Was Jesus relatively ignorant?

[marco]

Jesus had a lot to say on rules and behaviour but never made any useful comment on the state of knowledge around him. There is never a whisper of philosophy nor history nor suggested assistance with medicine. He showed no interest in the animal kingdom and displayed ignorance of botany. But he had read about Abraham and other Jewish heroes, and this seemed to be the full extent of his education.


Of course if he was no more than a rabbi, wide knowledge, while obviously useful, was not a necessity but would we regard as god-like somebody who was incapable of explaining some geometry or knew nothing of the rise of Rome? He seems to have used an unusual type of medicine to cure blindness, yet never thought of saying what it was. If the cure was miraculous, what was the purpose of the showmanship? It may have impressed the rabble then, but looks like trickery today.


So does Christ's apparent general ignorance reduce him to a mere preacher, very good with words?


Or do we simply say he was on a moral mission and all other things were irrelevant, despite the fact that here we are forced to involve ourselves in a variety of fields to get at truth?

[marco]

Jesus did not suggest that people, apparently possessed of demons, were maybe psychologically unwell. He seems to have met with an uncommon prevalence of possessed people and he went along with the idea that they had devils in them. Today he would be scorned or regarded as dangerous. The theatrical display of placing demons in the bodies of pigs aand then causing the pigs to be drowned is amusing today but would have seemed plausible in a more superstitious era. Trickery? Naivety? Under the sainted surface there may be many worms.

[Elijah John]

Jesus had a lot to say on rules and behaviour but never made any useful comment on the state of knowledge around him. There is never a whisper of philosophy nor history nor suggested assistance with medicine. He showed no interest in the animal kingdom and displayed ignorance of botany. But he had read about Abraham and other Jewish heroes, and this seemed to be the full extent of his education.


Of course if he was no more than a rabbi, wide knowledge, while obviously useful, was not a necessity but would we regard as god-like somebody who was incapable of explaining some geometry or knew nothing of the rise of Rome? He seems to have used an unusual type of medicine to cure blindness, yet never thought of saying what it was. If the cure was miraculous, what was the purpose of the showmanship? It may have impressed the rabble then, but looks like trickery today.


So does Christ's apparent general ignorance reduce him to a mere preacher, very good with words?


Or do we simply say he was on a moral mission and all other things were irrelevant, despite the fact that here we are forced to involve ourselves in a variety of fields to get at truth?

Jesus was a man of his times. An extraordinary man, inspiration to millions, spiritual leader, moral teacher, but still "just" a man.

Many historical Jesus sholars are skeptical of his purported miracles. Though some accept that he was a healer of some kind. If only for his embrace of the outcast, and his dismissal of divisive, ritual purity laws. That alone could have a theraputic effect on the recipient, a spiritual healing that leads to physical healing.

[JehovahsWitness]

He showed no interest in the animal kingdom ...

Jesus taught in a mainly rural community and many of his illustrations where drawn from nature. He specifically mentioned birds, fish, as well as domestic and wild animals, often refering to features of their habitat, behaviour and mannerisms.

Arguably this is evidence he took an interest in the animal kingdom.


JW













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[JehovahsWitness]

[Jesus] displayed ignorance of botany.

BOTANY

the scientific study of the physiology, structure, genetics, ecology, distribution, classification, and economic importance of plants.

the plant life of a particular region, habitat, or geological period.

By "ignorance" do you mean Jesus made statements that indicated he had absolutely no knowledge of plants particular to his region or "geological period"? If so could you provide some supporting evidence. If not could you please clarify your meaning.



PLEASE NOTE This post is not an invitation for my intelligence or command of the English language to be insulted. It is a request for additional information so that I can make a comprehensive response.

I am not claiming to be a botanist. I do not speak Latin.



Thank you


JW

[JehovahsWitness]

Jesus ... never made any useful comment on the state of knowledge around him.

