What did Jesus create?

[snowbound]

It's my belief as well as the belief of many others that Jesus only created this 'earth' and this earth only. It's possible that he didn't even create this entire solar system, but God the Father did. God allowed Jesus to 'design' this planet and this planet only. I'm convinced that when we look up and see the trillions of 'suns' many of them have or likely have had inhabited 'earths' - and likely with humans on them. Possibly some of them have humans larger than us. Possible and in my view, likely the same.

No doubt God is still in the creation business. When this 'earth' reaches its end, God will create more 'earths' and my guess is they likely all FELL and needed a Savior. That Savior would likely be another fully human being like our Jesus was.

In my view it's illogical to believe we are the only human creation among trillions of stars AND trillions of galaxies.

https://www.thoughtco.com/galaxy-types- ... on-3072058

[bjs1]

Eventually I would like to address the argument at hand.

The argument is as follows in green:

What did Jesus create?

Do you agree that the green text above states the argument correctly? Yes or no?


In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. 3All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. (John 1:1-3)

Who created everything according to John 1:3? The Word!

Do you agree with that?

So far, so good.

Jesus is the Word made flesh and did not exist until John 1:14.

Here is where it falls apart. Saying that Jesus did not exist until he was made flesh contradicts the plain meaning of John chapter 1:14. (See post 11)

This would be like saying that my mother did not exist before I was born, because she had not yet become a mother.

The plain meaning of saying that Jesus is the Word made flesh is that Jesus has always existed as the eternal Word of God, and that in the incarnation he was made in human likeness.

[bjs1]

The scriptures are not God.

The scriptures are not God, but they are inspired (God-breathed). They are also considered authoritative in this sub-forum. There are other sub-forums on this site where the scriptures are not treated as authoritative. If you do not wish to treat the Bible as true, then please confine yourself to those forums.

[OneJack]

The scriptures are not God, but they are inspired (God-breathed).

God-breathed means 'allowed by God to be written; does it elevate the scriptures somehow to the place of God a bit?

They are also considered authoritative in this sub-forum.

God alone matters the most, doesn't He (God)? Is there any other, in your perception, who has the ultimate authority to declare anything authoritative other than God?

There are other sub-forums on this site where the scriptures are not treated as authoritative.

Do they commit any sin by that action of not treating the scriptures as authoritative?'

If you do not wish to treat the Bible as true, then please confine yourself to those forums.

There is no such rule in this forum that I'm aware of, is there?

[Capbook]

[[

Hi snowbound, are you ok?

[bjs1]

The scriptures are not God, but they are inspired (God-breathed).

God-breathed means 'allowed by God to be written; does it elevate the scriptures somehow to the place of God a bit?

God breathed: from the mouth of God.
The Bible is not God; it is God’s self-revelation.

They are also considered authoritative in this sub-forum.

God alone matters the most, doesn't He (God)? Is there any other, in your perception, who has the ultimate authority to declare anything authoritative other than God?

God does matter most. One of the values of the inspired scriptures is that God’s self-revelation is written down for all to see. It is not dependent on the emotions or interpretations of any one individual.

There are other sub-forums on this site where the scriptures are not treated as authoritative.

Do they commit any sin by that action of not treating the scriptures as authoritative?'

It is inconsiderate break the agreed upon rules. Such a lack of consideration and respect is contrary to love.

If you do not wish to treat the Bible as true, then please confine yourself to those forums.

There is no such rule in this forum that I'm aware of, is there?

Here are the guidelines for this sub-forum (my emphasis added):

In this subforum the canon of the Bible is considered authoritative with respect to the historical consensus of the canon's content. Therefore, the 66 books contained within all canons are considered more authoritative than deuterocanonical books. The latter may be presented in argumentation, but may also be challenged as authoritative. Furthermore, theological analysis should focus primarily on the level of canonical analysis. Criticism of sources, authorship, or redaction with the intent to discredit the authority of the canon are more appropriate for the Christianity and Apologetics subforum. However, such tools may be used to trace historical developments of doctrine or other subjects pertinent to theology. In other words, the Biblical books have theological authority because they are contained within the canon, regardless of any purportedly false claims to authorship and regardless of redactional interpolations. Therefore, wholesale dismissals of entire books of the Bible are not considered valid here. However, certain verses can be dismissed that are considered inauthentic by Biblical scholars and supported by Biblical criticism (such as the Johannine Comma) since such verses may be considered only spuriously canonical.

