved for life.
2) Would it be fair to say, that just because you are an Israelite, not all would genuinely pray to the same exact god anyways, right? Or further, some may not pray in a way which is pleasing to this one god.
3) And what if not all Israelites prayed for rescue? The Bible simply states to not treat Insraleites in the same way.
4) Since many of these Israelites will fall short of God's wishes, why base the criteria on the fact they are Israelites?

The point being, god granted special favor to Israelites, for the mere fact they are Israelites. As "AFG" has already pointed out, with his given (term) prior, God places favor, based upon "accidental properties." Not all Israelites will abide by his wanted commands. And yet, the Bible expresses that because they are Israelites, they are given special circumstances regardless. This is why I bring up (Lev. 25), for example.

[JehovahsWitness]

slave
noun
a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.

Most Christians when speaking of their servitude to God use the word "slave" in its biblical not its secular definition. Biblically a slave can be one that freely chooses to be obedient to his master out of love.

EXODUS 21: 5 Christian Standard Bible

"But if the slave declares, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I do not want to leave as a free man

[POI]

slave
noun
a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.

Most Christians when speaking of their servitude to God use the word "slave" in its biblical not its secular definition. Biblically a slave can be one that freely chooses to be obedient to his master out of love.

EXODUS 21: 5 Christian Standard Bible

"But if the slave declares, I love my master, my wife, and my children; I do not want to leave as a free man

Yea, well, ironically enough, the 'slave' might say this ONLY when they are duped. I doubt most 'slaves' were educated. I also doubt many 'slaves' were very well read in the bible, or any other documents, for that matter. It was not a necessary requirement for daily life. Such 'laws' were written and/or orchestrated by slave owners, and/or the free and the wealthy non-slaves. At minimum, it's not hard to infer such verses were at least influenced by such slave owners.

So once the single slave was given a wife, and they later had kids, is when the slave owner can then say... "Oh, BTW, I know we agreed to you leaving in 6-7 years and all, but your wife and kids stay with me, since I provided you a wife." (i.e.):

EXODUS 21:4 "If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the woman and her children shall belong to her master, and only the man shall go free." --> (Which is directly right before the verse you provided).

[1213]

...
The point being, god granted special favor to Israelites, for the mere fact they are Israelites. ...

Sorry, I don't think you have provided any good reason to believe so. Can you show even a single scripture from the Bible that supports your claim?

[POI]

...
The point being, god granted special favor to Israelites, for the mere fact they are Israelites. ...

Sorry, I don't think you have provided any good reason to believe so. Can you show even a single scripture from the Bible that supports your claim?

I already did that. You must not be paying attention.

[1213]

...
The point being, god granted special favor to Israelites, for the mere fact they are Israelites. ...

Sorry, I don't think you have provided any good reason to believe so. Can you show even a single scripture from the Bible that supports your claim?

I already did that. You must not be paying attention.

Sorry, I didn't find any scripture that supports your claim. Maybe you could show direct quote from the Bible that says: "special favor to Israelites, for the mere fact they are Israelites"?