What is considered "useful comment" is extremely subjective, what is "useful" to one person may be considered "useless" by another. "I love you" may be considered useless information to one person, but the lifeline that pulls someone else back from suicide . (Of course whether there is any use in saving a is itself subject to how (or indeed if) one values human life).

Given the above assessing the comments attributed to Jesus on the subjects of contemporary knowledge will by necessity be subjective. Jesus was a religious teacher who made many theological comments. For instance, Jesus numerous comments on the state of knowledge of God and worship around him. For an atheist such things as theology, worship and spirituality might be considered utterly without any use, for someone else those same comments might constitute the guiding light by which they live, improve or even save their lives.

In any case Jesus may be considered an ignorant chatterer of useless garbage, a spiritual visionary with life improving enlightenments ... or anything in between. I suspect where our jugement falls on this question says as much about us and our values as it does about the man himself.

["A mans greatness can be measured by what he leaves to grow, and whether he started others to think along fresh lines with a vigor that persisted after him. By this test Jesus stands first.


-- - H G Wells

"As a child, I received instruction both in the Bible and in the Talmud. I am a Jew, but I am enthralled by the luminous figure of Jesus the Nazarene." -


Albert Einstein, German-born scientist

"... the gospel indeed contains characters so great, so striking, so entirely inimitable, that their invention would be more astonishing than their hero.


-- Jean-Jacques Rousseau, Emile Or, On Education, p. 256

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[marco]

Jesus was a man of his times. An extraordinary man, inspiration to millions, spiritual leader, moral teacher, but still "just" a man.

He was reportedly good at preaching just as King Arthur was good at advocating chivalry. The flames of his influence were started by his biographers. He wrote nothing nor did Muhammad.

Many historical Jesus sholars are skeptical of his purported miracles. Though some accept that he was a healer of some kind. If only for his embrace of the outcast, and his dismissal of divisive, ritual purity laws. That alone could have a theraputic effect on the recipient, a spiritual healing that leads to physical healing.

But Christianity is built on theologies not on humanitarianism. It gets its strength from cathedrals and loud preachers. The humble Jesus is lost in the dark folds of modern Christianity.

[postroad]

[Replying to post 7 by marco]

What humble nature he had was a temporary condition in order to fulfill prophecy.

His true nature is different.


Luke 12:49-53 New International Version (NIV)

Not Peace but Division
49 I have come to bring fire on the earth, and how I wish it were already kindled! 50 But I have a baptism to undergo, and what constraint I am under until it is completed! 51 Do you think I came to bring peace on earth? No, I tell you, but division. 52 From now on there will be five in one family divided against each other, three against two and two against three. 53 They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law.

[JehovahsWitness]

Jesus had a lot to say on rules and behaviour but ..There is never a whisper of philosophy

This has got to be one of the most ludicrous statements I have read in a long time. PHILOSOPHY has been defined as ...

PHILOSOPHY
1.
the study of the fundamental nature of knowledge, reality, and existence, especially when considered as an academic discipline.
2.
a theory or attitude that acts as a guiding principle for behaviour.

While it is true there is no suggestion Jesus had studied in any academic institution and he did seem to deliberately communicate in language that was easily understood with a minimum of specialized jargon, to suggest that Jesus did not speak on the attitudes that "act as a guiding principle for behaviour" is I think utterly absurd. One does not have to spend much time reading the gospels to see Jesus spoke expensively about the source and nature of truth, existence and the influence these should have on morals and behaviour.

By that definition Jesus did more than have a whisper of philosophy, he had a clear and impressive call that is still being heard 2000 years after his death.






JW





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[marco]

Jesus taught in a mainly rural community and many of his illustrations where drawn from nature. He specifically mentioned birds, fish, as well as domestic and wild animals, often referring to features of their habitat, behaviour and mannerisms.

Arguably this is evidence he took an interest in the animal kingdom.

Yes I think he expressed contempt for dogs. A child having a panda as a doll does not make that child an expert zoologist so Jesus mentioning "camel" going through the eye of a needle indicates only that he knows the word. But you did say "arguably."