No single translation trumps another, and when differences of opinion arise regarding various translations, Hebrew and Greek sources will have a greater authority. Sticking to a single translation to prove your point, when the majority of translations disagree, is not allowed, and your point must then be proven by deferring to the original language in which it was written.

[OneJack]

The scriptures are not God, but they are inspired (God-breathed).

God-breathed means 'allowed by God to be written; does it elevate the scriptures somehow to the place of God a bit?

God breathed: from the mouth of God.
The Bible is not God; it is God’s self-revelation.

They are also considered authoritative in this sub-forum.

God alone matters the most, doesn't He (God)? Is there any other, in your perception, who has the ultimate authority to declare anything authoritative other than God?

God does matter most. One of the values of the inspired scriptures is that God’s self-revelation is written down for all to see. It is not dependent on the emotions or interpretations of any one individual.

There are other sub-forums on this site where the scriptures are not treated as authoritative.

Do they commit any sin by that action of not treating the scriptures as authoritative?'

It is inconsiderate break the agreed upon rules. Such a lack of consideration and respect is contrary to love.

If you do not wish to treat the Bible as true, then please confine yourself to those forums.

There is no such rule in this forum that I'm aware of, is there?

Here are the guidelines for this sub-forum (my emphasis added):

In this subforum the canon of the Bible is considered authoritative with respect to the historical consensus of the canon's content. Therefore, the 66 books contained within all canons are considered more authoritative than deuterocanonical books. The latter may be presented in argumentation, but may also be challenged as authoritative. Furthermore, theological analysis should focus primarily on the level of canonical analysis. Criticism of sources, authorship, or redaction with the intent to discredit the authority of the canon are more appropriate for the Christianity and Apologetics subforum. However, such tools may be used to trace historical developments of doctrine or other subjects pertinent to theology. In other words, the Biblical books have theological authority because they are contained within the canon, regardless of any purportedly false claims to authorship and regardless of redactional interpolations. Therefore, wholesale dismissals of entire books of the Bible are not considered valid here. However, certain verses can be dismissed that are considered inauthentic by Biblical scholars and supported by Biblical criticism (such as the Johannine Comma) since such verses may be considered only spuriously canonical.

No single translation trumps another, and when differences of opinion arise regarding various translations, Hebrew and Greek sources will have a greater authority. Sticking to a single translation to prove your point, when the majority of translations disagree, is not allowed, and your point must then be proven by deferring to the original language in which it was written.

The Bible being authoritative over and above our faith in God is what I’m referring to with my question.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #56]

@OneJack, my faith is based squarely on the Bible as God's inspired Word.

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #56]

@OneJack, my faith is based squarely on the Bible as God's inspired Word.

Well, you're the master of your soul; hope you'd be with the Lord when He returns and put everything in its proper order. My faith is based solely on the real and forever living Christ Jesus, who is beside all of us in a 24/7 watch mode for those who come to Him for their salvation and eternal life, though He is unseen yet.

[Capbook]

[Replying to OneJack in post #56]

@OneJack, my faith is based squarely on the Bible as God's inspired Word.

Well, you're the master of your soul; hope you'd be with the Lord when He returns and put everything in its proper order. My faith is based solely on the real and forever living Christ Jesus, who is beside all of us in a 24/7 watch mode for those who come to Him for their salvation and eternal life, though He is unseen yet.

Solely to your Jesus?
How about John 14:10,11 OneJack, your core belief is written in the Bible?

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #56]

@OneJack, my faith is based squarely on the Bible as God's inspired Word.

Well, you're the master of your soul; hope you'd be with the Lord when He returns and put everything in its proper order. My faith is based solely on the real and forever living Christ Jesus, who is beside all of us in a 24/7 watch mode for those who come to Him for their salvation and eternal life, though He is unseen yet.

Solely to your Jesus?
How about John 14:10,11 OneJack, your core belief is written in the Bible?

Put your faith only in the Lord, not in the bible.